[0.99] Dat Pendant

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Originally Posted by Viaje

Cubes aren't 100NX though, and Wards are far more effective.
If Wards were 100NX, most current weapons would become irrelevant.

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Cubes less effective than wards? Hell no...8 enhances on a 100+ item is like 21 attack. It's not that great. For damage cubes are more effective but as far as being reliable for getting that boost, wards win.

At least at a price that is less than cubes. For 11k, that's going to drop sales by a f'uck ton, but at 100 they're going to be used on pretty much anything that's scrolled well and/or with epic potential. At 11k they're easily the same price as average cubes needed to perfect an item, which is ridiculous because the boost is nowhere near the same worth.

Most current weapons become less relevant with a lot of new releases. Wards are no different regardless of price.

So, are current +2 CHTPs going to have their defense increased come Chaos or just stay at 255? I wouldn't mind having 600 more DEF for Tankadin status :P

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Originally Posted by Takebacker

Cubes less effective than wards? Hell no...8 enhances on a 100+ item is like 21 attack. It's not that great. For damage cubes are more effective but as far as being reliable for getting that boost, wards win.

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"ef·fec·tive Adjective /iˈfektiv/

Successful in producing a desired or intended result"

Cubes are not more effective.

Meanwhile, an Enhancement on a weapon with 100 to 150 attack gives 3 attack. 151+ gets 4.
That means you'd get anywhere from 24 to 32 attack. As long as you don't have more than 240 attack, that's an amazing 10% boost in damage.

Again, Cubes have the best potential strength boost, but they don't give out such a boost in an efficient manner.

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Originally Posted by Takebacker

At least at a price that is less than cubes. For 11k, that's going to drop sales by a f'uck ton, but at 100 they're going to be used on pretty much anything that's scrolled well and/or with epic potential.

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Are we still pretending they will be 100NX? Because they aren't going to be.

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Originally Posted by Takebacker

Most current weapons become less relevant with a lot of new releases. Wards are no different regardless of price.

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Are we now going to pretend that everything is digital slash black and white?
There are different scales.
You don't rush to the hospital for a paper cut, nor would you excuse a knife wound as a simple laceration.

Oh, and I'm being told that Enhancements can give anything with attack more attack.
Please correct this if it's wrong. If correct, then this just multiplies the level of broken.

Let those who have money to spare benefit, but using these should not be the standard.

I assume the pendant is something your CHTP is replaced by after you have egged it (twice?), and the potential of the original CHTP is copied over (if relevant). Presumably, this is meant to reduce the possibility of exploits.

What are the implications?
You could never get another egg on this thing, even if you do manage to hammer, clean slate, or otherwise finagle more slots on it, simply because it doesn't have the same item ID as either HTP or CHTP.
It prevents the use of chaos scrolls or accessory scrolls on CHTPs (unless hammered), although I can't think why that would be so important.
It allows someone wearing it to loot another CHTP (but not get it to 40 stat).

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Originally Posted by Nexon

2 Scrolls for Pet Equip for Weapon ATT 60% Exchange Ticket - [FREE]

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DO WANT.

THAT PIRATE HAT

I NEED THAT ONE.

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Originally Posted by Viaje

Care to clarify the relevance of this question?

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How about answering it rather than avoiding it. I can't tell if you're playing dumb or you can't see the relationship between cubes and wards. Oh wait you argue you the difference so, uh your acting kind of sucks.

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Originally Posted by Viaje

Cubes aren't 100NX though, and Wards are far more effective.
If Wards were 100NX, most current weapons would become irrelevant. See below.

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No, they wouldn't because everyone would have a cheap and equal oppurtunity to gain those additions to their weapons, as cubes did. Assuming they would be this cheap, I seriously doubt, but the difference, which you're trying so hard to clarify is miniscule if not the same.

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Originally Posted by Viaje

You have indeed missed my point. It's not that these will give NX users an advantage; it's that it will give them a disproportionate advantage.

