Sonic 2 HD

I mentioned this briefly in another related thread a while back, but recent developments have made me feel it is worthy of its own thread...


http://forums.sonicretro.org/index.php?showforum=42

Long story short: rebuilding Sonic the Hedghog 2 of Genesis fame from the ground up using new high res graphics built from the original low res sprites. They're also talking about a level creation system whereby levels not originally appearing in Sonic 2 could be created and online multiplayer.

I think they might even be considering doubling the frame rate and creating inbetweens for smoother animation. Doing that in a fighter (like, say, Super Street Fighter II Turbo) might be detrimental to maintaining classic gameplay, but doing it in a platformer built around speed could do nothing but make the game smooth as pineappleen silk.

Anyway, I've been trying to keep a pulse on this, and they released the tech demo yesterday. I checked it out and it looks really promising. I was a little worried that they were plowing through all the necessary artwork and they wouldn't have the programming to back it up, but they really delivered.

I took a few screens from the demo for anyone not wanting to bother downloading a demo with nothing really to play (some folks are also having trouble running it). They're not levels or anything, just a screen where you can move around and test out the physics. Knuckles is also available in the demo (although not in high res because his artwork isn't done yet), and his gliding and climbing abilities seem to be working flawlessly. Check out the 1x one first... you might not even be able to tell that it's running on new high res graphics, that's how true to the original it is in it's take on the graphics:
Title (they even animated Sonic popping up and throwing his thumb back like he did on the Genesis)
1x
2x
4x
a youtube video that shows how effective it is, even if the high res graphics aren't distinguishable

I just hope they can complete it without getting killed by Sega.

ps this is a community endeavor, so if you have skills with graphics, programming, or music, you might be able to help. Check out the forum.

That looks pretty awesome. Sonic 2 is one of the greatest games of all time in my opinion so it's great to see it getting a little love once more.

Just to be clear, this is totally independent of the rom right? I remember they had a level editor tool for the Sonic 2 rom back in the day so if isn't then they might be able to take some pointers from that.

this is kinda for the purpose of commercial. in my opinion, it defeats the purpose of the "old school game". its like why they remade stars wars episodes 4, 5 and 6 into HD dvds. its just to rake in some money while people already have experienced the movie. its still the same game. its just gonna be replayed in less "eye bleeding" graphics but it loses its originality.

Just to be clear, this is totally independent of the rom right? I remember they had a level editor tool for the Sonic 2 rom back in the day so if isn't then they might be able to take some pointers from that.

Nothing is derivative of the ROM. Unless you consider ripping sprite sheets, printing out sprites, tracing them and adding detail, then scanning and recoloring to be "derivative".

And I don't see how a level editor for a ROM could help... if it was ROM derivative, they could just rip the levels as is. I suppose they could base it their own level editor design off the markup language (or proprietary format) if one exists. But creating the levels from scratch wouldn't be too much difficulty either. Because there are level maps and such all over the place, all they need to do is pick the parts they need and drop them in where they go. Would probably be boring to build levels exactly as the classic that way, but it wouldn't be hard.

this is kinda for the purpose of commercial. in my opinion, it defeats the purpose of the "old school game". its like why they remade stars wars episodes 4, 5 and 6 into HD dvds. its just to rake in some money while people already have experienced the movie. its still the same game. its just gonna be replayed in less "eye bleeding" graphics but it loses its originality.

This is a fan project. They're not making any money off of it, they're not selling it.

And yeah, "still the same game", so why not love it like you did the original? Have an affinity for low res sprite art? I would be surprised if they don't have the option to turn on alternate art that could make it appear exactly as it did on the Genesis. Look at Street Fighter II HD-- I hear they're having all kinds of different modes and settings, including one that makes the characters play and appear exactly as they did in the original, bugs and imbalances included. Bugs and imbalances wouldn't be good for a platformer though, so don't expect to see that pumpernickel here, but the other point remains that people who would prefer the classic look and will probably be able to see it here.

This is a fan project. They're not making any money off of it, they're not selling it.

Oh. all i saw in your post was "they" so i assumed "they" referred to the people who made the original game, who marketed it and are now remaking it for more profiting. it wouldn't have been a surprise even if it were true.

http://www.mjelectronics.com/images/1367.jpg
BEHOLD! THE RARE LIMITED EDITION PSP! (its basically the orginal psp but in a different color).

you should see mechanics. car companies will design screws that change in shapes model after model just so mechanics have to buy new tools in order to get the same screw, lying in the same position, off. if the screws would just remain the same, then the tool sellers will go out of business after mechanics have a "set" set of tools. keep changing the screws and the mechanic will keep needing to buy new tools.

