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  1. Default Defense Ignore Formula & Reinforce Hyper Skills


    Defense Ignore


    Reinforce Hyper Skills



    A big thanks to Rom from EllinForest for helping me test both of these out.

  2. Default Re: Defense Ignore Formula & Reinforce Hyper Skills


    Awesome.

    Hopefully I'm not blind and didn't miss it in your post, but I was wondering if the ignore defense hyper skill makes it count as one or two sources.
    Taking Dark Impale as an example, it has 20% DEF ignore to begin with, with another 20% as a possible hyper skill boost.
    Would that be counted as 2 lines of 20% ignore, or one line of 40%? (Hoping you might know)

    Guess I'll have to wait a while, thanks!

  3. Default Re: Defense Ignore Formula & Reinforce Hyper Skills


    You will probably have to wait for that to be released on GMS and have someone test it there.

  4. Donator Straight Male
    IGN: ShinkuDragon HoukaPhoenix BoshokuRaven
    Server: Scania
    Level: 152
    Job: Batman
    Guild: IDissOrtis
    panama

    Default Re: Defense Ignore Formula & Reinforce Hyper Skills


    hold your horses, so basically about the reinforce skill, you're saying that if i used a skill with 100% damage, and i had 500% boss, the formula would go from:

    range*1*5 to range*1*5.2 ?

    that's pretty sucky for classes whose main attack has a small damage % ._.

    this only for attacking skills though? or also passives/buffs? because if so kashimiya and me have a problem with that...

  5. Default Re: Defense Ignore Formula & Reinforce Hyper Skills


    Unless I'm not understanding what you're saying correctly, the % of your skills wouldn't matter would it?
    All it means is that the boost of the reinforce hyper skill is not as high as many of us thought it would be.
    Assuming we're right about Berserk being multiplicative over all the other factors and not +60% total damage, I'd imagine it'd still be a 1.8x multiplier after hypers.
    I'm just basing it on the extractions saying "#damage%" rather than "#damR%".

    EDIT: Gotcha, I assumed you thought it was multiplicative to begin with like I did...

  6. Default Re: Defense Ignore Formula & Reinforce Hyper Skills


    Yeah, it doesn't really have anything to do with the damage % value of skills since it's a multiplier, however it's much worse for characters with a lot of % damage buffs, like Kaiser, Hayato, Demon Slayer, and Xenon than characters with less.

    Or, I guess you meant it'd be better for classes with lower damage values to have 20% added straight to the skill.

  7. Donator Straight Male
    IGN: ShinkuDragon HoukaPhoenix BoshokuRaven
    Server: Scania
    Level: 152
    Job: Batman
    Guild: IDissOrtis
    panama

    Default Re: Defense Ignore Formula & Reinforce Hyper Skills


    that's what i meant, for example a mercedes would love 20% more on ishtar itself, rather than just 20% more damage on top of their 100%+ boss from equips, and 50%ish total damage from buffs.

    @kashimiya: i'm saying it would be better for classes with weak main attacks to get 20% more damage on their main attack. above shows the difference it makes for a mercedes.

  8. Default Re: Defense Ignore Formula & Reinforce Hyper Skills


    Big thanks, now I finally understand how the new defense ignore works.

  9. Default Re: Defense Ignore Formula & Reinforce Hyper Skills


    Does this mean boss dmg hyper also works differently or is that still just added like normal boss dmg?

  10. Default Re: Defense Ignore Formula & Reinforce Hyper Skills


    Think Nexon might have noticed that and is starting to change the reinforced hyper skills around to fit it?
    They seem to have merged the damage increase and range onto the skill itself.

    Can't really change how it works now, but it's going to be quite a bit to calculate if you have like 10+ different sources of defense ignore (Link / skills + passives, equipment + potential lines, nebulites, character card/decks, ambition).

    I know with the change, having more defense ignore items is better, but you'll never reach 100% and will probably spill into the area of diminishing returns. How will you guys go about this or what preferred point would you stop at?

