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+--- Thread: Chaotic Decision: NL or WH Post Chaos? (/showthread.php?tid=38615)
Chaotic Decision: NL or WH Post Chaos? - Hana - 2011-03-01
From what I read from Fiel's extractions, I understand that NL's will get a boosted % on their TT to 354% in Chaos patch (unless there's another update). My question is, if you have a WH (max xbow mastery and blast) and NL (max TT) with the same equip. stats (i.e. Plus 5 atk on the same lvl weapons, +20 overall on primary attribute, etc.), which class would have a higher DPS? Or another question I would ask is, what class would you prefer to focus on?
I appreciate your opinion,
Hana
Chaotic Decision: NL or WH Post Chaos? - ShanghaiDizzy - 2011-03-01
NL's have 293% or 296% after Chaos (I forget which). The 345% per star was only a temporal thing sadly before they decided to "balance" it.
As far as DPS goes, there exists a big problem for WH's. I have both a Night Lord and a Wild Hunter. When the Night Lord gets hit while I'm holding down Triple Throw, Triple Throw continues to be throw after being hit. For a Wild Hunter, Wild Arrows stops and needs to be restarted. This hurts its overall DPS. The other problem for Wild Hunters is, you cannot pot while using Wild Arrows. You have to stop, throw in an MP pot (which you'll be doing some more), and then restart Wild Arrows again. This also hurts its DPS. You can use Auto-MP pots for Wild Hunters, but the Auto-MP only triggers once. Once it's triggered and the Wild Hunter's MP goes below the Auto-MP setting, you'll need to release Wild Arrows yet again to "refresh" the Auto-MP pot. A very big hassle.
So while the numbers may look good for either, Wild Hunters aren't very suitable for consistent DPS (and definitely not for bossing where bosses often hit everyone on screen at the same time). Night Lords, on the other hand, have higher avoid and Shadow Shifter to reduce the amount of times they get hit and break their DPS flow. And if a Night Lord's DPS is high, this also tends to mean that they're avoid is high. The same doesn't apply as extravagantly to Wild Hunters. And should you decide to use an Onyx Apple for a Night Lord, you get a bonus 5 minutes on it due to Alchemist whereas Wild Hunters don't receive any bonus duration even with their potion mastery beginner skill. Dark Flare from Night Lords is also very helpful if your party has people hugging the boss.
Now, there are drawbacks of choosing a Night Lord over a Wild Hunter for bossing (I'm assuming this is why you care about DPS). Night Lords don't have any decent party buffs aside from Haste, which doesn't help when the majority of the time you boss you stand in one place. Sharp Eyes for the party can make up for the constantly interrupted DPS from a Wild Hunter by letting other party members do more damage. However, this is also very difficult to examine as this depends on the party members you bring with you and the fact that Sharp Eyes isn't what it used to be anymore. Night Lords also tend to have less HP than Wild Hunters, but this can be made up by HP Washing the Night Lord.
If I had to choose, I'd pick the Night Lord for less headache. That and because they're actually cheaper to boss with due to their immensely high avoid.
Chaotic Decision: NL or WH Post Chaos? - Hana - 2011-03-01
I really appreciate your well detailed analysis. I've experimented on Anego and everytime you get hit, you do have to hit the button anyways so holding down the button just for pot doesn't really matter =P. I do agree with pretty much everything you said. The time frame where a WH gets hit just to start up the skill again does have a huge impact on DPS. NL do have a very high avoidabilty which bosses hit NL like 60% of the time and they also have shifter which is a 45% miss chance. Now the big problem is getting equips for my NL. B> claw with boss damage =P.
Chaotic Decision: NL or WH Post Chaos? - serulin - 2011-03-01
Nl's just aren't for damage anymore, you really have to like the (playing style, bossing style, skills, the class itself) to play a nl. As off as the dpm charts are they stil hold some truth as solo times prove (on equal equips) that other classes can solo certain bosses faster. So As much as I'd like to believe the dpm charts are way off (which they are) and that the super avoid and more constant attacking of nl's make a diff, in reality.. im not to sure it does.
The only reaosn i still play my nl is cuz i just got tired of being super concentrated in boss runs. Nls have it easy, they are efficient with hp drain, they evade all the time and keeps attacking while others are getting kb'ed, or 1/1'ed.
Chaotic Decision: NL or WH Post Chaos? - ShanghaiDizzy - 2011-03-01
Super avoid for NL's doesn't make a big difference when compared to classes like Marksmen, Heroes, etc. It does make a difference for Corsairs where the boat breaks, Bowmasters and Wild Hunters for the reasons explained above. You're right about NL's no longer holding within the top tiers for best DPS, but the DPS charts may also need some updating due to a relatively recent discovery. Still, I much rather prefer a low maintenance bossing class compared to high attention required bossing class like you said.
Chaotic Decision: NL or WH Post Chaos? - Locked - 2011-03-01
ShanghaiDizzy Wrote:Super avoid for NL's doesn't make a big difference when compared to classes like Marksmen, Heroes, etc. It does make a difference for Corsairs where the boat breaks, Bowmasters and Wild Hunters for the reasons explained above. You're right about NL's no longer holding within the top tiers for best DPS, but the DPS charts may also need some updating due to a relatively recent discovery. Still, I much rather prefer a low maintenance bossing class compared to high attention required bossing class like you said.
Corsair breaking ships is no longer issue, as the cooldown was removed.
I haven't read your thread about how Triple Throw's ignore defence function works, but I doubt it's anything unique compared to any other PDRate ignoring skills. I'll take a look into it later.