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No I got your point, you just don't wish to accept mine, I clearly attacked that "disproportionate advantage" with cubes being more expensive and having a bigger impact on the community. See 30% boss damage vs your lol10% DPS increase.

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Originally Posted by Viaje

Cubes are not a necessary expenditure and will even be replaced to a certain extent come Chaos.

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How is wards necessary and cubes aren't. You could ward everything you own and still be inferior to someone with 120% stats. And nothing in chaos replaces potential. Provide your example otherwise.

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Originally Posted by Viaje

Cubes are also not an efficient expenditure by any means.

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No but they give much larger results, period. If anything 11k nx is extremely overpriced for something that only work's once, and only adds 3 weapon attack on average.

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Originally Posted by Viaje

Do you realize how many cubes are spent, on average, to make an item's lines relevant?

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I think this is a question I should be asking you. For me, 40-60 cubes (60k nx) which would be 5 slots, on a weapon, which 20 weapon attack, assuming all enhancements pass. Not even considering the possible inflation of these scrolls.

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Originally Posted by Viaje

Do you realize how many more, on average, are required to make those lines great?

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My vip gun reached 8% total damage, 8% attack and 30% boss in about 34 cubes, then my ski's took 45 to get to 30% 3% all stats.

I'm sorry but the risk with a cube, is not worth 10x the "higher probability" to passing an enhancement, the first time anwyay

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Originally Posted by Viaje

People have been lead to believe that cubes are a magically great investment, but they absolutely are not.

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I know you can't afford cubes, but in reality, cubes are the best investment you can make to gain any piece of equipment an insane broken boost. I don't know how you claim all this with limited experience with cubes. You just hear irrational stories and base your sense off of them.

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Originally Posted by Viaje

These items keep scrolls from booming items; they do so at a constant rate meaning these don't suffer from stacked odds.
Combine this with Enhancement Scrolls and you have an extra 24 attack on any weapon with 100 to 150 weapon attack.
Combine this with 20%s/30%s and White Scrolls and you have perfect weapons with relatively low overhead (were the Wards 100NX).

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Retarded. Honestly, you are acting like it's a gurranteed working slot. These aren't white scrolls, which is another 150m you'd have to invest, these just protect your item going bye bye. You're good at math, to pass 8 regular enhancments, with these "gurranteed" results, how many would fail in the process? Note for every failure is,

10 gacha tickets
11 cubes
Revival of a pet with auto pot, and all loots
A week long merchant


You get the point.

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Originally Posted by Viaje

To quote SwordStalker:


It'd be absurd for these not to cost an arm and a leg.

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So release an item and make the value of them completely over the top so no one can use them so you suck less?

Fair enough.

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Originally Posted by Alloy

THAT PIRATE HAT

I NEED THAT ONE.

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Not gonna lie, it's sexy enough that I'll be getting it on my Pali.

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Originally Posted by SaptaZapta

I assume the pendant is something your CHTP is replaced by after you have egged it (twice?), and the potential of the original CHTP is copied over (if relevant). Presumably, this is meant to reduce the possibility of exploits.

What are the implications?
You could never get another egg on this thing, even if you do manage to hammer, clean slate, or otherwise finagle more slots on it, simply because it doesn't have the same item ID as either HTP or CHTP.
It prevents the use of chaos scrolls or accessory scrolls on CHTPs (unless hammered), although I can't think why that would be so important.
It allows someone wearing it to loot another CHTP (but not get it to 40 stat).

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I like the theory, but it sounds like a breeding ground for another rife assortment of exploits.

Plus, then there is the question of what happens with the 'duplication' process. Would it create a whole new item or carry over any above/below average stats and those gained by additional scrolls? Or would it essentially create a brand new item?

Also note that there are no notes about the original CHTPs changing. Of course, this may simply be something Fiel's script doesn't check.
But currently, CHTPs have 4 slots. So would people get away with scrolling the first two slots with Chaos Scrolls then egging?

