DotA2 - Original Thread

[Malthe]

Today a friend was sending me messages ALL DAY LONG beggin me to stop playing Dota 2 and switch to LoL.
I only played like 3 matches of LoL and didn't like it, but even so I made some research and holy molly
LoL is really more newbie friendly than DoTA 2.
And you know what? I didn't like that.
It's utterly bs that you can buy and item whenever you are and magically appear on your items.
The fact that your gold pool isn't divided isn't that bad but stil is something really useful in some matches.
The fact that there's no bonus gold for killing a Hero with a Killing streak gives no incentive whatsoever for the team to work around and kill that guy.
No denies?
Also read that:
Dota 2 : Tower Defense
LoL: Tower Defend
?

Oh well, glad I stick up with Dota 2.

Disclaimer: I like to point out that this info may be outdated

Items in LoL can only be picked up at the fountain and there is bonus gold for gold streaks but likewise you get less gold for killing the same guy repeatedly. And yea in LoL towers create a safe haven for people early on where in DotA you can still be dived at level 1 and get killed quite easily without enemy having to worry too much about the tower if it's a 3v1 dive for example.

I occasionally play both myself with a friend who likes the game a lot and he likewise occasionally plays dota with me.
But i massively prefer DotA2 myself.(99.5% doto)

Both games have their own respective merits.

[IllegallySane]

the way a game looks is the most important thing for me o.O

It depends for me. You can have ghetto level graphics, but as long as gameplay is utterly stellar I wouldn't care. There's a reason I don't mind playing retro games.

there's one thing that I've read and I agree with it as a disadvantage of Dota2.
If you have a bad start in a match it's really really difficult to over come that.
YOu need a full communicated team to be able to do that, and even then if the other team is full of counterparts of your team's heroes you're pretty much screwed up.

I don't know. I feel getting a disadvantage in LoL is harder on you. It's probably because anyone in the game can snowball since you never lose gold for going #YOLO 24/7. So shutting down someone who's fed is technically harder to do. I also feel a 1-2 level difference is oddly noticeable in LoL, not sure why.

The more annoying part about the game however is that if you want to play the newest champions you either have to wait for a week when they're free or you got to play to unlock them. Since I don't play that often, I find more amusement in playing pubstompy Champions or whatever Champion makes most players cry. However, most of them tend to cost the average player ~50-60 games to get enough points to unlock them. So if I want to have the most fun playing LoL, I must have okay fun playing for ~50-60 hours so I can THEN have fun when I play? Hahaha, no.

Metagame is also painfully static. You MUST call your lane/role before the game even starts, and that won't change. Makes me miss the dynamic lineups of Doto. Also no denies. Game feels boring without them.

Don't get me wrong, I'm willing to play LoL with my friends since they play it, but there's no way I can main LoL. In solo queue there is a lot more terrible trash talking players, I don't know why I keep getting them in my games.

[Raul]

there's one thing that I've read and I agree with it as a disadvantage of Dota2.
If you have a bad start in a match it's really really difficult to over come that.
YOu need a full communicated team to be able to do that, and even then if the other team is full of counterparts of your team's heroes you're pretty much screwed up.

unless you're medusa
just sit near ancients farming them pretty much all game long and ward places nearby so you don't get ganked
suddenly show up at 50 minutes being 0/3/1 with 400 CS and 5-slotted

I honestly like Dota because there's just so much room for creativity and unexpected power if someone doesn't play exactly right. like ignoring a medusa most of the game and thinking you're going to win.

also, would you like some cheese with your wine?

[Corn]

Today a friend was sending me messages ALL DAY LONG beggin me to stop playing Dota 2 and switch to LoL.
I only played like 3 matches of LoL and didn't like it, but even so I made some research and holy molly
LoL is really more newbie friendly than DoTA 2.
And you know what? I didn't like that.
It's utterly bs that you can buy and item whenever you are and magically appear on your items.
The fact that your gold pool isn't divided isn't that bad but stil is something really useful in some matches.
The fact that there's no bonus gold for killing a Hero with a Killing streak gives no incentive whatsoever for the team to work around and kill that guy.
No denies?
Also read that:
Dota 2 : Tower Defense
LoL: Tower Defend
?

Oh well, glad I stick up with Dota 2.

Disclaimer: I like to point out that this info may be outdated

Okay pineapple your friend, but seriously where did you get your facts? Like, a third of them are wrong O_o.

