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+--- Thread: Hawaii Democrats Propose Plan: "Come See Obama's Birth Certificate, Admission $100." (/showthread.php?tid=36965)
Hawaii Democrats Propose Plan: "Come See Obama's Birth Certificate, Admission $100." - Anonymous Moose - 2011-01-28
Quote:HONOLULU (AP) Anyone would be able to get a copy of President Barack Obama's birth records for a $100 fee under a bill introduced in the state Legislature that backers hope will finally dispel claims he was born elsewhere.http://www.charter.net/news/read.php?rip_id=%3CD9L12CBO0%40news.ap.org%3E&ps=1018
The bill would change a privacy law barring the release of birth records unless the requester is someone with a tangible interest, such as a close family member.
The measure was introduced by five Democrats but has not yet been scheduled for a public hearing, a required step before it can move forward. A decision on considering the bill will be made by the House's Democratic leadership and committee chairmen.
The idea behind the measure is to end skepticism over Obama's birthplace while raising a little money for a government with a projected budget deficit exceeding $800 million over the next two years.
"If it passes, it will calm the birthers down," said the bill's primary sponsor, Rep. Rida Cabanilla. "All these people are still doubting it because they don't want the birth certificate from Obama. They want it from our state office."
So-called "birthers" claim there's no proof Obama was born in the United States, and he is therefore ineligible to be president. Many of the skeptics question whether he was actually born in Kenya, his father's home country.
The Obama campaign issued a certification of live birth in 2008, an official document from the state showing the president's Aug. 4, 1961, birth date, his birth city and name, and his parents' names and races.
Hawaii's former health director also has said she verified Obama's original records. And notices were published in two local newspapers within days of his birth at a Honolulu hospital.
Democratic Gov. Neil Abercrombie, who was a friend of Obama's parents and knew him as a child, said last month he wanted to release more of the state's birth information about Obama. But he ended the effort last week when the state attorney general told him that privacy laws bar disclosure of an individual's birth documentation without the person's consent.
The new legislation to release records may run into similar legal problems because of Hawaii's strong constitutional privacy protections, said Rep. John Mizuno, a co-sponsor of the bill.
"If people really want to confirm Barack Obama is born in Hawaii, that's fine," Mizuno said. "I don't have a problem with looking at innovative ways to bring revenue to the state. The taxpayers deserve a break."
The $100 fee would help offset the extra work by state employees who handle frequent phone calls and e-mails from people who believe Obama was born elsewhere, Cabanilla said.
But the number of birther requests has been declining from the 10 to 20 weekly inquiries received early last year, according to the Department of Health.
"Requests have decreased significantly over the years. Currently we receive anywhere from zero to five per week," said department spokeswoman Janice Okubo.
The Health Department is still reviewing the bill, Okubo said.
House Health Committee Chairman Ryan Yamane didn't immediately return messages seeking comment on whether he would hold a hearing on the bill.
I hope this bill passes into law. I dont like the fee or the fact that this is a clearly bias article, but being able to finally see the document (or lack of) would put this issue to rest.
Hawaii Democrats Propose Plan: "Come See Obama's Birth Certificate, Admission $100." - Sn1perJohnE - 2011-01-28
Idk about you guys, but having the birth certificate buyable would just make me question whether its real or not even more. I mean, its like christians/catholics and having a piece of the cross Jesus died on. Just cause the person you bought it from said it really is wood from the cross, doesnt mean it is the real deal.
Hawaii Democrats Propose Plan: "Come See Obama's Birth Certificate, Admission $100." - Anonymous Moose - 2011-01-28
Almost every state government charges you when you request a copy of your's or someone else's birth certificate, and its common for governments to charge you fees for everything. I honestly dont see how charging to see Obama's Birth Certificate is anything that would lower the credibility of it, unless of course you dont believe any document the government charges you to see is real.
Hawaii Democrats Propose Plan: "Come See Obama's Birth Certificate, Admission $100." - Sarah - 2011-01-28
You really need to get over his birth certificate. This isn't real news.
Hawaii Democrats Propose Plan: "Come See Obama's Birth Certificate, Admission $100." - Dusk - 2011-01-28
The only people questioning Obama's birthplace are radical conspiracy theorists.
Hawaii Democrats Propose Plan: "Come See Obama's Birth Certificate, Admission $100." - Jamie_Kurosawa - 2011-01-28
All they have to do is follow the paper trail and get the document source verified, but as stated in another topic. At this point, little can be really done even if it's a fake.
Hawaii Democrats Propose Plan: "Come See Obama's Birth Certificate, Admission $100." - Anonymous Moose - 2011-01-28
Dusk Wrote:The only people questioning Obama's birthplace are radical conspiracy theorists.
So 58% of Americans are radical conspiracy theorists? http://patdollard.com/2010/08/cnn-poll-only-42-of-americans-believe-obama-is-a-citizen-only-23-of-republicans/
And no, questioning anything doesnt make you a conspiracy theoriest. Questioning and demanding proof makes you a wise person.
Hawaii Democrats Propose Plan: "Come See Obama's Birth Certificate, Admission $100." - Corn - 2011-01-28
Anonymous Moose Wrote:So 58% of Americans are radical conspiracy theorists? http://patdollard.com/2010/08/cnn-poll-only-42-of-americans-believe-obama-is-a-citizen-only-23-of-republicans/
And no, questioning anything doesnt make you a conspiracy theoriest. Questioning and demanding proof makes you a wise person.
Unless it's something that really doesn't matter anyways, then that makes you kind of obnoxious.
Hawaii Democrats Propose Plan: "Come See Obama's Birth Certificate, Admission $100." - Anonymous Moose - 2011-01-28
Corn Wrote:Unless it's something that really doesn't matter anyways, then that makes you kind of obnoxious.