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Originally Posted by Berzerk

DO WANT.

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It comes with multipet packages, so, you'd have to spend ~16k NX for it :P

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Originally Posted by Takebacker

0 slots =/= no slots. No slots = no potential. 0 slots = the slots line is still there, therefore potential still works.

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Items that start with zero slots don't display the slot line, it does in fact mean there's no slots, which means no potential.

Also, Cake and Pie pets cost 10 NX, and both were from boxes and not for sale.

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Originally Posted by Viaje

"ef·fec·tive Adjective /iˈfektiv/

Successful in producing a desired or intended result"

Cubes are not more effective.

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Wards aren't any more effective @ 11k a pop. See second paragraph last sentence.

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Originally Posted by Viaje

As long as you don't have more than 240 attack, that's an amazing 10% boost in damage.

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10% isn't that great for something that with the same amount of money, again at 11k a pop (less obviously if you bundle it), can get you (realistically) 30 boss 15 ignore and maybe something else significant. That's a way larger boost in damage.

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Originally Posted by Viaje

Again, Cubes have the best potential strength boost, but they don't give out such a boost in an efficient manner.

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Cubes are more variable than wards. You can get the stats listed below in as low as (again, realistically) 20 cubes or less. It's going to take more on average obviously, but the average ward cost at 11k is obscenely high. It's reliable, but not efficient.

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Originally Posted by Viaje

Are we still pretending they will be 100NX? Because they aren't going to be.

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Duh.

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Originally Posted by Viaje

Oh, and I'm being told that Enhancements can give anything with attack more attack.
Please correct this if it's wrong. If correct, then this just multiplies the level of broken.

Let those who have money to spare benefit, but using these should not be the standard.

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Nah just weapons and gloves (not worth using on gloves though). It's better that way. I don't want to spend hundreds of dollars on yet another system of this game.

Nexon just got Bieber Fever. Dear Heebus

Also..those eyes are in JMS data, yet they weren't released, then they come to GMS. I AM GOING BACK THERE JUST FOR THE COLOURFUL EYES.

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Originally Posted by KhainiWest

How about answering it rather than avoiding it. I can't tell if you're playing dumb or you can't see the relationship between cubes and wards. Oh wait you argue you the difference so, uh your acting kind of sucks.

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Unless it is a relevant question, there is no reason for me to echo a fact which you already know.

Oh wait, more irrelevant dribble. Oh wait, let's childishly act like doing this serves a purpose. Oh wait, let's pretend people are psychic. Oh wait, let's pretend that someone refusing to answer a dumbass question is tantamount to avoiding the question.

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Originally Posted by KhainiWest

No, they wouldn't because everyone would have a cheap and equal oppurtunity to gain those additions to their weapons, as cubes did. Assuming they would be this cheap, I seriously doubt, but the difference, which you're trying so hard to clarify is miniscule if not the same.

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How would everyone having a cheap and equal oppurtunity stop current equips from becoming irrelevant?
Thanks for, once again, using a paragraph to say nothing.
Marshmellows have no place in a discussion of economics.

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Originally Posted by KhainiWest

No I got your point, you just don't wish to accept mine, I clearly attacked that "disproportionate advantage" with cubes being more expensive and having a bigger impact on the community. See 30% boss damage vs your lol10% DPS increase.

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How much does it cost, on average, to get 30% Boss damage on a weapon?
These would give a disproportion advantage since you could easily get 8 Enhancements to pass with less than 2k NX.
In case you aren't aware "disproportionate" is a relative term.
The cost:return ratio is far more in favor of these, were they 100nx.

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Originally Posted by KhainiWest

How is wards necessary and cubes aren't. You could ward everything you own and still be inferior to someone with 120% stats. And nothing in chaos replaces potential. Provide your example otherwise.

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Again, it all comes down to cost versus return.
Wards would be necessary if they are so cheap.
I guarantee you that if you give someone 20k NX to spend either entirely on Wards or entirely on Cubes, the Ward user would get a bigger damage boost.

