DotA2 - Original Thread

[Malthe]

The only time an ES should play that passive is if you're doing 4p1 with you just following your carry protecting them 24/7, in pubs you can quite easily get gold on your own inbetween fights.

ES was a lot stronger during 2-1-2 lanes, also due to pathing fissure is a lot weaker.. ES in dota1 was a lot higher priority for top level play, i hope valve fixes this somehow, or i hope the frog buffs him to make up for this.

[Raul]

If your game is that passive you should just stack neutrals and ulti them, easy way to get 500-600 gold if you know what you're doing.

Still feels incredibly boring. I'd rather play Timbersaw, Undying, Night Stalker, TA, Nyx, Storm Spirit, Lina, or Leshrac who can go make things happen by themselves. Half the games are pretty much lost when I play Earthshaker by the time I could have gotten blink up even by being really greedy. I realize his competitive niche: he fits in really well with a 4p1 composition and was really well suited to the c. 2010 Chinese DotA competitive scene (along with vengeful spirit, venomancer, crystal maiden, enigma, etc.) but that isn't exactly what gets played in pubs and I find that sort of play just incredibly boring. His mana dependency and his long cast times just feel so awkward. The hero might be numerically good and have a niche but he's just not enjoyable for me. And I actually know I'm not the only one who feels this way; there have been a lot of people who have echoed these same sentiments.

[Malthe]

Hero is good for coordinated play(Granted that he would work like he does in dota1) but barely functions in pubs.
Also it's not exclusive for 4p1 or even 2010, ES is king of 2-1-2 lanes because of how good he is in 2v2. He was still top pick back when iG, DK and panda were playing in the ACE league in early 2012.
Honestly if the game wasn't so centered around trilanes and he worked exactly like dota1, he'd most likely be picked far more.
But odds are that like bat(Which is really funny, if bat was 1:1 as he was in dota1 he'd still be a good pick but would never have been buffed) he'll be buffed before he reaches dota1 parity, but hero isn't weak at all, quite stronk.

[Raul]

What are the issues with parity? I think I remember something with Fissure, but not sure.

[Words]

Just had a game where someone called me awesome and a good player :') This is the first time someone calls me good player... maybe just in really low level games, but still :')
We lost and I wish I could've done more but they were ganking too much and my team ganks were awful, I hate it when people run away from my successful initiations!
It was a really fun game, anyway; and after not playing SK for so long (last time I messed up everything but this time it went SO MUCH better) I can actually feel like I'm improving a bit.

[Malthe]

What are the issues with parity? I think I remember something with Fissure, but not sure.

Essentially pathing makes fissure blocks much much harder to achieve.
Better pathing = weaker fissure, essentially.
And seeing that fissure is the thing that makes ES a pick at all, that's quite a crucial thing to fix, somehow. That or he'll like batrider probably just be buffed.

Also, compendium nearing second stretch goal in a few days, whoa.

[Born2BeMild]

Also, compendium nearing second stretch goal in a few days, whoa.

Compendium bros WW@?

[Malthe]

WW@!?

[Born2BeMild]

right here, bro.

I do wish Qpad stepped it up

[Malthe]

Being a QPAD fan is suffering.
Doubt they'll qualify for TI3, they haven't been training together for long enough and SelecT has been sick.

Seeing them as the wildcard winners would be hilarious though, but they'd have to play against VG or LGD then, and most likely they'd be stomped. And the odds of them qualifying as first ranked in the qualifiers are next to none EG is quite stronk atm.
But well:

Spoiler

[Raul]

Being a fan of a lot of western teams is kinda hard. So many of them are so inconsistent.

holy pomegranate that kaipi mouz game. lot of waiting for that ending.
and it's only game one, fml.

Spoiler

#excitingdota

[Born2BeMild]

Being a fan of a lot of western teams is kinda hard. So many of them are so inconsistent.

holy pomegranate that kaipi mouz game. lot of waiting for that ending.
and it's only game one, fml.

Spoiler

#excitingdota

I'm liking the general inconsistance shown by a lot of the teams. makes for more exiciting games.

[Even]

Being a fan of a lot of western teams is kinda hard. So many of them are so inconsistent.

holy pomegranate that kaipi mouz game. lot of waiting for that ending.
and it's only game one, fml.

Spoiler

#excitingdota

It was game of throws. Base race vs a lone druid? Letting your bear die twice by sending it into the enemy team (when mid rax for mouz fell). If mouz want to make any sort of impact in TI3, let alone qualifiy they really need to stepup, they should be glad kaipi was stupid enough to go for the base race.

Not saying they're a bad team, but they dont stand a chance at all in TI3 group stages if they dont improve their team fights.

[IllegallySane]

This is strangely addicting to watch.

[Raul]

It was game of throws. Base race vs a lone druid? Letting your bear die twice by sending it into the enemy team (when mid rax for mouz fell). If mouz want to make any sort of impact in TI3, let alone qualifiy they really need to stepup, they should be glad kaipi was stupid enough to go for the base race.

Not saying they're a bad team, but they dont stand a chance at all in TI3 group stages if they dont improve their team fights.

