2011-12-04, 04:53 AM
I haven't read much about the details, but if the part of the bill that contravene bill of rights stuff doesn't exclude American citizens, it'll hit a judicial wall pretty quick. It's more likely congress wrote a couple of important clauses sloppily than it actually being an insidious plot by 90%+ of our legislative branch to destroy America. Or even more simply, idiots on the internet are misrepresenting things.
The only real legal grey area regarding the heavy criminal court rights where congress could push the envelope is what this bill seems to actually address - battlefield detention. They don't want a repeat of what happened with that "American Taliban" they caught in Afghanistan. If you're an American citizen who goes abroad and joins an armed force making war on the US, I don't believe you are entitled to all the legal protections of American citizens merely because the state failed to log your treason back when it occurred.
EDIT: I'm looking at section 1032 and it explicitly disallows US citizens from being detained under this bill's detainment provisions. Anyone know where the part is that supposedly says except "if we want it to" as the filthy communist Scandinavians put it?
EDIT2: Here's a not-retarded-socialist but potentially legalese explanation of the concern: http://www.lawfareblog.com/2011/12/does-...-citizens/. So it goes back to what I said above, if it's not explicitly disallowed the courts will say this provision cant extend to persons protected under the bill of rights. These detention powers are about captures of once-American citizens actively engaged in foreign battlefield hostilities.
EDIT3: Subsection E of 1031 which according to loc.gov was the version passed by the senate states "(e) Authorities- Nothing in this section shall be construed to affect existing law or authorities, relating to the detention of United States citizens, lawful resident aliens of the United States or any other persons who are captured or arrested in the United States."
The only real legal grey area regarding the heavy criminal court rights where congress could push the envelope is what this bill seems to actually address - battlefield detention. They don't want a repeat of what happened with that "American Taliban" they caught in Afghanistan. If you're an American citizen who goes abroad and joins an armed force making war on the US, I don't believe you are entitled to all the legal protections of American citizens merely because the state failed to log your treason back when it occurred.
EDIT: I'm looking at section 1032 and it explicitly disallows US citizens from being detained under this bill's detainment provisions. Anyone know where the part is that supposedly says except "if we want it to" as the filthy communist Scandinavians put it?
EDIT2: Here's a not-retarded-socialist but potentially legalese explanation of the concern: http://www.lawfareblog.com/2011/12/does-...-citizens/. So it goes back to what I said above, if it's not explicitly disallowed the courts will say this provision cant extend to persons protected under the bill of rights. These detention powers are about captures of once-American citizens actively engaged in foreign battlefield hostilities.
EDIT3: Subsection E of 1031 which according to loc.gov was the version passed by the senate states "(e) Authorities- Nothing in this section shall be construed to affect existing law or authorities, relating to the detention of United States citizens, lawful resident aliens of the United States or any other persons who are captured or arrested in the United States."