A frank and open dialogue about hacking

[MariettaRC]

This one line is all that needs to be said against "We know you are, we have no proof, but that's not important"

I realize this is a discussion pertaining specifically to the forum, but grant me a bit off leeway here...

I realize that the idea of "Justice is Blind" is nearly a long forgotten concept, but consider southperry as it's own independent nation...anyone is welcome as long as you behave yourself...a Sweden of sorts...Yes what you have done is abhorrent, yes you have possibly destroyed the thing i love, but I am willing to not necessarily ignore what you have done, just put it aside for he overall benefit of the community I am currently a part of.

I am not the judge, jury and executioner and until/unless you show me that you do not want to be a contributing member by means of your actions here, you are welcome for your input and contribution.

I would love to say that everything is black and white in the world, and I realize that sometimes it is a challenge to put aside feelings when here, but you just have to. even if there is proof beyond a doubt they hack, if they have done nothing here, on southperry, to violate the "law" persecuting them makes you no better in the grand scheme in regards to this community.

As a side note: I chose to join Southperry in particular because of the relative drama free zone it is compared to nearly every other maplestory forum out there.

Glad someone understands the point that's being made across here.

While I hold absolutely no respect for those who hack for their own benefit and/or purchase hacked goods for the same reason, it holds no place here to shout "burn the witch" in a place that doesn't want to deal with it. Sure, you will find someone here who is obviously a hacker in the game to everyone who knows of them but unless they admit it themselves that they hack or break any other rule, they have every right to join the community as any other. They are allowed to contribute and voice opinions, as long as they keep their hacking nonsense out of it.

Likewise, if they choose to be a part of the scumbag community (hackers and abusers, that is), their loss. They can deal with people hating and flaming them outside of the forums, as long as everyone obeys the rules within the site. Anything they do outside of this place is not our problem. If any of that reaches the forum, however, that's when moderation takes place.

[Shidoshi]

That's up to the moderators to decide and should also be based on merit and actually how beneficial this "good" type of hacking should be. I think we all want the ones who blatantly do it for personal gain to not be welcome.

That's putting a lot of responsibility on the mods' backs, it will lead to never ending appeals to bans concerning how white was their hacking or how much it was for personal gain. It sucks, just like giving leniency on porn.

[IImaplers]

That's putting a lot of responsibility on the mods' backs, it will lead to never ending appeals to bans concerning how white was their hacking or how much it was for personal gain. It sucks, just like giving leniency on porn.

I don't think appeals will happen often at all. It's not like white hat hacking occurs often here anyway far as I know.

[Raul]

I don't think appeals will happen often at all. It's not like white hat hacking occurs often here anyway far as I know.

I do believe that's what Blades4Hire got b& for, admitting to hacking while (supposedly) trying to inform people about the source of the hacking epidemic.

[Shidoshi]

I don't think appeals will happen often at all. It's not like white hat hacking occurs often here anyway far as I know.

I'm sure you are wrong on both accounts here, @Eos; can confirm it.

[Eos]

I'm sure you are wrong on both accounts here, @Eos; can confirm it.

I think you're collectively off on a bunny trail arguing something that isn't really even topic on some odd side tangent I have no idea how anyone got on.

[Sephie]

Over-moderation isn't what did SW in... I mean, Basilmarket is Nazi-policed to hell where you can get suspended for anything or even nothing... and it's arguably the most populous Maple fansite...

I can understand the reasoning behind limiting moderation though.

I suppose the administration isn't asking for acceptance but rather tolerance.

[Stereo]

Personally I would add 'bragging about things only available because of hacks' to the rule.

If someone posts that they have a 301 atk Craven name tagged to SmirnoffRed, or similar items, we know and they know that there is no legitimate item. It's like 'Godly Plate of the Whale' in Diablo: An item with no legitimate source. I'm sure they can stand to keep it in their pants, just for this site.