A friend of mine has been playing Dota for about a month now (he just plainly likes the artstyle in Dota more) so I've been thinking about playing a game or two with him. Any champions in Dota that are, say, simple mechanically and translates well from LoL? I would prefer someone with an easy build path, too, since I can't be bothered to read that into a guide on the champion to buy X item during Y specific situation to counter Z certain champion. Say, like a ranged AD carry who just builds damage items (and please, if you tell me Invoker, I'm going to manhandle you).

[Chew]

Okay pineapple your friend, but seriously where did you get your facts? Like, a third of them are wrong O_o.

(and please, if you tell me Invoker, I'm going to manhandle you).

I know they might be outdated. :P
And Invoker .. please manhandle me all you want JK
Well I am a total newbie in the game, everyone who has played with me can tell you that xD
As for easy builds heroes... I may say..
Huskarl and Ursa?
Malthe or Dusk would have better oppinions tho

[Dusk]

League champions tend to be simple mechanically and depend more on skillshots, right? Try Jakiro. He's a ranged support with a linear aoe stun and conal aoe slow. Easiest ranged carries are Drow Ranger and Viper. Both very much right click and win heroes, especially in low level play.

[Raul]

Okay pineapple your friend, but seriously where did you get your facts? Like, a third of them are wrong O_o.

A friend of mine has been playing Dota for about a month now (he just plainly likes the artstyle in Dota more) so I've been thinking about playing a game or two with him. Any champions in Dota that are, say, simple mechanically and translates well from LoL? I would prefer someone with an easy build path, too, since I can't be bothered to read that into a guide on the champion to buy X item during Y specific situation to counter Z certain champion. Say, like a ranged AD carry who just builds damage items (and please, if you tell me Invoker, I'm going to manhandle you).

play meepo. trust me, it'll go well.

to be honest no one in dota builds just damage items unless you're pineappleing Lone Druid, and ranged carries are less popular than their melee counterparts. and I really don't recommend playing Lone Druid to start.

basically here is a good list of decently simple heroes. each name links to a super short guide about them. there's also several good introductory guides to the game on there.

honestly it's difficult to recommend a simple hero with a simple build order that's pretty much idiot-proof because that's what you'll need. :p
really, there aren't carries that fall under that category at all and I know you're usually a carry player. I would recommend a semi-carry like Nature's Prophet but jungling in Dota is weird and you'd have to watch a guide to get it down and he's got pretty much the most flexible build ever. and the philosophy behind playing him is fundamentally very different than most other heroes; you use your global presence and summons to build up a gold and experience advantage that allows you to 1v1 pretty much anyone.

actually, try out Outworld Destroyer. He's a lane bully (max Astral Imprisonment and aura first but AI over aura, don't get a point into orb for a while) and he transitions easily into a carry. just go mantle branch branch branch tango tango salve into null talisman, magic wand, and power treads (you can switch the main attribute) into force staff. then go scythe of vyse, black king bar, and shiva's guard.

you know what, save that for a while and just play the damn tutorials. you can try OD once you get into real pvp matchmaking.

[Malthe]

There are no heroes in DotA with a build that'll work in all games, but if you want something simple it'd be something like:

Tidehunter support/roamer, build arcane boots into mekansm, Max gush and get a single point in kraken shell and one in anchor smash, proceed to max anchor smash and ulti whenever possible. Be very aggressive in lane and when roaming and get dem kills. And ult whenever your team is ready to follow up and you can hit 3+ enemies(Or less if the kill is important or aggression is low in the game so a single kill is rare, like if enemies are turtlers)
Other items you can get are: Drums of endurance, Blink dagger, Pipe of insight, Urn of shadows. In no particular order, depending on what you need and feel like you could use.