If you don't know how the new Professions function, I'm not going to educate you.

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Originally Posted by KhainiWest

No but they give much larger results, period. If anything 11k nx is extremely overpriced for something that only work's once, and only adds 3 weapon attack on average.

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On average, no they don't.
If you think these are overpriced, then go peach about Pam's Songs.
Fact is, these scrolls exist purely for those like yourself who will go into a frenzy if you aren't constantly improving your damage.

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Originally Posted by KhainiWest

I think this is a question I should be asking you. For me, 40-60 cubes (60k nx) which would be 5 slots, on a weapon, which 20 weapon attack, assuming all enhancements pass. Not even considering the possible inflation of these scrolls.

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Care to make that second sentence into a complete thought? Without doing so, I can't possibly fully understand what you meant to say.

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Originally Posted by KhainiWest

My vip gun reached 8% total damage, 8% attack and 30% boss in about 34 cubes, then my ski's took 45 to get to 30% 3% all stats.

I'm sorry but the risk with a cube, is not worth 10x the "higher probability" to passing an enhancement, the first time anwyay

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You're operating under a strange assumption that these are a replacement for cubes; they aren't. In fact, they're a supplement.
They're meant to be a last-ditch effort to drain you of NX. If you don't like that, don't buy them.

That said, why would you even think of using one of these on the first Enhancement of an item?

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Originally Posted by KhainiWest

I know you can't afford cubes, but in reality, cubes are the best investment you can make to gain any piece of equipment an insane broken boost. I don't know how you claim all this with limited experience with cubes. You just hear irrational stories and base your sense off of them.

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>Making presumptions with utterly no basis.

I have said absolutely nothing in regard to my personal experience or frequency of using cubes. Basing your entire argument on such a grounds is rather shaky.

Fact is, like these Wards, Cubes are only rationally used as a last-ditch effort to strengthen oneself. The boost is not 'broken' because it requires an extreme investment to get the boost. If someone wants to throw $100 at the game, they deserve to do $100 worth of extra damage.

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Originally Posted by KhainiWest

Retarded. Honestly, you are acting like it's a gurranteed working slot. These aren't white scrolls, which is another 150m you'd have to invest, these just protect your item going bye bye. You're good at math, to pass 8 regular enhancments, with these "gurranteed" results, how many would fail in the process? Note for every failure is,

10 gacha tickets
11 cubes
Revival of a pet with auto pot, and all loots
A week long merchant


You get the point.

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That's strange. I don't see where I've operated under the presumption that it's a gurranteed rate. All I've said is that, at a cost of 100NX (giving even a generous NX:meso rate of 50:1, only 5m), the cost of failing is negligible. I acknowledged that these operate assuming the scroll passes, but the odds are still not as highly stacked.

I'm quite aware of what these items do, thank you very much.

As for your list, I wouldn't buy most of those items anyway.
- 10 Gach tickets would statistically result in a net loss anyway.
- My pet (and its equips) are permanent, because it was mathmatically moronic not to invest in them.
- Week long merchants are likewise moronic as I get better bang for my buck with a 90 day one that costs about half the price.
If you're going to argue that these are overpriced, you may want to present items that aren't, likewise, overpriced.

Cubes would be irrelevant at this point since, if you're spending money on these, your cubing is done.

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Originally Posted by KhainiWest

So release an item and make the value of them completely over the top so no one can use them so you suck less?

Fair enough.

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You do love your presumptions, doncha?

What you have demonstrated is that you have trouble thinking outside of your own little box.
Surprisingly, not everyone who plays Maplestory does so with a persistent need to flop their binary plantains out and size them up to everyone else.

Honestly, I don't give a pomegranate about how my characters fair on a universal scale. That's a losing battle.
What I do care about is missed personal opportunities.
Were these cheap (1k or cheaper), it would be a naturally appealing way to squeeze a few more weapon attack out of a weapon. Of course, 1k adds up.
Were these priced reasonably (reasonable being used relatively on the scale that charges you over a dollar to reroll potential), I'd have absolutely zero issue shrugging them off and never having the fact that I haven't used them bother me.

