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+--- Thread: KMST Balance Patch (/showthread.php?tid=20758)
KMST Balance Patch - IllegallySane - 2009-12-28
Devil Wrote:I did a quick raw calc, and it pushes Shadowers somewhere inbetween DK's and Hero's on DPS at bosses (As 2nd melee DPS class). But we need more solid numbers to work on first to come to a conclusion on this.
If theorycrafting says they are behind Heroes but above DrKs, then Shadowers are now balanced/powerful. Now about Buccaneers.....................
KMST Balance Patch - Veneni - 2009-12-28
Abit offtopic but I'm still gone post it! Don't you guys thing SE is a pretty unbalaced skill atm? As it is now, classes with criticals benefit alot more from SE than classes without them, which leads to "R> BM, NL zakum!" and "no fgt mage gtfo zakum" and stuff which is ="(. I know BM and NL are supposed to be super good at bossing, but I think the gap is a bit wide atm.
Anyways here is how I would balance it:
First of all, give bowman 50% criticals, so they benefit evenly much to it as NL's. Then (at max lvl SE):
- Critical classes: +5% critcals with +140% dmg and 140% dmg on non-criticals
- Non-crit: 25% for 150% dmg, 75% non-critical dmg with 120% increase dmg
calculations
In the end, NL's would benefit less (-10% less criticals) and non-critical using classes would benefit more(5 times more DPM increase than before, but this is still half of what critical using classes would gain). BM's would stay the same (1-3th job bowman would have 10% more criticals though).
FUN FACT: Non-criticalclasses would need a 50% 200% and 125% dmg non-critical to have an equal DMP increase as criticalclasses O_O
Anyways don't focus too much on those numbers, it's the thought that counts. What do you guys think? Would it make pirates, shadowers, warriors overpowered or just more on par with NL's & BM's?
PS: Whoops got a bit carried away there O_o Anyways I'm curious for replies.
KMST Balance Patch - Dusk - 2009-12-28
SE is actually fine the way it is for Adventurer classes. NLs really need the huge damage boost from SE. Without it, they are the weakest ranged class. Reducing the boost to critical chance would also hurt BMs and MMs. None of the other classes get much of a boost from SE, but none of them really need it. SE shouldn't be a super overpowered buff.
KMST Balance Patch - Five Second Pose - 2009-12-28
Since we're talking about SE, why does everyone say mages benefit less from SE? o_o
KMST Balance Patch - Teppi - 2009-12-28
much like paladin, where it only attack one hit at a time, it has a lower chance of getting crit, while other non-crit classes like bandit, hero, they do multiple hit at a time and have a higher chance of receiving crit pet skill hit
KMST Balance Patch - KaidaTan - 2009-12-28
Veneni Wrote:SE as it is now:Bold.
Critical using class:
Bowmaster: 45%*140% + 55%*340% = 250% What? Why 140%? Hurricane is 100% damage per arrow. With crits it's 340% damage per arrow. Averages out to 232%
-> 250/140 = 179%, so SE adds 79% to the DPM
Nightlord: 35%*140% + 65%*340% = 270% Once again, why 140%? TT is 150% per star while its crits are 390%. This formula should equal 206%
- >270/150 = 180%, so SE adds 80% to the DPM
Non-Critic using class: 85%*100% + 15%*140% = 106% This part doesn't make any sense at all. Crits add 140% damage to the non-crit classes, so on average, SE adds 21% to each attack. Your formula works for mages, though.
-> 106/100 = 106%, so SE adds 6% to the DPM
=> end score: Criticalclass gain about 13 times as much dms as non-criticals. Unbalanced?
If I'm just taking the gist of what you want, you want Bowmasters and Nightlords to be weaker than they are, while other classes get stronger? That's just even more in favor of Corsairs. I say it's fine how it is.
KMST Balance Patch - Veneni - 2009-12-28
KaidaTan Wrote:Bold.You misunderstood my formulas
but nvm those.KaidaTan Wrote:If I'm just taking the gist of what you want, you want Bowmasters and Nightlords to be weaker than they are, while other classes get stronger? That's just even more in favor of Corsairs. I say it's fine how it is.No I just want NL's to be weaker, BM's to stay the same and other classes to become stronger => call it balancing. Paladins are weak on neutral but dominate if there is an elemental waekness present. NL's are weak but dominate if there is a a BM with SE present. Paladins are inbalanced! And NL?
You're right though that some classes will become overpowered, so it won't happen.
