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+--- Thread: KMST Balance Patch (/showthread.php?tid=20758)
KMST Balance Patch - Devil - 2009-12-23
twy123 Wrote:Boomerang Step's cool time is decreased and now can be used regardless platform shape.Since you're a MM, lemme explain it like this:
ok i am nub. having partied with only 10 shadowers in my entire liife, how does this help them?
- Imagine you would be forced to shoot a blizzard (band of thieves @ shads) after each strafe (boomerang step @ shads), because strafe would have a cooldown of about 1 second, but blizzard only takes 0.8 seconds to cast, you have 0.2 seconds to either:
--> Do nothing for 0.2 secs (wait for strafe to end it's cooldown) and do more damage over time.
--> Shoot another blizzard and do less damage over time.
- Imagine being unable to fire strafe when you're standing om the edge of a platform, that's how bstep works atm... it just doesn't attack, you can't simply use that attack at the edge of platforms / and or at the edge of maps (where the map ends)... really annoying... I'm really glad they finally fixed this... so we can actually use bstep/sblow at zakum / horntail / pink bean...
KMST Balance Patch - Forte - 2009-12-23
These changes didn't really do much for us as a class (shadowers). They're nice and all, but let's face it nothing really changed for the better.
I'm still looking to the formula change they said might happen for us Shadowers.
KMST Balance Patch - Chameleonic - 2009-12-23
My Shadower friends train at least twice as fast as I do on my MM and it looks like they also got a nice boost for training not just bossing...yeah I'm jealous.
KMST Balance Patch - Forte - 2009-12-23
Yeah, but Shadowers train fast enough already.
i was kind of looking forward to some kind of DPS boost, but I guess not.
I think MMs deserve some kind of boost also, but eh. This is Nexon amiright?
KMST Balance Patch - Chameleonic - 2009-12-23
If they do make some changes great, if they dont, meh. Lets just say I'm not expecting anything. lol
KMST Balance Patch - Greg - 2009-12-23
Forte Wrote:These changes didn't really do much for us as a class (shadowers). They're nice and all, but let's face it nothing really changed for the better.
I'm still looking to the formula change they said might happen for us Shadowers.
How can you say that? Why are Shadowers expecting so much more from Nexon? Really, it makes you guys look like you're jealous of Heroes or Buccaneers; we're not supposed to be a heavy-hitting bossing class. What more could ask for without practically overpowering the Shadower class? They gave us a 20% chance increase in Venom, powered up BoT and most likely reduced the BStep delay to sync with BoT. That alone greatly increases our training DPS.
KMST Balance Patch - Dusk - 2009-12-23
Goals Wrote:OH MY GOD @ DECREASE iN RECOIL SHOT DELAY & REMOVAL OF GUN WHACKING. *SCREAMS*
The mage amp bonus is nice too. I might be able to 1 hit most things in TT when we get that patch.
That was never even an issue for a Corsair. None of our skills had minimum range in the first place except Burst/Rapid, and I almost never whacked anything.
Edit: Didn't feel like browsing through 200-something posts, but anyone notice that Shad DPS with Assassinate will be significantly higher because of the no-delay DS?
KMST Balance Patch - Beaner - 2009-12-23
me and my boy wife were talking about a way to fix cooldown skills and we though, what if instead of cooldown they add a huge delay, kinda like bstep or barrage, just longer, something to take about 5 secs before you can re do it. you can ofcourse use other skills inbetween like shads and buccs. that would stop latency and annoying unreliable cooldowns.
maple experts please let me know, is this possible?
KMST Balance Patch - KaidaTan - 2009-12-23
I still think the best way to fix cooldowns is to make them client sided. It's as bad with cooldowns now as it was when summons became server sided.
KMST Balance Patch - Kirov - 2009-12-23
F/P Mage
Shadower
KMST Balance Patch - Greg - 2009-12-23
Is it just me, or was Assaulter's range increased again? I'm loving the BStep delay; it looks like it'll work perfectly with BoT.
KMST Balance Patch - Fiel - 2009-12-23
Greg Wrote:Is it just me, or was Assaulter's range increased again? I'm loving the BStep delay; it looks like it'll work perfectly with BoT.