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Originally Posted by Takebacker

Wards aren't any more effective @ 11k a pop. See second paragraph last sentence.

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This issue here is my original poor choice of words.
What I should have said was:
"Cubes aren't 100NX though, and Wards would be far more effective at 100NX a pop.
If Wards were 100NX, most current weapons would become irrelevant."

My discussion with you was under the hypothetical scenario in which Wards would be price as listed under the "New" section.

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Originally Posted by Takebacker

Nah just weapons and gloves (not worth using on gloves though). It's better that way. I don't want to spend hundreds of dollars on yet another system of this game.

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Good to know. I'd never seen anything else Enhanced, so I was hearing this from someone else.

And you don't have to spend hundreds of dollars on the game...

lol, if they ARE 100nx each, that'd be a HELL of a good reason to buy NX.

Think about it, you're much more inclined to purchase when what you're getting is cheap.

Would you happen to be able to pull forth the Quest information from either GMST or this GMS, I'm sure many of us are anxiously curious over a few certain events.

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Originally Posted by fiel

Fatigue Reset Coupon - [2500 NX]

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..You bastards

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Originally Posted by Dark Link

So, are current +2 CHTPs going to have their defense increased come Chaos or just stay at 255? I wouldn't mind having 600 more DEF for Tankadin status :P

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sorry to break your dreams, but in GMST, defense capped at 9999 :f4:

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Originally Posted by Viaje

Unless it is a relevant question, there is no reason for me to echo a fact which you already know.

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I was hoping the visual would change your perception on the scenario, some people are better with picture books.

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Originally Posted by Viaje

Oh wait, more irrelevant dribble. Oh wait, let's childishly act like doing this serves a purpose. Oh wait, let's pretend people are psychic. Oh wait, let's pretend that someone refusing to answer a dumbass question is tantamount to avoiding the question.

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Typically when someone gives a question with an obvious answer, then it's implying their statement all together is dumb. Avoiding it makes me feel like you don't want to see the difference. In other words "Back in the bubble i go!"

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Originally Posted by Viaje

How would everyone having a cheap and equal oppurtunity stop current equips from becoming irrelevant?
Thanks for, once again, using a paragraph to say nothing.
Marshmellows have no place in a discussion of economics.

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You can blame your poor wording on that one, as you fortunately conceded.

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Originally Posted by Viaje

How much does it cost, on average, to get 30% Boss damage on a weapon?
These would give a disproportion advantage since you could easily get 8 Enhancements to pass with less than 2k NX.
In case you aren't aware "disproportionate" is a relative term.
The cost:return ratio is far more in favor of these, were they 100nx.

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Throughout this whole conversation you completely destroyed any train of thought we were both on. I'm comparing 11k nx, you're comparing 100 nx. I simply stated that a cube is not much more. Both game breaking is the underlining factor. Cubes don't cost an arm and a leg, yet I would argue, have done much more damage than these scrolls could do, 11k nx respectively. If anything they should be worth double what a cube is worth.

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Originally Posted by Viaje

Again, it all comes down to cost versus return.
Wards would be necessary if they are so cheap.
I guarantee you that if you give someone 20k NX to spend either entirely on Wards or entirely on Cubes, the Ward user would get a bigger damage boost.

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See above.

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Originally Posted by Viaje

If you don't know how the new Professions function, I'm not going to educate you.

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It lowers the cost of cubing, it does not replace it.

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Originally Posted by Viaje

On average, no they don't.
If you think these are overpriced, then go peach about Pam's Songs.
Fact is, these scrolls exist purely for those like yourself who will go into a frenzy if you aren't constantly improving your damage.

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Pam songs are two things in one, and can be reused, this is a one function scroll. Obvious no?

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Originally Posted by Viaje

Care to make that second sentence into a complete thought? Without doing so, I can't possibly fully understand what you meant to say.

