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+--- Thread: Hackers starting on Horntail? (/showthread.php?tid=6858)
Hackers starting on Horntail? - XtremeBeast - 2008-12-29
Rayquaza2233 Wrote:Maybe people taking a chance to run when no one else is, lol.
Ht isn't a spur-of-the-moment, get 6 friends and run thing.
blink182 Wrote:Mardia's HT is getting raped every few hours by hackers. It's out of control. Legits buying HT pends off the hackers too. lol
That's not legit anymore.
TehDrummah Wrote:I don't know about scania, but considering that HT is being held all the time, the hackers probably can't even get in.
Ht's cave will dc you if you don't summon/exit (similar to zak altar). How do you hold it? Afk in the prehead caves? That sucks to have to use 6 mules to continue holding it that way...it's like resetting a mushie except need to exit all 6 people within 12 hrs.
Takebacker Wrote:Exactly. Besides, saying the GMs aren't doing anything is pretty stupid in my eyes. Even if they AFK for half an hour or so, there's no way they can miss a few blue notices in their chat box.
Maybe they don't miss the text. That still doesn't change the fact that nothing's been done about it.
Bribery Wrote:This has been going on for quite a while now in Bera. It's gotten to the point where legits can't even kill Horntail because hackers are always killing.
This sucks. If you love to ht, this makes you want to quit doesn't it?
Thunda Wrote:The main problem is that pendant prices are too high, especially in the smaller servers where one or two small groups of legits control the supply. Not everyone is patient enough to wait for a legit run, only to pay a few hundred mils more. (Some will risk the illegit runs.)
I never hear of illegit Zakum runs anymore. (Only Zak run scammers who don't helm at all.)
Pendant price is not controlled by the market, it's controlled by the buyers. As long as someone will buy it at that price, then that will be the price. And what do you mean "wait for a legit run?" Why wait? Waiting is noob, waiting is leeching. Go out and TRAIN and control your own destiny...waiting for others to get you pend/egg? lol.
Hackers starting on Horntail? - Thunda - 2008-12-29
Quote:Pendant price is not controlled by the market, it's controlled by the buyers. As long as someone will buy it at that price, then that will be the price. And what do you mean "wait for a legit run?" Why wait? Waiting is noob, waiting is leeching. Go out and TRAIN and control your own destiny...waiting for others to get you pend/egg? lol.
It's a distortion of the market when you only have one or two sellers. Under your reasoning, Microsoft is getting paid by all its consumers, so the consumers control the prices of Windows software. Read more about monopolies. When monopolies and oligopolies arise, it is only natural for someone on the market to be attempting to push the prices down.
Of course, no one condones buying pendants from hackers here, but there are people that would. Also, not everyone has enough time in their lives to level to 17x like you have.
Hackers starting on Horntail? - MasPan - 2008-12-29
Glad I know my zerk 30 was from a legit run...
Hackers starting on Horntail? - Xiyuuna - 2008-12-29
>_> ...HT isn't CHEAP for legits. It's cheap for hackers because they don't have to do anything, they don't even need pots.
I understand the reason for zhelm prices to go down, but they are staying high enough for a squad to profit off of someone else's laziness. Splits for pots, apples, etc. The price of a HT pendant is a just price
lol I suppose you could say there is a monopoly on HT...most HT squads atleast on my server are made up of the same people....Why? Because those are basically the only people who are HT ready.
And that leveling comment....oh geez...not that again.
"not everyone has the time...."
Then perhaps a MMO isn't for you...
Hackers starting on Horntail? - XtremeBeast - 2008-12-29
Thunda Wrote:It's a distortion of the market when you only have one or two sellers. Under your reasoning, Microsoft is getting paid by all its consumers, so the consumers control the prices of Windows software. Read more about monopolies. When monopolies and oligopolies arise, it is only natural for someone on the market to be attempting to push the prices down.