[MrTouchnGo]

Personally I would add 'bragging about things only available because of hacks' to the rule.

If someone posts that they have a 301 atk Craven name tagged to SmirnoffRed, or similar items, we know and they know that there is no legitimate item. It's like 'Godly Plate of the Whale' in Diablo: An item with no legitimate source. I'm sure they can stand to keep it in their pants, just for this site.

It's not a bad idea, but there are a lot of items which are kind of ambiguous and therefore could cause quite a bit of drama.

[Eos]

It's not a bad idea, but there are a lot of items which are kind of ambiguous and therefore could cause quite a bit of drama.

Far too many, and the maple population is so fluid that the claim "anyone should know it's illegit" can't be applied honestly. How many people came back during the mass dupings, saw incredible things for cheap and assumed they were just common place now and bought what they wanted without knowing any better?

[MrTouchnGo]

Far too many, and the maple population is so fluid that the claim "anyone should know it's illegit" can't be applied honestly. How many people came back during the mass dupings, saw incredible things for cheap and assumed they were just common place now and bought what they wanted without knowing any better?

I think the kind of items that should be addressed, should they ever pop up again, is the items with nigh impossible stats, such as 255 stat items and aforementioned EE hacked items. All others are too ambiguous due to the fluid meaning of "legit."

[Bomber]

What about 70 stat CHTPs.

[Eos]

As long as the game is in the state it's in, it's too easy for items like those to be sold, traded, or given to just anyone.
Owning an item alone is not proof of having done any thing wrong; It's circumstantial.

[Bomber]

As long as the game is in the state it's in, it's too easy for items like those to be sold, traded, or given to just anyone.
Owning an item alone is not proof of having done any thing wrong; It's circumstantial.

Not saying that, but i was wondering if you would count that as an illegal item.
I guess it shouldn't matter anyway in any case.

[Stereo]

It's not a bad idea, but there are a lot of items which are kind of ambiguous and therefore could cause quite a bit of drama.

Sure there are. And I wouldn't say to ban someone for having a 27 att VSS. But in the case that it is unambiguous, eg. 70+ enhances (sure, they just hit that 1 in 10^65 chance), why not have that option?

If for example someone posts in a thread discussing an outbreak of duping, that they just bought 500 chaos scrolls for 1mil each... where the hell do they think they came from? Get rid of them, don't bring it here.

[Eos]

I guess it shouldn't matter anyway in any case.

This would be the correct answer. we're not even going to begin trying to determine what does or doesn't constitute an illegal item because that's too down the road of trying to enforce crap that's not ours to worry about.

[Sarah]

I wouldn't have written the rules "far harsher" but I'd probably take overwhelming evidence against them into account. Owning hacked weapons, imo, is just as bad as hacking yourself.

[MrTouchnGo]

As long as the game is in the state it's in, it's too easy for items like those to be sold, traded, or given to just anyone.
Owning an item alone is not proof of having done any thing wrong; It's circumstantial.

I'm not sure which post you're referring to exactly, but owning a 301 ATK Craven isn't a problem on forums, it's more the flaunting and if someone comes on here bragging about having a 301 or something abnormal like that, they should be banned. But that's just my opinion.

Sure there are. And I wouldn't say to ban someone for having a 27 att VSS. But in the case that it is unambiguous, eg. 70+ enhances (sure, they just hit that 1 in 10^65 chance), why not have that option?

I agree with this.

[IImaplers]

Owning hacked weapons, imo, is just as bad as hacking yourself.

What do you mean by 'hacked' weapons/equips? Do you mean EE hacked, made with duped scrolls/items, just duped to death, or botted? That's where it gets even more ambiguous.

And I'm sorry people, but how many 27 attack shoes do you see out there which are truly legit? Most players know what they're getting themselves into when they have items like that.

[Eos]

Most players know what they're getting themselves into when they have items like that.

Generalizations are where the whole idea of punishing for perception breaks down.