That comp would have been blown up in 5 seconds if they had gone for a teamfight. In fact, that happened a few times. They were playing a 75 minute mindgame with Kaipi and it payed off. They got impatient and their judgement got hazy.
#canustfu #excitingdota
also, compendium stretch goal 2 already reached. Hot damn. Qualifiers are starting tomorrow at 10 AM EDT.

[Even]

That comp would have been blown up in 5 seconds if they had gone for a teamfight. In fact, that happened a few times. They were playing a 75 minute mindgame with Kaipi and it payed off. They got impatient and their judgement got hazy.
#canustfu #excitingdota
also, compendium stretch goal 2 already reached. Hot damn. Qualifiers are starting tomorrow at 7:30 AM EDT.

I know they had to dodge team fights and split push to win, but my point was. When they were forced into a team fight they just kept failing over and over which lead to losing bottom rax aswell. Jugger didnt remove golems with diffusal, bear died in 5 sec, wr didnt sheep the right target, instead he got doomed and obviously ended up dead.

My point wasnt that they could win the team fight if they did better, but they could reduce the damage and maybe even save bottom rax, making split push a lot easier after kaipi fell back. If it wasnt for kaipi being stupid to rush down mid lane and go for a base race, I think this game could go to 110 min where kaipi would end up at top.

After watching this game I think EG will take west qualifiers and mouz/qpad will be 2nd place, had faith in mouz for 1st place before this game.

Edit: Had my first game with elder titan, didnt like it that much. It was strong in the laning phase with a lot of harrass and easy last hit potential but I dont see how his aura pays off if you go utlity build like I did (meka, pipe, mana boots & urn). Do you guys think I should go with more of a carry build next time? (mind you I was playing vs a storm and timber, so easy to get away from stun with those two)

[Malthe]

Had my first game with elder titan, didnt like it that much. It was strong in the laning phase with a lot of harrass and easy last hit potential but I dont see how his aura pays off if you go utlity build like I did (meka, pipe, mana boots & urn). Do you guys think I should go with more of a carry build next time? (mind you I was playing vs a storm and timber, so easy to get away from stun with those two)

Heroes that is nearly utility incarnated that relies on his team feels weak in pubs, surprise
But really, you can do carry ET if you want, but with a good team you can do so much with utility items.

Also, second stretch goal met AND the qualifiers are underway!

[Raul]

These games are turning out not how I would have expected.

[Malthe]

These games are turning out not how I would have expected.

Picks? Results?
Picks were a bit off for me, expected more magnus.
Results were more or less what i had expected, wasn't sure if AL would flop or if rox.kis would show their A-game, A-game rox.kis pretty much takes games off the best in the west while they have days where you could barely call them a B-tier team so i predicted 2-1 to either of them.
And DD is the team i'm predicting to cause upsets, decent roster and decent experience all around.

To write more predictions for group B:
I expect EG to beat qpad. I expect mouz to beat iccup. I expect qpad to beat iccup. I expect EG to beat qpad. And after that i honestly wont call mouz vs qpad, i really have no idea because of their players. Both teams have a tendency to throw and sing is fairly experience vs synderen's turtle doto. I'm predicting 2-1 to either team. Basically i'm expecting EG to come out on top of the group and mouz/qpad to come out after that.
Unless of course EG goes full throwdoto, but from their results lately they should honestly do just fine vs any of the qualifier teams.

[Raul]

Picks? Results?
Picks were a bit off for me, expected more magnus.
Results were more or less what i had expected, wasn't sure if AL would flop or if rox.kis would show their A-game, A-game rox.kis pretty much takes games off the best in the west while they have days where you could barely call them a B-tier team so i predicted 2-1 to either of them.
And DD is the team i'm predicting to cause upsets, decent roster and decent experience all around.

To write more predictions for group B:
I expect EG to beat qpad. I expect mouz to beat iccup. I expect qpad to beat iccup. I expect EG to beat qpad. And after that i honestly wont call mouz vs qpad, i really have no idea because of their players. Both teams have a tendency to throw and sing is fairly experience vs synderen's turtle doto. I'm predicting 2-1 to either team. Basically i'm expecting EG to come out on top of the group and mouz/qpad to come out after that.
Unless of course EG goes full throwdoto, but from their results lately they should honestly do just fine vs any of the qualifier teams.

Uh, the picks aren't that odd. I mean,

This is an actual spoiler that is meant to hide spoilers.

I f'ucking love the Slark pickups and he's amazing against Batrider in particular, the Lycan pick isn't that odd, and the Omniknight pick is... okay, that's a bit odd. The Ursa pick was a strange one but it wasn't the best pick anyhow.
It's more how badly Empire disappointed and how well aL played, especially after that game one.
But oh boy, OD and Treant. I feel like Icefrog must be so happy whenever dd.Dota play. I'm amused at Slark being a first stage ban from dd against aL though.

dd.Dota shows pretty well what advantages the Western scene has over the Eastern scene: their ability to innovate and surprise. I'm super glad that 6.78 is coming before TI3; it gives Western teams a much better chance if they can simply innovate better than Eastern teams. Without a lot of innovation, I don't think Western teams can compete with Eastern teams' awareness, cohesion, and mechanical skill.