2009-01-19, 10:16 AM
Cyanne Wrote:The problems with ultimates are that they make archmages and bishops train way faster than other classes and that they're dull to use for training. Honestly, spamming an ultimate in one spot for hours on end is extremely boring, but it's a waste of time to use anything else because ultimate training is just that much faster. They also discourage partying because it's tough to find a party member that will not actually slow your exp rate down, especially since ultimates obliterate entire screens at a time. Big bang doesn't have these problems, mostly because of the smaller range.
For bishops, they aren't supposed to be stronger than marksmen or any other class because they're mostly a support class, which is why they get holy symbol during training. And by forward-piercing, I just meant an iron arrow/avenger/torpedo-style attack. Besides, even if they were to be as strong as marksmen, they don't have the necessary mob control skills like dragon breath and freeze to be able to train as efficiently anyways.
Way much faster for Magicians only? Hun, my 197 DrK friend trains with one Bishop at Newties, and on the bottom can get 30m+ exp/hr on 2x. That's faster than Magicians soloing there if they're 100% 2hkoing.
By the way, I'd like to address this issue for a lot of people who don't understand Magician training without ultimates. Surprisingly, it's HELLA slower than anything you non-Magicians have normally. Soloing with Demon, Summon, and Single-Target can net us roughly 12-16m exp/hr on 2x at Himes, with similar numbers at Skeles. Throw us in a party, and that figure rises to ~20m exp/hr.
20m exp/hr.
I can get that solo Meteoing pineappling Blue Wyverns.
Believe it or not, Magicians COMPLETELY suck without ultimates the way they are. And while I agree that it makes them solo faster than every other class, you pair ANY other class with an ultimate user, and you're training as fast as possible. I don't understand why there's so much hate on skills that actually BENEFIT you, which is why earlier I said "please don't complain for a passive EXP boost if you're already screaming for ultimates to be removed."
And here's the other issue with removing ultimates: where do you want us to train? Sharks? If you make a new, higher-leveled "Hime"-styled map, but that only appears on 19 channels, guess what. All of the non-Magicians in each server will hog those maps, and Magicians would be kicked out because we just can't kill as fast as you with combos.
So if you don't like how Magicians are currently built, you need to understand you only have two options to fix them. Either (1) you keep ultimates the way they are understanding it's essentially the only decent way we can train, or (2) you remove ultimates (or nerf them somehow), and thus have to boost all 3 skills (demon, summon, single target) in both attack power and casting speed, AND you have to make enough flat, "Hime"-styled maps for both non-Magicians and Magicians.
Ideas can be great only when they're fully thought through.