Of course, no one condones buying pendants from hackers here, but there are people that would. Also, not everyone has enough time in their lives to level to 17x like you have.
Microsoft is a huge company and it's customers greatly outnumber the number of ht pend/egg buyers in one of the newer servers. Look up Hotelling's law...monopoly controls the prices, but can't control the business (except in the case of hogging the cave, then that's just wrong)
I said: "Pendant price is not controlled by the market, it's controlled by the buyers. As long as someone will buy it at that price, then that will be the price. And what do you mean "wait for a legit run?" Why wait? Waiting is noob, waiting is leeching. Go out and TRAIN and control your own destiny...waiting for others to get you pend/egg? lol."
The monopoly doesn't exist if more sellers start showing up...but i guess no one has the time to lvl even with 2exp, 4th job, and stupid 2x/4x events nowadays (sarcasm). If you don't like the price, go and truly earn it. It's not hard. I'd bet nowadays it only takes like ~3 months to get to 17x but i don't see many new players working as hard as the old schoolers. You don't even need to spend real money to play this game (buy nx for 2exp and whatnot) or spend real money to get mesos (gach or sell nx/itcg codes or items). It takes TIME to gain the lvls, if you don't have TIME then it will cost mesos to gain the items that require the time (the time it takes to train to be able to ht in order to earn the pend/egg). If you don't have time to train or the mesos to buy the pend/egg, then that's that...there's no such thing as a free lunch; you can't have your cake and eat it too.
But back on topic, it's not just ht. Hackers are at bf, crow, anegos daily. I'm sure they're at zak but with three zak ch who really bothers to wait and see? There's always another empty ch or another ch will open in 15-30 minutes.
Hackers starting on Horntail? - Takebacker - 2008-12-29
XtremeBeast Wrote:Maybe they don't miss the text. That still doesn't change the fact that nothing's been done about it.
Not necessarily. Obviously nothing's been done to the characters, but i'm sure someone's aware of the situation. For some reason the GMs don't have the power to just magically ban someone for their "crime" even though there's a pomegranate load of evidence, even though there's that rule "a GM has the authority to ban anyone at any time for no reason" but that's just incompetence. >_> They don't want to assume without them actually being in the cave and seeing it happen, or just looking at logs or something.
"O hay boss, sum guise are haxin teh game" is all that needs to happen for pomegranate to get done. I'm sure they've at least gone that far. Not like they're going to call an emergency patch/update to fix this either.
Hackers starting on Horntail? - Thunda - 2008-12-29
Quote:And that leveling comment....oh geez...not that again.
"not everyone has the time...."
Then perhaps a MMO isn't for you...
"Not everyone" turns into me, somehow, all the time. (I do plan on grinding up to 17x, just FYI.) I'm just saying, that some people want a pendant, they don't have enough time to grind or find connections, but they do have lots of NX to spend into mesos. Many wouldn't care about "legitness" as defined by other people; they just want to play. They want them secksy numbers, and frankly, do not care about how the "community" would like them to get it (giving 20m splits to all the runners). I do not condone what they do, but the simple fact is, these people do exist, and could care less about what you have to say.
Quote:The monopoly doesn't exist if more sellers start showing up...but i guess no one has the time to lvl even with 2exp, 4th job, and stupid 2x/4x events nowadays (sarcasm). If you don't like the price, go and truly earn it. It's not hard. I'd bet nowadays it only takes like ~3 months to get to 17x but i don't see many new players working as hard as the old schoolers. You don't even need to spend real money to play this game (buy nx for 2exp and whatnot) or spend real money to get mesos (gach or sell nx/itcg codes or items). It takes TIME to gain the lvls, if you don't have TIME then it will cost mesos to gain the items that require the time (the time it takes to train to be able to ht in order to earn the pend/egg). If you don't have time to train or the mesos to buy the pend/egg, then that's that...there's no such thing as a free lunch; you can't have your cake and eat it too.