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Sorry, giving you way to much credit. I'm talking about enhancement scrolls, and the last thing I mention is scroll's, therefore I thought you could put it together yourself.

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Originally Posted by Viaje

You're operating under a strange assumption that these are a replacement for cubes; they aren't. In fact, they're a supplement.
They're meant to be a last-ditch effort to drain you of NX. If you don't like that, don't buy them.

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No what I'm operating under is you say the scrolls should cost an arm and a leg, I say they don't.

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Originally Posted by Viaje

That said, why would you even think of using one of these on the first Enhancement of an item?

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When you own items that have value, then even a 10% risk isn't worth it.

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Originally Posted by Viaje

>Making presumptions with utterly no basis.

I have said absolutely nothing in regard to my personal experience or frequency of using cubes. Basing your entire argument on such a grounds is rather shaky.

Fact is, like these Wards, Cubes are only rationally used as a last-ditch effort to strengthen oneself. The boost is not 'broken' because it requires an extreme investment to get the boost. If someone wants to throw $100 at the game, they deserve to do $100 worth of extra damage.

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So if I throw $500 at the game, should I do $500 worth of cube damage or the inferior wards? I'm saying you don't have personal experience, or rather, far too little to make such comparisons.

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Originally Posted by Viaje

That's strange. I don't see where I've operated under the presumption that it's a gurranteed rate. All I've said is that, at a cost of 100NX (giving even a generous NX:meso rate of 50:1, only 5m), the cost of failing is negligible. I acknowledged that these operate assuming the scroll passes, but the odds are still not as highly stacked.

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Assuming they don't inflate, which was my point of the "incomplete thought". I'm sorry but that's a pretty weak argument but oh well. I'll make sure to spell everything out to you in the future.

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Originally Posted by Viaje

I'm quite aware of what these items do, thank you very much.

As for your list, I wouldn't buy most of those items anyway.
- 10 Gach tickets would statistically result in a net loss anyway.
- My pet (and its equips) are permanent, because it was mathmatically moronic not to invest in them.
- Week long merchants are likewise moronic as I get better bang for my buck with a 90 day one that costs about half the price.
If you're going to argue that these are overpriced, you may want to present items that aren't, likewise, overpriced.

Cubes would be irrelevant at this point since, if you're spending money on these, your cubing is done.

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Oh there goes my point over your head again. 11k nx can do a lot more than give you an item with one less slot but didn't blow.

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Originally Posted by Viaje

What you have demonstrated is that you have trouble thinking outside of your own little box.
Surprisingly, not everyone who plays Maplestory does so with a persistent need to flop their binary plantains out and size them up to everyone else.

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Damage makes the game go round. Trying to tell me that because I enjoy efficiency renders my opinion useless because I don't understand the players who feel like they developed this false maturity of "Idc what others think I do things for me!" is just silly at best.

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Originally Posted by Viaje

What I do care about is missed personal opportunities.

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Overpricing them to 11k nx is a pretty goddam missed opportunity.

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Originally Posted by Viaje

Were these cheap (1k or cheaper), it would be a naturally appealing way to squeeze a few more weapon attack out of a weapon. Of course, 1k adds up.
Were these priced reasonably (reasonable being used relatively on the scale that charges you over a dollar to reroll potential), I'd have absolutely zero issue shrugging them off and never having the fact that I haven't used them bother me.

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Why would it bother you? What is your current % stat right now? You say you don't care, yet at the same time I see you have some type of envy of a player being able to do something, that you evidently can't because he has money. I'm sorry but your entire argument is in vain. You can't say the games damage bracket doesn't bother you then next sentence claim it does it's an opportunity you missed. So your solution to this is so that majority of the game can't do it, thus making it fair, specifically for you.

There goes your credibility, swish.

I thought after a ton of Viaje posts, people would learn lol.

Anyway the new pendant doesn't interest me. Even a MoN is better than that.