  11. Default Re: Defense Ignore Formula & Reinforce Hyper Skills


    If it were like that, Mercedes would gain a 1.18x increase in damage, whereas classes like Buccaneers who have super high% per hit skills like Energy Blast would only get 1.036x increase in damage.

    Boss Killer Hyper Skills add Boss Damage, so they work the same as a Reinforce Hyper Skill, except it only applies to a boss.

    They've done none of this. They removed Ring of Ishtar's Linked Reinforce Hyper Skill because it was a waste to have a Hyper Skill for a 4th job 1v1 attack dedicated to buffing a 3rd job mobbing skill.

  12. Default Re: Defense Ignore Formula & Reinforce Hyper Skills


    thank you for this, joe. you do good work.

  13. Donator Straight Male
    IGN: ShinkuDragon HoukaPhoenix BoshokuRaven
    Server: Scania
    Level: 152
    Job: Batman
    Guild: IDissOrtis
    panama

    Default Re: Defense Ignore Formula & Reinforce Hyper Skills


    i wasn't sure if the skills before were skilldmg+20%, or skilldmg*20% (the second one would have been more "fair") but this method is the same thing you said about the mercs and buccs, but with the classes reversed.

    guess in the end everyone can't win huh...

  14. Default Re: Defense Ignore Formula & Reinforce Hyper Skills


    For weapon potential, separate lines of %defense ignore are counted as separate sources?

  15. Default Re: Defense Ignore Formula & Reinforce Hyper Skills


    Yes, this is how it works. You can see it in the 3-line ignore weapon in the original post, where it shows +49% instead of +60%.

  16. Default Re: Defense Ignore Formula & Reinforce Hyper Skills


    Is there any confirmation that Advance Combo reinforce is applied to each orb? It is going to be 12% (14% with boss reinforce) hyper skill per orb times 10 or some reduced formula?

  17. Default Re: Defense Ignore Formula & Reinforce Hyper Skills


    I took the assumption that Reinforce adds to each orb to be 12%, and Boss Killer gives you 2% Boss Damage with each orb. You will need someone on GMS to test it when it is released.

  18. Default Re: Defense Ignore Formula & Reinforce Hyper Skills


    It's too bad Hero is one of the worse classes for testing anything... I was trying to confirm that I understand how damage works earlier, and I hit a crit for about 2k less than should have been possible given my understanding of the skills.
    Spoiler


    The particular lines I'm talking about are 346,452 crit and 424,873 non-crit. I have the same buffs against the same enemies, but even assuming that that's literally my highest possible non-crit, the crit's damage is too low (I suspect a 428k but the screenshot's unclear). 70% mastery means my lowest non-crit is at least 297,411, which if you compare it with that crit, says that my min-crit is at most 16.49% damage.

    This discounts crit being calculated independently so I assume it is adding to ACA's 100% damage bonus. If Enrage's 15% min-crit is working, that should still be 17.5% criticals (235%/2-100%)

    Plausible that Enrage's min-crit is as broken as the Night Lord criticals. But need to do more tests. And the 70% mastery makes it such a pain to hit anything near extreme ends of the range. These pictures showed up fairly quickly under testing though so it's possible my crits range even lower. I'd also note that the 479,600 in that screenshot is the highest crit I saw, so my crits are still within 70% mastery on their own.


    I did on one level make a Hero so I could test formulas though, so if you can come up with a reasonable test I'll carry it out.

  19. Orbital Bee Cannon
    IGN: SaptaZapta
    Server: Kradia
    Level: 225
    Job: Hero
    Guild: Matriarchy
    Alliance: Dominion

    Default Re: Defense Ignore Formula & Reinforce Hyper Skills


    One thing I did notice when trying to do damage tests on Hero, is that I am having a hard time distinguishing RB (220%) lines from AFA (250%) lines. Could it be that the high non-crit was AFA?

  20. Sacred cow Male
    IGN: Equi
    Server: Aquila
    Level: 235
    Job: Luminous
    Guild: Pineapples
    Farm: holycow
    singapore

    Default Re: Defense Ignore Formula & Reinforce Hyper Skills


    Personally I don't remember AFA hitting up that high, as in the top 2 lines.. It's usually at the bottom 2 lines o_o

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