That's the whole point (bolded). The hackers are supplying the demand, however unethical it may be (and I do think that it is rather unethical). And about getting to 17x (lol 3 months... this would be accomplished by 8 hours a day of 2x?), even after getting to 17x, you need connections.
"lol you could say that but HT isn't like Zak where you can get like 6 people together and just go with 1 party. It takes more planning and percision and rarely have I seen R> HT NOW! There is a quest you have to complete before you can even go in the cave."
It is near impossible for anyone to earn a pendant without these connections. no matter what level their characters are.
Quote:I'm sure they're at zak but with three zak ch who really bothers to wait and see? There's always another empty ch or another ch will open in 15-30 minutes.
Though it is most likely true that there are hackers at Zak, I've never heard of anyone buying helms from them.
Hackers starting on Horntail? - XtremeBeast - 2008-12-29
Takebacker Wrote:Not necessarily. Obviously nothing's been done to the characters, but i'm sure someone's aware of the situation.
I'm positive someone is aware of the situation (besides the legits and hackers). Actions speak louder than words; actions > awareness. I could care less if gms know or not and i'm sure they do. What i do care about is what's being done. Behind the scenes stuff (i.e. working on a new autoban system)...all that is "permanent solution" bs, what we need is behind the scenes stuff to continue to happen but AT THE SAME time, is it too much to ask for bans or other "non-permanent solution" but definitely an immediate response which alleviates the problem?
Hackers starting on Horntail? - Thunda - 2008-12-29
Quote:THE SAME time, is it too much to ask for bans or other "non-permanent solution" but definitely an immediate response which alleviates the problem?
Of Nexon? Wait... how long did they take to neutralize the PG hacking?
How long did they take to neutralize the heal hacking of non-undead monsters. Oh, oops- they haven't done so yet.
You are overestimating the competence of Nexon.
Fact: Nexon doesn't fix problems unless it causes people to quit and stop buying NX.
Hackers starting on Horntail? - Retalion - 2008-12-29
In a situation like this, I dont mind Veng/Excellent holding the altar, rofl. Scania's one step ahead of the other servers lololo!
Hackers starting on Horntail? - Kawasari Mimoto - 2008-12-29
Retalion Wrote:In a situation like this, I dont mind Veng/Excellent holding the altar, rofl. Scania's one step ahead of the other servers lololo!
As much as I hate Veng, I had to LOL at what you typed, I agree with it so much, it's funny! It's either Veng, or hackers. -rolls eyes-
Hackers starting on Horntail? - Judgment - 2008-12-29
Retalion Wrote:In a situation like this, I dont mind Veng/Excellent holding the altar, rofl. Scania's one step ahead of the other servers lololo!
Didn't they also do that at Zak when Zak was being raped by hackers as how HT is right now?
It's quite sad, but Excellent has a good point right now. Now if they can find out a way to hack the hackers' accounts like how they did to people they didn't like... (Assuming that they actually did this, of course.)
Hackers starting on Horntail? - Findings - 2008-12-29
Kasuhitomi Wrote:It's either Veng, or hackers. -rolls eyes-
There isn't any difference.
Hackers starting on Horntail? - Judgment - 2008-12-29
Findings Wrote:There isn't any difference.
Actually there is. Unless Excellent is repeatedly farming HT to prevent other groups from running, they don't flood the market with Dragon weapon and Skillbook drops like how the hackers do. Yes, I am aware that flooding the economy this way is both good and bad depending on your situation.
Hackers starting on Horntail? - Xiyuuna - 2008-12-29
Thunda Wrote:"Not everyone" turns into me, somehow, all the time. (I do plan on grinding up to 17x, just FYI.) I'm just saying, that some people want a pendant, they don't have enough time to grind or find connections, but they do have lots of NX to spend into mesos. Many wouldn't care about "legitness" as defined by other people; they just want to play. They want them secksy numbers, and frankly, do not care about how the "community" would like them to get it (giving 20m splits to all the runners). I do not condone what they do, but the simple fact is, these people do exist, and could care less about what you have to say.