K so nvm
KMST Balance Patch - Dusk - 2009-12-28
Veneni Wrote:You misunderstood my formulas
No I just want NL's to be weaker, BM's to stay the same and other classes to become stronger => call it balancing. Paladins are weak on neutral but dominate if there is an elemental waekness present. NL's are weak but dominate if there is a a BM with SE present. Paladins are inbalanced! And NL?
You're right though that some classes will become overpowered, so it won't happen.
K so nvm
NL's are fine as they are. No class needs to be nerfed. If the goal is to make classes more even Archers need to be buffed. With the changes Corsairs dominate Archers at just about everything, except for lacking Puppet. Oh, and SE, but in MapleStory there's little reward to having good buffs, and people consider SE so common that every damage calculation and comparison includes it.
Suggested damage boosts:
Strafe/Hurricane -> 120% (160% with crit, 252% with SE)
Inferno -> 200% + burn (5 sec, 10% initial hit) (240% with crit, 332% with SE)
Blizzard -> 160% (matches Ice Splitter)
Arrow Rain/Eruption -> 180%
Phoenix -> burn (5 sec, 10% initial hit)
Snipe FIXED TO 4/5 SECONDS I DON'T CARE HOW -> possible change to % damage would be nice: 4000% damage, 100% crit for effect but no added damage from crit or SE, tables changed to 28 seconds at level 1, 9 seconds at level 20, half a second decrease in cooldown per level for 21+
Final Attack for every class changed to emulate the original attack
Edit: Burn because BMs mob extremely slow. The added damage wouldn't affect bosses, so nothing huge there.
KMST Balance Patch - lucha5 - 2009-12-28
Rayquaza2233 Wrote:Since we're talking about SE, why does everyone say mages benefit less from SE? o_o
Cause no multi-hit really doesnt help them and they already 2 hit and mabii hit there training monsters so eh. and paladins too.
iF You gave a dk and paladin se, Most of the time the dk will get more crits.
KMST Balance Patch - Stereo - 2009-12-28
Rayquaza2233 Wrote:Since we're talking about SE, why does everyone say mages benefit less from SE? o_o
Criticals, instead of +140% (every other class) are *1.4 for Mages.
So a 670 Genesis becomes 938 (40% increase, obviously) with 15% chance.
Then again, any skill that deals 350% or more is equal to that... hey guess what, Paladins have no skills that deal less than 350%.
Critical effectiveness (for classes that cannot crit) depends directly on the basic skill percentage, and goes like:
(most effective)
80% Savage Blow
160% Rapid Fire
170% Dragon Crusher
230% Fist (? dammit Buccaneers)
250% Dragon Fury
260% Brandish
350% All magician attacks, Advanced Charge Blow
380% Battleship Cannon
400% Demolition
500% Boomerang Step
550% Blast
780% Torpedo
810% Dragon Strike
1200% Air Strike
(least effective)
+ Band of Thieves, where it doesn't appear to do anything, and I left out some 1st-3rd job Buccaneer skills since I don't know which still get used at 4th job.
It's not really fair to say it's least effective for Magicians, but they're one of the only classes with nothing better.
KMST Balance Patch - KaidaTan - 2009-12-28
Dusk Wrote:Suggested damage boosts:
Strafe/Hurricane -> 120% (160% with crit, 252% with SE) Whatever changes are made to BMs (I don't think they need any -- just make crit 50%), Strafe should be more % damage per arrow than Hurricane
Inferno -> 200% + burn (5 sec, 10% initial hit) (240% with crit, 332% with SE) Burn is cool. I think I'd prefer something like 250% base damage, but this isn't bad either.
Blizzard -> 160% (matches Ice Splitter) 200% at least. The fact that it can't crit sucks ass, and Ice Splitter eventually becomes much better.
Arrow Rain/Eruption -> 180%
Phoenix -> burn (5 sec, 10% initial hit) Agree. Phoenix sucks.
Snipe FIXED TO 4/5 SECONDS I DON'T CARE HOW -> possible change to % damage would be nice: 4000% damage, 100% crit for effect but no added damage from crit or SE, tables changed to 28 seconds at level 1, 9 seconds at level 20, half a second decrease in cooldown per level for 21+ This is a good idea. Except that it wouldn't ignore most game rules (super def up, for example) were it to become a % based attack. If they make it 4 seconds and fix *all* the cooldowns, there shouldn't be any problems
Final Attack for every class changed to emulate the original attack
Stereo Wrote:Rapid Fire is 170%. I don't think there's a way they could make crit affect classes that are mage and lower on your list that wouldn't totally screw up crit for the classes that have base crit.
160% Rapid Fire