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+--- Thread: KMST Balance Patch (/showthread.php?tid=20758)
KMST Balance Patch - Devil - 2009-12-21
Greg Wrote:They decreased the BStep delay AGAIN? Oh boy!My guess it to FINALLY (took them long enough though) make it 100% smooth with BSTEP > BoT > BSTEP > BoT > Etc...
Now you actually have to PAUSE killing to increase your DPS while training, which is retarded...
KMST Balance Patch - Alloy - 2009-12-21
Shidoshi Wrote:That's their trade-off. Other classes have far worse trade-offs (mages absurd leveling ability and their suckness on bosses)
Look at Corsairs, and tell me their trade-offs. They can attack even mobbed now, they can freeze, set on fire (just like poison, but a job before), own at bosses, have their own fj like skill without pot lag, more hp, full screen mob skills, can choose a single target to attack at bosses to ignore the summons, and have an avenger like attack that hits way harder. All of that without the need of SE, for example.
Not impliying they are overpowered, just that I'd like to know what's balanced in that.
KMST Balance Patch - Lozmaster - 2009-12-21
Saar331 Wrote:LF>lv30 brandish to hit 5 mobs!!!!!!!!!
Piss off. Heroes are the strongest in the game on 2-3 mobs, you are NOT going to see brandish getting buffed like that.
KMST Balance Patch - ScherzoDeLuce - 2009-12-21
Alloy Wrote:Ok, tell me what does that accomplish. Make a 1st job skill useful. remove pot lag ONLY with FJ, just like recoil does on corsairs (let me remind you we usually die on 2 hits). Shadow web is useless even on 100%, since the effect is removed when attacking. Shadow meso has a fixed damage, and will never grow.
Tell me what's so good in that. I'm not asking for TT 200% damage on each star. More like having some useful skills.
ok, now tell me why do you want the changes when right now you're saying that these changes wont affect much anyway. if it doesnt affect much and already fine the way it is, why bother changing it. you're not making any sense here.
but im with you on the "changing skill animation" part since NL skills are rather dull and boring right now.
KMST Balance Patch - Greg - 2009-12-21
Devil Wrote:Now you actually have to PAUSE killing to increase your DPS while training, which is retarded...
Why would a faster BStep make anything retarded? I'm afraid I don't understand.
KMST Balance Patch - Shidoshi - 2009-12-21
Alloy Wrote:Look at Corsairs, and tell me their trade-offs. They can attack even mobbed now, they can freeze, set on fire (just like poison, but a job before), own at bosses, have their own fj like skill without pot lag, more hp, full screen mob skills, can choose a single target to attack at bosses to ignore the summons, and have an avenger like attack that hits way harder. All of that without the need of SE, for example.
Not impliying they are overpowered, just that I'd like to know what's balanced in that.
The comparison is not made by looking at the strongest most imbalanced classes. Look back and compare NLs to all other classes behind it.
KMST Balance Patch - Lozmaster - 2009-12-21
Greg Wrote:Why would a faster BStep make anything retarded? I'm afraid I don't understand.
I think he's talking about now, not ever playing a shadower, I wouldn't know, but I assume he means you have to go BStep>BoT>pause>Step for max damage now, rather than step>bot>step>bot
KMST Balance Patch - Bribery - 2009-12-21
I don't see what's wrong with Alloy's suggestions. They're nothing game-breaking, just fixing minor annoyances with the class (unlike the guy who suggested 5-hit Brandish lololol). Yes, other classes have higher priority for updates, but that doesn't mean they shouldn't fix minor issues with balanced classes too. Heck, I thought Sairs were fine already and they got quite a boost with this update.
KMST Balance Patch - ScherzoDeLuce - 2009-12-21
Greg Wrote:Why would a faster BStep make anything retarded? I'm afraid I don't understand.
oh lemme guess. before they use it like this :
BStep > assaulter or savage blow > Bstep
now that BStep cooldown decrease.
they want to :
Bstep > Bstep.
but they dont want the pause inbetween the BStep, and they dont want to use Savage Blow or Assaulter in between too now since now the cooldown decreased, they thinking that it's a waste of time using other skills.
KMST Balance Patch - Devil - 2009-12-21
Greg Wrote:Why would a faster BStep make anything retarded? I'm afraid I don't understand.No no, faster Bstep = better!
What I meant to say was:
Now: Bstep > BoT > Pause (0.2 secs) > Bstep > BoT > Pause (0.2 secs) = more DPS
Now: Bstep > BoT > BoT (Bstep delay isn't finished yet) > Bstep > BoT > BoT (Bstep delay isn't finished yet) = lower DPS
When Bstep's delay is lowered more, you can just spam without having to think about to pause using attacks.
After patch: Bstep > BoT > Bstep > BoT = more DPS then waiting 0.2 secs each combo.
Get it? :+)
KMST Balance Patch - Alloy - 2009-12-21
ScherzoDeLuce Wrote:ok, now tell me why do you want the changes when right now you're saying that these changes wont affect much anyway. if it doesnt affect much and already fine the way it is, why bother changing it. you're not making any sense here.
but im with you on the "changing skill animation" part since NL skills are rather dull and boring right now.
Avenger would help KBing stuff way better than before. Almost no change, but would help survive slihtly. As I said, dying in two hits makes youm appreciate these things more. The Venom thing is something I realised while typing.