Yes, it was increased by 50 pixels.
KMST Balance Patch - KaidaTan - 2009-12-23
Greg Wrote:Is it just me, or was Assaulter's range increased again? I'm loving the BStep delay; it looks like it'll work perfectly with BoT.Why do you want to be able to use it with BoT so badly? It wouldn't increase the damage unless you're hitting more than one monster. Unless you're talking about training scenarios that I know very little about.
KMST Balance Patch - Greg - 2009-12-23
KaidaTan Wrote:Why do you want to be able to use it with BoT so badly? It wouldn't increase the damage unless you're hitting more than one monster. Unless you're talking about training scenarios that I know very little about.
Where else would BoT be useful other than on training grounds? Oblivion Guardians are pretty mobby, and being able to cast BStep+BoT with zero delay inbetween is kind of a big deal.
KMST Balance Patch - Devil - 2009-12-23
Kirov Wrote:Manually timed it on a stopwatch, 6 Bsteps in about 8.0 secs = 1330 ms / Bstep.Shadower
1 Bstep attack takes 690ms
New delay = 1330-690 = 640ms
BoT / Double Stab: 600ms = Near smooth combo (0.04 secs delay)
Savage Blow: 720ms = smooth combo
Assaulter: 900ms = smooth combo
Well, lets say they put it at BoT delay, then 1 Bstep would take, 600+690 = 1290ms. 1290 * 6 = 7740ms.
My manual stopwatch timing can be 260ms off... who knows... xD
KMST Balance Patch - Bribery - 2009-12-23
Wow BStep looks near spammable in that video. I wonder if spamming > combos?
KMST Balance Patch - Dusk - 2009-12-23
It looks like Fire Arrow's damage decreases as it pierces mobs (like Iron Arrow). Am I just imagining things?
KMST Balance Patch - Devil - 2009-12-23
Bribery Wrote:Wow BStep looks near spammable in that video. I wonder if spamming > combos?Spammable? Not by far... it needs to get about -TWICE- as fast for Bstep to be become spammable... Although I'm not sure if Bstep + Double Stab would outdamage Bstep + Savage Blow now... We'll have to wait for the exact timings now.
Bstep + Combo's:
Bstep + Double Stab = 690+600 = 1290ms / 1280% = 59.535% DPM
Bstep + Double Stab + SE = 690+600 = 1290ms / 1424% = 66.233% DPM
Bstep + Savage Blow = 690 + 720 = 1410ms / 1480% = 62.979% DPM (smooth)
Bstep + Savage Blow + SE = 690 + 720 = 1410ms / 1768% = 75.234% DPM (smooth)
Hmmm ok, Savage Blow still wins.
Compared to current Bstep + Sblow:
Bstep + Savage Blow = 690 + 720 + 20 = 1430ms / 1480% = 62.098% DPM (non-smooth)
Bstep + Savage Blow + SE = 690 + 720 + 20 = 1430ms / 1768% = 74.181% DPM (non-smooth)
Now to Assassinate, assuming Dark Sight delay is completely gone:
Current Assi Spam:
Dark Sight: 240ms
First 3 hits: 1380ms - 600% x 3 = 1800%
Last 4th hit: 390ms - 600% + 250*0.9 = 825%
Total: 2010ms / 2625% = 78.358% DPM
New Assi Spam:
First 3 hits: 1380ms - 600% x 3 = 1800%
Last 4th hit: 390ms - 600% + 250*0.9 = 825%
Total: 1770ms / 2625% = 88.983% DPM
Current Assi Spam + SE:
Dark Sight: 240ms
First 3 hits: 1380ms - 600% x 3 = 1800%
Last 4th hit + SE: 390ms - 600% + 250 + 140 = 990%
Total + SE: 2010ms / 2790% = 83.284% DPM
New Assi Spam + SE:
First 3 hits: 1380ms - 600% x 3 = 1800%
Last 4th hit + SE: 390ms - 600% + 250 + 140 = 990%
Total + SE: 1770ms / 2790% = 94.576% DPM
Current Assi Combo Spam:
Dark Sight: 240ms
First 3 hits: 1380ms - 600% x 3 = 1800%
Last 4th hit: 390ms - 600% + 250*0.9 = 825%
Bstep: 690ms - 500% x 2 = 1000%
Total: 2700ms / 3625% = 80.556% DPM
New Assi Combo Spam:
First 3 hits: 1380ms - 600% x 3 = 1800%
Last 4th hit: 390ms - 600% + 250*0.9 = 825%
Bstep: 690ms - 500% x 2 = 1000%
Total: 2460ms / 3625% = 88.415% DPM
Current Assi Combo Spam + SE
Dark Sight: 240ms
First 3 hits: 1380ms - 600% x 3 = 1800%
Last 4th hit + SE: 390ms - 600% + 250 + 140 = 990%
Bstep: 690ms - 536% x 2 = 1072%
Total: 2700ms / 3862% = 85.822% DPM
New Assi Combo Spam + SE
First 3 hits: 1380ms - 600% x 3 = 1800%
Last 4th hit + SE: 390ms - 600% + 250 + 140 = 990%
Bstep: 690ms - 536% x 2 = 1072%
Total: 2460ms / 3862% = 94.195% DPM
Current Assi Chargeup: 12.000ms - 5x 2625 = 65.625% DPM
New Assi Chargeup: 8.000ms - 5x 2625 = 98.438% DPM = +50% DAMAGE INCREASE (OMG!!!
)Current Assi Chargeup + SE: 12.000ms - 5x 2790 = 69.750% DPM
New Assi Chargeup + SE: 8.000ms - 5x 2790 = 104.625% DPM = +50% DAMAGE INCREASE (OMG!!!
)So after all, it seems Assassinate chargeup is FINALLY the strongest bossing skill Shadowers have! I guess this is the award for Shadowers for their insane avoid (you can't use pots in Dark Sight mode, while you're still getting hit with magic attacks).
KMST Balance Patch - SuperMario64 - 2009-12-23
Awesome vid!
I would like to see a video of Assassinate in action. o.o
Invincibility frames added to it on part 2 plx, my bossing skill shoudn't be a suicide one....that and Francisco crunched some numbers regarding the new DS delay recently. ;3
KMST Balance Patch - iFrancisco - 2009-12-23
Devil Wrote:Current Assi Chargeup: 12.000ms - 5x 2625 = 65.625% DPM
New Assi Chargeup: 8.000ms - 5x 2625 = 98.438% DPM = +50% DAMAGE INCREASE (OMG!!!
Current Assi Chargeup + SE: 12.000ms - 5x 2790 = 69.750% DPM
New Assi Chargeup + SE: 8.000ms - 5x 2790 = 104.625% DPM = +50% DAMAGE INCREASE (OMG!!!
So after all, it seems Assassinate chargeup is FINALLY the strongest bossing skill Shadowers have! I guess this is the award for Shadowers for their insane avoid (you can't use pots in Dark Sight mode, while you're still getting hit with magic attacks).
For the Assassinate charge up, you have to include both the charge time (8 seconds new, 12 seconds old) as well as the cast time, 1.38 seconds (first 3 hits) + 390ms (4th hit) + 240ms (Darksight, for the old charge). This decreases the value.
Current Assassinate: 12s+2.01 - 5x 2535 = 54,282%
New Assassinate: 8s+1.77s - 5x 2535 = 77,840%
With SE:
Current: 14.01s - 5x 2690 = 57,601%
New: 9.77s - 5x 2690 = 82,599%
As you can see, the damage is not exactly 50% more because the cast times are a given constant, and must be combined with the charge time. Also, I believe your critical values are slightly off, for crits you add %-100 (so for 4th hit of Ass, 250%-100% = +150% damage) and calculate accordingly.
In conclusion though, charging is still not the strongest, but it sure is a lot better than before. Another problem with charging is obviously the damage cap; I know I can reach 200k on the 4th hit in roughly 5-6 seconds and 8-9 seconds on the other hits, without an apple (and much faster with an apple). Just another reason why charging is still not the best.