Post-RED Shadower Build.

[nRxUs]

Have you done calculations?


http://www.basilmarket.com/forum/236...ice_patch.html

ohey @inemnitable

You should've kept reading along Pat where I try to show he's wrong.
Here are a few things I missed though:
In his calculations he says:
"Range minimum to cap Assassinate:
999999 / (7.4 * 2.5) = 54054"
But later he states that:
"And in any case, marginal or not, the calculations I performed were already assuming a capped assassinate without the use of dark sight or killing points."
If he didn't count the use of Dark Sight then where does that 2.5 multiplication come from.
Also, for Assassinate+Dark Sight the delay is not 1170 but 1410 because you need to add 240ms from Dark Sight.
Anyway,
It is much better to collect 5kp from other Skills (including Meso Explosion) and then use Assassinate than to spam Assassinate+Dark Sight.

Also, Locked, you should check the requirements for Pickpocket for your Guide.

[MrTouchnGo]

snip

Sorry, but calculating dps hasn't interested me ever since dupers have been breaking the game to the point that there were weapons that were the equivalent of 100% stat. It's lazy of me to not check things before posting them, but I honestly don't care much about damage anymore.

However, the main point of my post was to bring your attention to where CE+BS actually overtakes Assassinate in damage, as opposed to "just spam CE+BS if you can hit cap with Assassinate."

[Locked]

Also, Locked, you should check the requirements for Pickpocket for your Guide.

Fixed.

[inemnitable]

You should've kept reading along Pat where I try to show he's wrong.
Here are a few things I missed though:
In his calculations he says:
"Range minimum to cap Assassinate:
999999 / (7.4 * 2.5) = 54054"
But later he states that:
"And in any case, marginal or not, the calculations I performed were already assuming a capped assassinate without the use of dark sight or killing points."
If he didn't count the use of Dark Sight then where does that 2.5 multiplication come from.
Also, for Assassinate+Dark Sight the delay is not 1170 but 1410 because you need to add 240ms from Dark Sight.
Anyway,
It is much better to collect 5kp from other Skills (including Meso Explosion) and then use Assassinate than to spam Assassinate+Dark Sight.

Also, Locked, you should check the requirements for Pickpocket for your Guide.

That's the range to cap with Dark Sight, however the range to cap without Dark Sight is lower than the equivalence point I calculated, so my calculations are not incorrect. I will admit that it was something of a gap in my train of thought while I was writing it that created a bit of a non-sequitur. Also you've produced no evidence to support the theory that you lose less dps from using a bunch of other skills than from casting Dark Sight.

Also that picture proves nothing; we have no information on what kind of boss damage or total damage potentials he has. And I say "has" and not "may have" because the maximum possible non-crit bstep from that range is 741,650.

[nRxUs]

That's the range to cap with Dark Sight, however the range to cap without Dark Sight is lower than the equivalence point I calculated, so my calculations are not incorrect. I will admit that it was something of a gap in my train of thought while I was writing it that created a bit of a non-sequitur. Also you've produced no evidence to support the theory that you lose less dps from using a bunch of other skills than from casting Dark Sight.

Also that picture proves nothing; we have no information on what kind of boss damage or total damage potentials he has. And I say "has" and not "may have" because the maximum possible non-crit bstep from that range is 741,650.

Here is what I calculated
Also what picture?

[Mazz]

Also that picture proves nothing; we have no information on what kind of boss damage or total damage potentials he has. And I say "has" and not "may have" because the maximum possible non-crit bstep from that range is 741,650.

The screenshot on the previous page? I had 95% boss and 24% total damage (I think, might have been 70% boss 9% total, may not have had the dojo gloves on).

[MrTouchnGo]

Here is what I calculated
Also what picture?

Spoiler

I never finished that last section

[inemnitable]

Here is what I calculated
Also what picture?

