The Seed: Stage 50 (Dorothy)

[Mazz]

I actually forgot all about this thing.
Also, doesn't Eunwol have a skill that basically doubles his hits/sec? Granted it doesn't look like he used it in this video, but still.

[FangelXIII]

1) Main point? S/he made a snide comment about balance with no real backing or intent to pursue the subject because everyone can see how obvious it is since 2010, which is why i "didnt address/note/argueagainst/w.e".

I didn't think it needed backing when it's right there. If it's a solo only dungeon and a player is hitting damage cap with a character that hits on par if not faster than most classes yet can't even halve the bosses health it's obviously broken. There's a difference between something that is literally impossible for some classes at this point in time and needing several highly funded characters to take something down i.e. Chaos Vellum, Hard Magnus, etc. My comment about him hitting fast, at least in my perception, was meant to be like "anything that hits slower, or less than Eun Wol, would also be unable to beat this boss even while hitting cap if he can't do it while hitting cap."

[Alloy]

Not entirely. Now that KMSers know the secret password to the 49th floor for the first time thanks to this eunwol, maybe classes that cap faster than him can kill her. He got close to 50% hp after all.

Look at the orange bar timer before he enters and consider how fast it went down when he was in the fight. Something tells me answering a bit faster won't help much. Unless there's a way to modify the timer, it's pretty much a dead end, like empress and Pink Bean were before this.

[Takebacker]

I didn't think it needed backing when it's right there. If it's a solo only dungeon and a player is hitting damage cap with a character that hits on par if not faster than most classes yet can't even halve the bosses health it's obviously broken. There's a difference between something that is literally impossible for some classes at this point in time and needing several highly funded characters to take something down i.e. Chaos Vellum, Hard Magnus, etc.

Seems to be working as intended to me.

But actually no, there is no difference between something that is "literally impossible for some classes at this point in time and needing several highly funded characters to take something down", just because power creep.

"anything that hits slower, or less than Eun Wol, would also be unable to beat this boss even while hitting cap if he can't do it while hitting cap."

Well...uh, yeah. Classes slower than eunwol still aren't the majority though, and classes faster than eunwol are far more than just a hair faster. Get me a bowmaster or phantom or even a kaiser in there and we'll see how those classes fare.

Look at the orange bar timer before he enters and consider how fast it went down when he was in the fight. Something tells me answering a bit faster won't help much. Unless there's a way to modify the timer, it's pretty much a dead end, like empress and Pink Bean were before this.

Wow. Not only was i not suggesting that answering faster would be the key to beating dorothy, dorothy doesn't exhibit glitches that bar her from being killed like your best examples. Thanks for the enlightenment.

[Alloy]

Wow. Not only was i not suggesting that answering faster would be the key to beating dorothy, dorothy doesn't exhibit glitches that bar her from being killed like your best examples. Thanks for the enlightenment.

He enters the room with like 80% of the bar full. No need to be a math wizard to do the math. And that's why I asked about the time thing beforehand. But regardless, the problem comes from locking a class to be unable to defeat a boss only by design because he "can't hit hard enough, either fund a different character or get out". That's poor design right from the start. And that's what I'm suggesting. People ended killing those classes because powercreeping made it possible and therefore they had to be fixed. It's that over again. If you think that's good design, well, good for you, but it isn't. That's what I'm talking about.

But we know how you love to change the subject to how everyone is stupid compared to you.

[Chicocl]

Eunwol can hit a lot faster than this... This guy just have bad control. Eunwol can cancel his skills animations with the backstep skill, reducing the amount of time it takes to recast a skill in almost 50%, the problem is that you need a corner to not get away from it.

[Mazz]

Eunwol can hit a lot faster than this... This guy just have bad control. Eunwol can cancel his skills animations with the backstep skill, reducing the amount of time it takes to recast a skill in almost 50%, the problem is that you need a corner to not get away from it.

-snip-

Imaginal said in the comments of that video that the backstep animation cancelling thing was fixed and doesn't work any more.

[Takebacker]

He enters the room with like 80% of the bar full. No need to be a math wizard to do the math. And that's why I asked about the time thing beforehand.

I don't need to do the math in the first place. I know nothing about how the timer works. I have no expectation that time is a factor in being able to finish the boss at all. If you'd had read what you quoted, something you fail to do most of the time when talking to me, you would know that i NEVER suggested that if he wasn't guessing he would have had the time to finish the fight.

But regardless, the problem comes from locking a class to be unable to defeat a boss only by design because he "can't hit hard enough, either fund a different character or get out". That's poor design right from the start. And that's what I'm suggesting. People ended killing those classes because powercreeping made it possible and therefore they had to be fixed. It's that over again. If you think that's good design, well, good for you, but it isn't. That's what I'm talking about.

It depends what the intention of the design was. I'm not of the opinion that dorothy is impossible right now, and i'm not of the opinion that it's very good design either. This was only a first attempt. I don't see a problem with content that only a literal handful of people in the entire world can do. I remember runescape had something similar to the seed, where bosses at the top level would take longer than any boss run maple has seen. After 5th job that handful should be extended to a few dozen, though.

Plus, there's absolutely no indication that we're going to get a 1.4t HP boss in GMS when we don't have MEEs and such to make success rate of killing dorothy break the 0% rate.

But we know how you love to change the subject to how everyone is stupid compared to you.

Not unlike your tendency to completely miss the f'ucking point. You might have missed the mark on your judgement of me, though, as expected. It's not the people it's the words.

[HeavyMenace]

As you can see, Dorothy is serious business

[dowie]

As you can see, Dorothy is serious business

She just wants to go home. Why can't people understand that =(

[Hanabira.Kage]

Look at the orange bar timer before he enters and consider how fast it went down when he was in the fight. Something tells me answering a bit faster won't help much. Unless there's a way to modify the timer, it's pretty much a dead end, like empress and Pink Bean were before this.

Look again. He never said anything about "answering faster". All he said was that now that everyone else knows the password thanks to this guy figuring it out, people playing classes with much higher hits/sec can have a go at her.

[Spadow]

There is no password. What you need to enter is the name of the monster that you see behind Dorothy in silhouette.

[babo]

Its not a password, the guy was asking his stream/friends which npc/mob the thing inside the glass was lol.
Wasn't there some huge prize for whoever cleared the seed the fastest? No one they made it impossible, scam nexon is scam.

[Moonlapse]

What a lame boss.

[dowie]

Its not a password, the guy was asking his stream/friends which npc/mob the thing inside the glass was lol.
Wasn't there some huge prize for whoever cleared the seed the fastest? No one they made it impossible, scam nexon is scam.

Hacker trap heuhueheuheuehue

[Hanabira.Kage]

There is no password. What you need to enter is the name of the monster that you see behind Dorothy in silhouette.

Yeah, I realised that when I read the other posts, but I was just paraphrasing what Takebacker said though it was slightly wrong.

At the very least, they should now recognise a few of the silhouettes...

Regarding the video itself, that guy sure died a lot. Seems to me that Dorothy's a lot like a certain boss fight in Tales of Graces; stand too close and you continually take damage from an aura surrunding the boss.

[G-Meister]

Heh, throw in a Phantom with cap-hitting Arrow Platter and he might actually win, right? Right.

Hacker trap is hacker trap. Unless there is some yet-to-be discovered method to modify timer/ dorothy's hp? Something like Root Abyss tactics...

Otherwise, new damage cap looming across the horizon, hmm?