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  1. Default I don't get why people are viewing map simplicity so negatively


    With the recent Masteria change, I've seen a lot of people criticizing Nexon's use of basic map shapes for the revamped areas, saying that the old Masteria was better.

    But I don't get it. "Different" maps are often more of a novelty than anything. Any map with slopes screws over ranged attacks and horizontal AoE skills. Maps with too much level variety in the spawn are terrible for training. And anything that has real spaced out spawns and/or requires half a jump quest to navigate is far more trouble than it's worth.

    Simple maps are useful. And useful maps are actually worth having. The Maple World is huge, but 80% of the areas that spawn monsters are terribly inefficient to the point where they may as well not exist, which is why there are so many KS wars and overcrowding problems in the places that ARE good to train at. Yeah, it might be slightly boring, but how many of you would honestly rather spend your 5X and low 6X levels deep in Ant Tunnel at ice/dark drakes when you could instead go to the recommended small, flat maps and level three to five times faster?

  2. Default Re: I don't get why people are viewing map simplicity so negatively


    Should all maps then be linear? People default to about 20 main training places, there lacks variety no matter how you edit the maps. What annoys the players the most about the masteria maps is it added a new dynamic to the game that everyone enjoyed. Random spawning bigfoot, headless horseman, and the effort to get a truely unique boss fight.

    Now you have 7 maps with no surprises that have "WASTE OF TIME" pasted in the background. As most of the game to be honest.

  3. Default Re: I don't get why people are viewing map simplicity so negatively


    I don't have an issue with good map design, but I feel like it's fair to expect some maps that are worth training on and some that are for quests/exploring. My main problem with the update is that they removed more content than they added. Maybe new players complained about the Phantom Forest's complicated maps and maze-like properties, but for me that was the whole charm of the place. The way they've made it now, it's just another who-cares boring area.

  4. Default Re: I don't get why people are viewing map simplicity so negatively


    The skills working poorly on slopes is something that Nexon should have made work better. Not an excuse to make simple maps.

    You can also compensate difficult to navigate maps with dense spawn, better exp:hp ratios or well placed teleporters. Lower ascent was a creative map with a well placed teleporter, dense spawns and good exp:hp ratio, it worked because it was well thought out.

  5. Default Re: I don't get why people are viewing map simplicity so negatively


    Have you seen the new Phantom Forest?

  6. Default Re: I don't get why people are viewing map simplicity so negatively


    Yes, it's poorly designed and it's an insult to even call it a shell of it's former self. But, I never trained there or even cared about it so it doesn't bother me. The second I got dragon blink and my mark I just skipped the whole damn thing. I always HATED that walk. Plus, maps were cool but all of them terrible for training, as they are now. Masteria's glory days are 90% over and 80% of the population goes there for only about 3 things: CWKPQ, Jesters(Now Alien Cogs), Potions. That's it.

  7. Default Re: I don't get why people are viewing map simplicity so negatively


    They just needed to adapt and fix it. In fact your complaints could apply to majority of the worlds. Look at omega sector.

    Mass making linear maps for solely training purposes is dumb. Imagine the same map with a slightly different platform, much like spooky world with just different shadings/images/monsters. Dull fast.

  8. Default Re: I don't get why people are viewing map simplicity so negatively


    The real issue is that there are now no pure spawn maps. And yes, map simplicity is an issue when the prior maps worked fine due to warps, which is how maps should work. Smaller is not necessarily better.

  9. God of Terrorism Straight Male
    IGN: Bomber123
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    usa

    Default Re: I don't get why people are viewing map simplicity so negatively


    We still have pure spawn maps inside the keep.
    OT: These maps have too many similarities with other maps. They are boring. They are dull. They are not unique.
    I also can't finish getting crimsonwoods and typhon feathers i was working on.
    There will no longer be typhon familiars, there will no longer be crimsonwoods to get the same feel of the keep. This also applies to it not being dull as opposed to it being an epic trek to get to the great keep itself. Wheres that now? 3 keep maps leading up to the inside, and useless phantom forest maps with floating objects.
    And like others said about the forest maze: the whole essence of it was effectively killed. There is only one map to kill the Headless Horseman in, and there are no longer any bigfoots.
    In fact, the path of strength had extremely good spawn to train on if you ask me. Same with lower ascent. I also liked the idea of those caves.
    Crimsonwood keep and the forest is officially dead to me. I no longer feel the same i did about it as i did before they destroyed perfectly fine maps.