You've shown your results, however you have not shown the calculations you used to produce them, so what am I supposed to think? I mean, you could just as easily say "hey guys, I proved P=NP," but you're not going to get your million dollars that way.

[ChosenFruit]

I have a question:
Is Midnight Carnival used in 4th job at all? And is Assassinate slower than Midnight Carnival in any way?
(I'm assuming Assassinate replaces Midnight Carnival as my 1v1, of course)

I wonder because I was planning to max Dark Flare instead of Midnight Carnival, and I just wanna make sure I don't regret it.
I wouldn't mind leaving Dark Flare at 11, if it didn't have that long cool down. I feel like if I don't max it, I won't even use it at all, and being able to re-place it down once it expires would make it a lot more useful.

So yeah, any specific reasons to max Midnight Carnival over Dark Flare?

@The Posts below: Alrighty then, thank you very much =]

[zOrpheus]

You won't get hit much, especially with Shadow Shifter, so Dark Flare is almost useless.

Boomerang Step will be your main attack in 4th job. Since Boomerang Step has delay, Midnight Carnival is used in between Boomerang Steps for single targets. (Boomerang Step -> Midnight Carnival -> Boomerang Step...) It also gets a +25% damage boost from chaining Boomerang Step into it. Midnight Carnival is also used to generate coins for Meso Explosion.

Assassinate does not replace Midnight Carnival. It is much slower, and should only be used when you accumulate 5 Killing Points (passive effect from Shadower Instinct), assuming you don't hit the damage cap.

[RedRaven16]

You won't get hit much, especially with Shadow Shifter, so Dark Flare is almost useless.

Boomerang Step will be your main attack in 4th job. Since Boomerang Step has delay, Midnight Carnival is used in between Boomerang Steps for single targets. (Boomerang Step -> Midnight Carnival -> Boomerang Step...) It also gets a +25% damage boost from chaining Boomerang Step into it. Midnight Carnival is also used to generate coins for Meso Explosion.

Assassinate does not replace Midnight Carnival. It is much slower, and should only be used when you accumulate 5 Killing Points (passive effect from Shadower Instinct), assuming you don't hit the damage cap.

uhh the 1.25x dmg bonus B-step gives is passive ,also nate IS stronger in 1v1 than carnival+b-step combo just not at first seeing as maxing b-step first is more important.

[zOrpheus]

uhh the 1.25x dmg bonus B-step gives is passive ,also nate IS stronger in 1v1 than carnival+b-step combo just not at first seeing as maxing b-step first is more important.

Just tested, and you're right - the bonus damage from Boomerang Step to other attacks doesn't require it to be chained. Ignore the in-game description.

I still think Assassinate is only worth using when 5 killing points are accumulated (and not spammed). The B-Step + Midnight Carnival combo also helps stack coins for Meso Explosion. Either way, do not trade skill points from Midnight Carnival for Dark Flare. It's not worth it.

[Aflac]

Just tested, and you're right - the bonus damage from Boomerang Step to other attacks doesn't require it to be chained. Ignore the in-game description.

I still think Assassinate is only worth using when 5 killing points are accumulated (and not spammed). The B-Step + Midnight Carnival combo also helps stack coins for Meso Explosion. Either way, do not trade skill points from Midnight Carnival for Dark Flare. It's not worth it.

@MrTouchnGo; has a really nice Google Document with what combo to use for best DPS at various ranges with and without ME. It's only 1v1, but in any mob situation you're almost guaranteed to be using meso explosion anyway.

[Locked]

Updated for the KMST RED update. Removed all the older ones. Sorry, it was just too outdated.

[Hobokun]

Updated for the KMST RED update. Removed all the older ones. Sorry, it was just too outdated.

You wouldn't happen to have a copy of the old stuff would you? It'd be useful for many of us (or at least me) since GMS feels the need to constantly reset our SP points

Edit: Ha, nvm, all I really needed help with was 4th job, and that didn't really change anyways.