Lich support, build tranquil boots and disassemble them into a force staff or mekansm based on if you need to escape enemies badly in fights since you might be a target of focus(Build forcestaff to get away from enemies) or mekansm if you're feeling safe and want to help your team out with a heal. Skill sacrifice at level 1(Use it on the very first creep wave ASAP, do it in mid lane preferably to help your mid laner massive) and proceed to use it anytime its off cooldown to deny your enemy as much experience as possible. Max frost nova after this and get shield whenever you feel it's necessary(Sometimes earlygame if against melee heroes that will be up close and hitting important targets, like say a riki) but generally max sacrifice over shield to help with mana. Get ult whenever and your items you can get will be something like upgrading boots to phase boots or power treads (Speed vs Surviveability)
Other items are stuff like drums of endurance(I'll stop mentioning this item, it's basically good on nearly pineappleing everything if you feel you can pick it up without delaying an important item, amazing mid-game item)
If you didn't get mek or force staff earlier, pick the one you didn't get up unless of course someone already has a mekansm.
Urn of shadows is also good if nobody else has it(Only one urn gets charges from kills)
And aghanim gives nice stats all around, it's not the perfect item but it's situationally good to pick up. After that any luxuries will be Scythe of vyse/Shiva's guard/Necronomicon)

And for relatively easy carry, Skeleton king. Max stun and get crit after that, get vampiric aura last and ult whenever.
Your ult requires mana regardless of being passive to a soul ring is a brilliant item on baller king since he has loadsa lifesteal. Your boots of choice will be power treads and after getting soul ring and power treads you'll want an Armlet of Mordiggian. Now you'll want either a black king bar or an assault cuirass depending on wether physical damage is pineappleing with you or if disables are your problem. Get whichever you didn't get before afterwards(I strongly doubt there'll be games where black king bar wont be worth getting)
Situational items include Desolator, Abyssal blade, Heaven's halberd and Heart of tarrasque.
Whack pomegranate to death yo.
And if you want to have the real baller king experience you'll need to build refresher and rapier for dat double ult and loadsa damage on crits.(No really don't do this unless you want to lose the game in a fun way)

And to name a ranged carry too, Viper.
With viper you'll want phase boots and drums for mobility as far as items go(Slow hero needs speed yo)
If you want to gank a lot, pick up urn of shadows early on and if you want to farm pick up a mekansm for your team(Being tanky is good when your damage is over time)
Shadow blade is a decent pick-up for ganking and if you can get it really fast after phase boots and drums aghanims scepter is also good for long range team assitance, but this needs to be gotten fast and needs to be utilized for kills.
If you want to farm your build should look something like: Phase boots, drums, mekansm, Manta style, assault cuirass, butterfly and then replace mekansm or drums with heart eventually and then replace the other with aghanim lategame(Helps a lot lategame and early game, it's meh to get mid-game)
And if you want to gank it should be something like: Phase boots, drums/aghanim, urn, Shadow blade, Orchid(If you got aghanim and enemy has an escape)/Manta style, Heart, Butterfly.
Skills should be nether toxin at level 1 to help you last hit, after that get level 3 poison attack and go and max corrosive skin. After that max nether toxin and max poison attack last. Get ult whenever possible.
Viper is typically played mid.

And to win mid ez pz go Outworld devourer.
Max Astral imprisonment and Essence aura and don't get ulti or orb untill both are maxed(Sometimes you wanna stop maxing them before 4 but typically just max both) and proceed to spam astral on enemy. If enemy is an int hero he can't last hit against you, ever and if they aren't an int hero they can't cast spells ever. Proceed to win mid unless ganked.
Build Tranquil boots and buckler early on(Their active effects can trigger essence aura) and disassemble tranquil into mekansm and upgrade boots into Treads, change them to intelligence treads.
Now get drums for more mobility or skip them for a straight black king bar, you'll need this for not being stopped in fights. Now get scythe of vyse and shiva's guard and murder people. Ocassionally a ghost scepter is good if you're being focused by enemy right-clikers since you can auto attack through ghost form by manually casting your orb.
Get orb and ult after maxing or getting a high level of astral imprisonment and maxing essence aura.
As long as enemies don't get black king bar(Nobody in low level play gets it unless it's core on the hero) you'll melt everyone and everything with pure damage based on your max mana.
Hope that helped.

Note: This wall of text was written with my own way of playing the heroes in mind, i get mid-game items a lot and enjoy lots and lots of teamfighting, thus drums on nearly everything and mekansm as well.


And if you're baller enough, use these guides:

Spoiler

[IllegallySane]

And if you're baller enough, use these guides:

Spoiler

Brb watching for my daily fix.

[KhainiWest]

People keep telling me to play these because I was so good at C&C zero hour, and I just don't see the appeal. The more I read about this, the more I call my friends absolutely retarded because the games are entirely different frekin levels of existance.

[Words]

You guys got any tips for Magnus, especially laning phase? How does he deal with early harass?
I feel like I'd have an awful time in lane, getting zoned out and delaying items by a whole lot.