I'm assuming that means that you believe the constitution does not matter. Because this is a constitutional issue.
And didnt candidate Obama state that he would uphold the constitution unlike Bush?
Hawaii Democrats Propose Plan: "Come See Obama's Birth Certificate, Admission $100." - Erebus - 2011-01-28
Brilliant.
58% of Americans as possible suckers.
This sh*t was planned.
Hawaii Democrats Propose Plan: "Come See Obama's Birth Certificate, Admission $100." - Corn - 2011-01-28
Anonymous Moose Wrote:I'm assuming that means that you believe the constitution does not matter. Because this is a constitutional issue.
And didnt candidate Obama state that he would uphold the constitution unlike Bush?
Well, the 2nd amendment states we all have the right to bear arms.
Not that I'm saying we should puke over and step over the U.S. Constitution, but seriously, Obama is a goddamm U.S. citizen.
Hawaii Democrats Propose Plan: "Come See Obama's Birth Certificate, Admission $100." - Anonymous Moose - 2011-01-28
Corn Wrote:Well, the 2nd amendment states we all have the right to bear arms.
Not that I'm saying we should puke over and step over the U.S. Constitution, but seriously, Obama is a goddamm U.S. citizen.
Proof? he has not released his Birth Certificate (a Certification of Live Birth (short form) was released by Daily Kos, but it is a very questionable document), and I pointed out that his mother could not pass on citizenship to Obama in the other topic. She needed to live in the US for a total of 10 years, 5 after the age of 14 to pass on citizenship. She was only 18 when Obama was born.
So his only real claim to be a US citizen would be if he was born on US soil, which has not been proven, but even then that wouldnt matter because Obama is an Indonesian Citizen. He became one when Lolo Soetoro, his step father that married Dunham, adopted him.
Hawaii Democrats Propose Plan: "Come See Obama's Birth Certificate, Admission $100." - Mira - 2011-01-28
Anonymous Moose Wrote:So 58% of Americans are radical conspiracy theorists? http://patdollard.com/2010/08/cnn-poll-only-42-of-americans-believe-obama-is-a-citizen-only-23-of-republicans/
And no, questioning anything doesnt make you a conspiracy theoriest. Questioning and demanding proof makes you a wise person.
"The president celebrates his 49th birthday Wednesday. On the same day, a new national poll indicates some Americans continue to doubt the president was born in the United States. According to a CNN/Opinion Research Corporation survey, more than a quarter of the public have doubts about Obamas citizenship, with 11 percent saying Obama was definitely not born in the United States and another 16 percent saying the president was probably not born in the country.
Forty-two percent of those questioned say they have absolutely no doubts that the president was born in the U.S., while 29-percent say he probably was.
... The CNN/Opinion Research Corporation poll was conducted July 16-21, with 1,018 adult Americans questioned by telephone. The surveys overall sampling error is plus or minus three percentage points"
That 58% seems misleading, when you read how it's broken up. It also does not say if cell phones were contacted or not (but they probably were not), so this survey isn't entirely representative, but mostly. One must remember that these statistics aren't as cut and dry as they seem. As for the issue, we have to trust our government and trust that Obama is indeed a citizen. And if they have misled us, well, I believe there is a much bigger issue at hand. Maybe we should be discussing that issue of misinformation from the government as well as where the president was born? In my opinion, I think he's a citizen. It would seem stupid to go through all the trouble and money of running for office just to be turned away by your status as a citizen. There are many more important issues that people should focus their attention on, though.
Hawaii Democrats Propose Plan: "Come See Obama's Birth Certificate, Admission $100." - Anonymous Moose - 2011-01-29
Mira Wrote:That 58% seems misleading, when you read how it's broken up. It also does not say if cell phones were contacted or not (but they probably were not), so this survey isn't entirely representative, but mostly. One must remember that these statistics aren't as cut and dry as they seem. As for the issue, we have to trust our government and trust that Obama is indeed a citizen. And if they have misled us, well, I believe there is a much bigger issue at hand. Maybe we should be discussing that issue of misinformation from the government as well as where the president was born? In my opinion, I think he's a citizen. It would seem stupid to go through all the trouble and money of running for office just to be turned away by your status as a citizen. There are many more important issues that people should focus their attention on, though.
All polls have their flaws, but what I said was not misleading. If you want to be specific, this means that a considerable portion of people have doubts about Obama's legitimacy. Even if you believe that Obama is an American citizen, you can have your doubts or even just slightly lean towards yes (this is why you would vote "probably yes").
And I completely disagree with simply trusting the government. Trusting the government unquestioningly is what allowed us to go into Iraq on the lie of WMDs.
Then of course we have facts (which often are ignored when you simply "trust" people unquestioningly). According to the law, the only possible way Obama could have any claim to be a US citizen would be if he was born on US soil, but that has not even been proven. Only a questionable document, and a birth announcement (which hawaii gives birth announcements with as little evidence as a phone call) have been released. Then there are several people that claim Obama was born in Kenya including his Wife and a Kenyan Ambassador. And then finally Mike Evans, Respected reporter and friend of Ambercrombie, and Tim Adams, a former elections official that would have access to birth records, claim that the birth certificate does not exist. Then finally he surrendered any possible right to be a Natural Born citizen when he became an Indonesian citizen.
But screw the evidence, we TRUST the government. Just like, screw the fact that UN weapon inspectors found no evidence of WMDs, we TRUST the government and want to bomb Iraq.
And yes there are more important issue I suppose. Like Obama expanding activities in guantanimo, Obama signing an extention to the patriot act, etc.