>_> Would you argue that hacking is just another way to play the game?
Hackers starting on Horntail? - Findings - 2008-12-29
Judgment Wrote:Actually there is. Unless Excellent is repeatedly farming HT to prevent other groups from running, they don't flood the market with Dragon weapon and Skillbook drops like how the hackers do. Yes, I am aware that flooding the economy this way is both good and bad depending on your situation.
Excellent members have hacked characters and illegit equipment, and they hold HT. Even though that may not kill it as fast as the people that are hacking it more recently, they still accomplish the same thing and damage the economy in the same way, just to a lesser extent.
Hackers starting on Horntail? - Shippo the Fox - 2008-12-29
Its not just Veng as Synergy held the cave once. Either way. It's still screwed up with the holding AND the hackers.
Hackers starting on Horntail? - Eos - 2008-12-29
XtremeBeast Wrote:I'm positive someone is aware of the situation (besides the legits and hackers). Actions speak louder than words; actions > awareness. I could care less if gms know or not and i'm sure they do. What i do care about is what's being done. Behind the scenes stuff (i.e. working on a new autoban system)...all that is "permanent solution" bs, what we need is behind the scenes stuff to continue to happen but AT THE SAME time, is it too much to ask for bans or other "non-permanent solution" but definitely an immediate response which alleviates the problem?
There is a distinct flaw in this -
GMs are not developers. The developers work on "permanent solutions". GM's police the game and are the here and now. These are two separate teams, so the GMs can't use the excuse that they're working on a permanent solution - That's completely outside their function.
At best they're all on vacation or enough of them are on vacation that whatever chunk of their already undersized staff is around can't possibly hope to cover the 166 channels that make up GMS.
Goodness knows they've a hard enough time covering all 166 when they are allegedly on the clock.
Hackers starting on Horntail? - nighthawkspt - 2008-12-29
eos367 Wrote:There is a distinct flaw in this -
GMs are not developers. The developers work on "permanent solutions". GM's police the game and are the here and now. These are two separate teams, so the GMs can't use the excuse that they're working on a permanent solution - That's completely outside their function.
At best they're all on vacation or enough of them are on vacation that whatever chunk of their already undersized staff is around can't possibly hope to cover the 166 channels that make up GMS.
Goodness knows they've a hard enough time covering all 166 when they are allegedly on the clock.
Hell they can't even cover one measly ch8. The ht hacking is just the most pathetic thing I've seen that the gms make no move to stop. They need someone watching the altar a lot or some or at least just pay some attention damit. Nexon has shown their true colors and this phase right now is really hurting the game a lot. This is a turning point in the war between hackers and legits. Frankly hackers have it won and always have I suppose. This recent epidemic of hacking I just don't get why the hell the gms are not even doing anything. If they aren't banning ht hackers it's safe to say they aren't doing jack pomegranate.
Hackers starting on Horntail? - XtremeBeast - 2008-12-29
eos367 Wrote:There is a distinct flaw in this -
GMs are not developers. The developers work on "permanent solutions". GM's police the game and are the here and now. These are two separate teams, so the GMs can't use the excuse that they're working on a permanent solution - That's completely outside their function.
At best they're all on vacation or enough of them are on vacation that whatever chunk of their already undersized staff is around can't possibly hope to cover the 166 channels that make up GMS.
Goodness knows they've a hard enough time covering all 166 when they are allegedly on the clock.
I meant Nexon (the over-arching company) determines what they believe is a higher priority: Do they want to allocate funds/resources to developers or to hiring/training GMs? Neither seem to be contributing of anything (a ton of hackers, sc extensions, glitches...all of these still exist as a common problem).
Maybe company revenue is paying for Friday Double D's (Doughnut Day).