And yeah, "still the same game", so why not love it like you did the original? Have an affinity for low res sprite art? I would be surprised if they don't have the option to turn on alternate art that could make it appear exactly as it did on the Genesis. Look at Street Fighter II HD-- I hear they're having all kinds of different modes and settings, including one that makes the characters play and appear exactly as they did in the original, bugs and imbalances included. Bugs and imbalances wouldn't be good for a platformer though, so don't expect to see that pumpernickel here, but the other point remains that people who would prefer the classic look and will probably be able to see it here.

something that was once a legend should remain a legend if you ask me. revive a legend... it might be be the same anymore. its taking a huge risk infact.

take disney movies for instance. many people would agree mulan was a great movie. but mulan two was nothing but a chick flick for younger aged girls--a very small audience. Cinderella 2? 3? many people had no idea two was even out when three came out. so cinderella did not lived "happily ever after" when the first movie ended? the little mermaid two wasnt as spectacular as the first either. in the first, the mother fought to live a life on land. in two, her daughter fought to live a life in the ocean; all because the mother was too insecure about the ocean to let her daughter explore it.

i think pirates of the carribean shouldve ended after the first one as well. everyone agreed to will and elizabeth getting married and living together forever. but instead, they had to twist the plot a bit and made William forever bounded to the sea while elizabeth lives alone on land for 10 years. that was a stupid way to end a trilogy.

there are some things that can be revived and still be good. but very rarely does that happen. though im not saying sonic in HD will turn out to suck. its just something that we'll have to wait and see.

Your sequel analogies are flawed.

This is not a sequel. If they took the original film (that is, the FILM) for Cinderella and rescanned it in high res, then went through frame-by-frame and fixed errors that were caused by the film being damaged, that would be an apt parallel. If they recorded a new instrumental soundtrack on a higher fidelity recording, that would be an apt parallel. You could potentially even argue rerecording dialogue would be an apt parallel. But an entirely new film, entirely new story, entirely new EVERYTHING? That's not the same.

Furthermore, Sonic has appeared recently in more than a few brand new 2D (and even 2.5D) games that were very good and well received. To bring back the Cinderella analogy, think of if the recent Cinderella sequels were any good or well received. Then consider that the recent Sonic sequels were.

I think a better analogy to draw would be Pokemon Fire Red and Leaf Green.

Incidentally, what are your thoughts on Super Street Fighter II Turbo HD Remix?

All your examples are sequels, though. There's not much different about Sonic 2 in HD other than a different art style and a few changes to smoothen the gameplay.

EDIT: Dangit Afrobean.

I downloaded the demo and it felt to me like the controls still need some work. You can't go from a jump to a spindash without letting go of your down button and pressing it again, and it takes a little longer than I remember from the old versions, to start Sonic's actual speed running.

It just felt wierd to me. I hope that things turn out good in the end though.

Those're probably things you should suggest to them. They've got a feedback thread in there. Never hurts to mention stuff like that (unless it's been mentioned 20x before).

Technically speaking, the physics are based off of Sonic 3. I'm not familiar with the SPECIFICS of the differences, but it could be that what you've experienced is part of that.

But yeah, definitely, if you have something to say, tell them. If you feel like you can help this project in any way, do it.

ps

There's not much different about Sonic 2 in HD other than a different art style and a few changes to smoothen the gameplay.

It's not a different art style. It's the same art style, just recreated with more definition. If they wanted to go for a different art style, I'm sure it wouldn't be hard for them to rip some 3D models, or generate some art based on his recent incarnations. Honestly, I wouldn't mind seeing that as an alternate sprite set, but that's just not what they're doing; they're taking the original and recreating it in the same style with higher res graphics.

Oh, right right. Damn, it figures Eric Matthews of all people would have to correct my choice of words.

I played it yesterday, and immediately after felt the need to play Sonic 2 again. I honestly couldn't tell the difference between Sonic 2 HD's physics engine and the real thing. If there was something off it had to be very subtle. It's a shame I am horrible at making any sort of graphics/coding, or I'd help. ;-;


On another note: One thing I'd like to see is a public map editor built by the team making this. Playing other fan's custom stages and making your own might prove as fun. I'd suggest it but alas, I do not feel like making an account for the sole purpose of 1 post today.

i reported a few bugs in 4x rez. I got sent off the stage after pressing down on the left of the map. Sonic flipped himself upside and "fell up" to the top of the map. Then I did spindash on the platform thats moving from left to right, and when I hit the wall, he got shot into the top of the map again and I was d/cd.

wierd lol

i reported a few bugs in 4x rez. I got sent off the stage after pressing down on the left of the map. Sonic flipped himself upside and "fell up" to the top of the map. Then I did spindash on the platform thats moving from left to right, and when I hit the wall, he got shot into the top of the map again and I was d/cd.

wierd lol

The 4x one has an intended function where pressing the A button turns gravity upside down. It's a featured function in the Sonic 3 physics.

Anything relating to your avatar flipping upside down like that is probably you accidentally pressing the A key, or related to that in some way.