Shadow Web is just to have something usable from time to time in case of emergency, like "oh crap, no pots, if I DS right now, his magic attack's gonna rape me". Or mobbing stuff. But it's easier to mob with avenger. So it's very situational. Shadow meso, the same. Just considering there shouldn't be "waste skills" on anyone. Like shield mastery, on other classes, for example.
Speed cap doesn't only help us.
Flash jump... Well, just working as recoil is all I want. Using something to scape, and die to it, doesn't fit the definition much. Remember a second hit is mostly certain death, while JF, hit, pot, isn't.
All I'm asking is to make the best mobility class just normal to control. Depending on lag after FJ isn't fun D:
Shidoshi Wrote:The comparison is not made by looking at the strongest most imbalanced classes. Look back and compare NLs to all other classes behind it.
Yet they just got a buff.
KMST Balance Patch - Greg - 2009-12-21
Devil Wrote:No no, faster Bstep = better!Yeah, that's the way I look at it. I couldn't tell whether you were referring to the current BStep or the future BStep.
What I meant to say was:
Now: Bstep > BoT > Pause (0.2 secs) > Bstep > BoT > Pause (0.2 secs) = more DPS
Now: Bstep > BoT > BoT (Bstep delay isn't finished yet) > Bstep > BoT > BoT (Bstep delay isn't finished yet) = lower DPS
When Bstep's delay is lowered more, you can just spam without having to think about to pause using attacks.
After patch: Bstep > BoT > Bstep > BoT = more DPS then waiting 0.2 secs each combo.
KMST Balance Patch - ScherzoDeLuce - 2009-12-21
ok the BStep thing is confusing, next topic please.
KMST Balance Patch - Greg - 2009-12-21
ScherzoDeLuce Wrote:ok the BStep thing is confusing, next topic please.
Superior class discussion, coming through.
KMST Balance Patch - Alloy - 2009-12-21
Greg Wrote:Superior class discussion, coming through.
Ah... Missed the good ol' Greg.
KMST Balance Patch - ScherzoDeLuce - 2009-12-21
i guess no one even notice the changes they made to brawler. lulz..
KMST Balance Patch - Shidoshi - 2009-12-21
Alloy Wrote:Speed cap doesn't only help us.
Flash jump... Well, just working as recoil is all I want. Using something to scape, and die to it, doesn't fit the definition much. Remember a second hit is mostly certain death, while JF, hit, pot, isn't.
All I'm asking is to make the best mobility class just normal to control. Depending on lag after FJ isn't fun D:
Yet they just got a buff.
The FJ pot delay is just as any other non-attack skill. All non-attack skills make you wait for the server response for you to be able to do anything else (same thing for teleport and combat step, for example). While attack skills don't require the response from the server and you can use a potion right away.
KMST Balance Patch - Alloy - 2009-12-21
Shidoshi Wrote:The FJ pot delay is just as any other non-attack skill. All non-attack skills make you wait for the server response for you to be able to do anything else (same thing for teleport and combat step, for example). While attack skills don't require the response from the server and you can use a potion right away.
Ah, would be nice to fix those too then. Only thing I notice more is that those classes have it easier to survive, just that.
KMST Balance Patch - Shidoshi - 2009-12-21
Going back to the topic.
I found it funny that they are buffing F/P mages 2nd and 3rd job when that's when they shine the most. Poison Brace gets exp like hell in second job and you have a very strong single-target skill making for a strong 2nd job.
In 3rd job, poison mist is almost imbalanced in ways of training. Thus explosion is weak a mob skill.
In terms of fixing, I'd rather they made partial resistance work correctly. Some apparently fire based attacks are not reduced by it.
KMST Balance Patch - Spideyjvc - 2009-12-21
Quote:-Gunslinger
All skill attacks are set to attack like mage's magic(?)[Meaning no more meele attack in close range]
Double shot's range has been increased and 30% more improved damange when mastered
Recoil Shot cool time is decreased
Flamethrower, Ice Splitter, and Rapid Fire damanges are increased by 30% when mastered
Battleship's armor(?) is increased
Elemental Boost's effect damange increased by 5%, freeze time is 4 sec now.
Oh, what is this? It's not like we need...
Whatever, cool I guess. No more whacking is nice for smaller maps, and it DOES make sense. I always thought it was stupid that you couldn't shoot close range. Unlike stars and bows, a gun can be fired right in your face. I mean, you could also stab the monster with your arrow/star, but that's kinda cheating.
Double shot, I've always felt it needed more range when I was 2nd job, but you get used to its range. I feel this wasn't as necessary of a boost, after all we get larger range in 4th job.
Recoil shot cooldown decreased? It's already pretty spammable, but this is fine by me. I mostly use recoil shot for a quick jolt back if a monster spawns on me, or just to navigate around the map fast while training (we are fast, contrary to what some people seem to think...) so I guess removing some time isn't so bad.
Haven't messed with Battleship enough yet to tell if the armor has problems, but reading on the formula it seems maxed Battleship has damn good HP.
Elemental boost, yeah I guess that can get an upgrade. I rarely ever use flamethrower, because its damage isn't that impressive. I mean, I don't have blaze capsule either, but I doubt getting one will change my mind about its damage.