  10. Default Re: I don't get why people are viewing map simplicity so negatively


    Here's the thing though. I actually train at Omega Sector to stay away from idiots at jesters. Those maps are actually trainable and fine for training. I'm glad the Jungle portion can finally be used as an alternative training area. Do I wish the Crimson Wood mountains could also be again? Yes I do. Did I always think it was cool these massive maps? Yes of course I loved the map design of Masteria. But at the same time if you look at the rest of maple: Elin forest. It's all changing like that. We can't do anything about it so why complain? Why let maps bother you so much?(Not you directly). It just seems like over-reacting to me. I went in with high hopes of this being DECENT content and it was DECENT at best. I am not disappointed nor do I feel sad. If they wanted to reboot Masteria this could be a good start. We'll just have to see.

  11. Helium Atom Straight Male
    IGN: Combobro
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    Default Re: I don't get why people are viewing map simplicity so negatively


    The new phantom forest looks awful, is linear and it's uniqueness is gone. I really enjoyed doing the JQ and climbing the mountain and exploring through the forest.

    Not only that but it is now impossible to craft crimson weapons and balanced furies due to the fact that they removed typhoons and crimson trees. They also removed the quest to get the crimson keystone as well as the interesting story quests that went along with phantom forest and crimsonwood. I'm disgusted by this update, phantom forest also has floating background objects, map hazards are placed in very awkward places and even on top of portals.


    I didn't mind the changes to Krakia and the city that much, but they went to far by changing crimsonwood and phantom forest for pretty much no true reason.

  12. Default Re: I don't get why people are viewing map simplicity so negatively


    Here's what you're not understanding, the TS is stating that maps are worthless unless a flat surface. CWK proves him wrong, even YOUR post proves him wrong. There's plenty of other methods to exercise a map for training capability, IF they design it. CWK did that well, however with the big bang patch, it got swept under the rug. You really think that CWK would be as empty if big bang didn't ass f`uck it?

  13. Default Re: I don't get why people are viewing map simplicity so negatively


    Personally, I thought the old Phantom Forest was the best area in the entire game. Especially pre-BB when BF could be sitting on any random portal ready to 1shot whoever foolishly walked through. May not sound like fun, but it was, kept you on your toes. That, or you had a DrK friend go through all the portals first while BF hunting if you weren't a thief class, LOL.

  14. Default Re: I don't get why people are viewing map simplicity so negatively


    I think people are mixing the topics here. This is not about CWK specifically. It's about MAP DESIGN.

  15. Default Re: I don't get why people are viewing map simplicity so negatively


    Incidentaly CWK fits for both. Special because of the map design.

    Map design is not synonymous to easy training [read spamming in one spot] either.

  16. Default Re: I don't get why people are viewing map simplicity so negatively


    But he's comparing CWK with the new map designs, even then, making everything a small map with condenced spawn would just reinforce nexons incapable ability to apply any creativity.

  17. Default Re: I don't get why people are viewing map simplicity so negatively


    To his minor defense it depends. I think there defenatly should be maps for variety and all that that's fine. But, even you have to admit when it comes to training 8 times out of 10 that flat map or two platforms completely flat map with dense spawn is looking pretty damn nice.
    That would be the other 2 times out of 10. You're right. If mobs like Windraiders, typhoons etc were brought to BB status they probably would be crowded as pineapple. I'm not denying that the CWK maps were awesome as hell and were well designed, it still doesn't stop the point that Maple wants to move in one direction, Masteria wanted another, and in the end Maple won.

  18. Default Re: I don't get why people are viewing map simplicity so negatively


    The entire point here is that Crimsonwood was the absolute best example that large well designed maps were possible to make that were as good, or even better than generic flat maps.

    Typhons, Elder Wraiths, Windraiders all had ridiculously shaped maps, but were all better than average training areas at the respective levels at various times, and those were just the more popular ones. Every monster in CWKs mountain area was trainable, regardless of the map size.

  19. Default Re: I don't get why people are viewing map simplicity so negatively


    ..When did you make that point? Of course the current developers won, the thread is about whether all these maps should be all flat condensed spawn. It's just another private server request.

  20. Default Re: I don't get why people are viewing map simplicity so negatively


    Read Flonne and ThunderBro's posts again.

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