[Malthe]

You guys got any tips for Magnus, especially laning phase? How does he deal with early harass?
I feel like I'd have an awful time in lane, getting zoned out and delaying items by a whole lot.

Get a stout shield, helps a lot.
Also rush bottle and try to get as many runes as possible and just end up killing enemy creep waves with shockwave while hitting the enemy hero.

Itd help if you told me which hero you were against and such.

[Words]

Get a stout shield, helps a lot.
Also rush bottle and try to get as many runes as possible and just end up killing enemy creep waves with shockwave while hitting the enemy hero.

Itd help if you told me which hero you were against and such.

I've been playing it against bots and I don't get harassed that much or at all, even if I stand next to creeps for a sec more than needed to last hit.
It made me think how a real game would go and wanted to ask for a few tips or a general guideline to keep in mind when playing it in a real match.
All the things you listed seem doable, but if I were to buy a stout a shield would that change the other items I get with starting gold?
104 remaining gold if I buy tangos, 3 branches and the stout shield, which I feel would delay the bottle a bit. Or that delay wouldn't matter?

[Malthe]

Optimally you would want to just go 3 branches and tangos and rush the bottle. But in some match-ups, if you fear harassment, get a stout shield.
Magnus has a lot of base strength and base armor so it shouldn't be too big of a problem, but if you're against something like a queen of pain picking up a stout and a salve might be worth it so you can stay in lane for the experience.
Stout is worth it against long range heroes with good attack animation(Like sniper though he's not the best mid hero) getting stout against sniper lets you just walk up to him and hit him for example because he can't fight back due to creep aggro, which allows a melee hero to bully a ranged hero.
But yea the later into the match-up you get as magnus the more it becomes just spamming and harassing with shockwave and when they get low enough skewer onto them and RP or RP and skewer into tower, granted that they don't have a blink or something.

[Raul]

iirc mag starts winning lane at about level 5 because he gets level 3 shockwave (along with level 2 skewer)
if you don't lose lane that badly before 5 you're probably fine
of course magnus really doesn't "win" lanes unless something absolutely insane happens

[Vanderlust]

Like someone else said magnus doesn't win lanes you just never lose. Bottlecrow shockwave is the way to go. All you need is to get your blink/arcane and you're golden.

[SheLovesYou]

I am still a noob in LoL, but because my friends kept telling me about DotA2 and it's still free on Steam, I decided to install it and read some noob guides. But omg, this game is so complex. I can't imagine ever being able to play decently. I really respect all of you...

[Words]

I am still a noob in LoL, but because my friends kept telling me about DotA2 and it's still free on Steam, I decided to install it and read some noob guides. But omg, this game is so complex. I can't imagine ever being able to play decently. I really respect all of you...

It's all about practice, I think 500 hours playing and many hours watching pro players made me a decent player but I still make noob mistakes. @Chew; is improving at a much faster rate and by 500 hours he'll be playing way better than I am. If you want you can add me on Steam and play together, go over the basics and I should be able to answer most of your questions.
My steam ID is WordsSP.

[Dusk]

I am still a noob in LoL, but because my friends kept telling me about DotA2 and it's still free on Steam, I decided to install it and read some noob guides. But omg, this game is so complex. I can't imagine ever being able to play decently. I really respect all of you...

You see complexity, I see infinite replay value :) It's a lot of fun even if you're bad, and for me, wanting to get better is part of the reason I keep playing.

[SheLovesYou]

It's all about practice, I think 500 hours playing and many hours watching pro players made me a decent player but I still make noob mistakes. @Chew; is improving at a much faster rate and by 500 hours he'll be playing way better than I am. If you want you can add me on Steam and play together, go over the basics and I should be able to answer most of your questions.
My steam ID is WordsSP.

Well, I really am veryyyyy nooby. I'd rather not anger you.... which I will probably if I play with you. My LoL friends only not get angry with me, because I sit next to them with my laptop most of the time and they can't be mad because they see me almost every week. 500 hours sounds soooo much. It's nice to have a hobby like this.

You see complexity, I see infinite replay value :) It's a lot of fun even if you're bad, and for me, wanting to get better is part of the reason I keep playing.

Yeah, I can imagine it being that much fun. But I don't think I can avoid getting yelled at when not playing with friends... something like that effects me pretty bad. v.v Oh and I also like playing Civ5! xD