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  1. Default


    Bowmasters get hit the worst... I mean WH's rule yet again. Btw, I'm KyleXD!

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    Well.. apparently wild hunters play like bowmasters used to play; having to juggle concentrates cooldown.

    Just curious what is the phoenix/freezer attack rate used in calculation?
    Last edited by fodjgngf; 2011-12-12 at 12:25 AM.

  3. Default


    Phoenix/Freezer is 3030ms.

    KMST 1.2.412, broken Advanced Final Attack that does 105% one arrow and 60% on the other, still the strongest class in the game.
    Mercedes:
    Weapon Speed: Faster (3)
    Weapon Speed: Fastest (2)
    Adjusted Mastery

  4. Default


    So. 3030 isn't what i've been seeing. When i stand close to a boss ie. gunboss it's attacking every 1.5 seconds :/ and elite puppet is every 2 seconds.

    Are you using 3030ms as a theoretical while training?

  5. Default


    The last time I tested it was 3030ms in Jump. I don't know if it's changed since then.

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    I'll record a video for you at krexel after work tonight okay.

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    It appears to be able to do about 4 and a half hits per 10 second interval.. from what i witnessed. Didn't add a timer or w/e simple enough to just watch the seconds go by.


    Elite puppet seems so much faster than phoenix .. but i dunno.

    2.9-3 seconds when i was stop watching it :/
    Last edited by fodjgngf; 2011-12-15 at 07:20 PM.

  8. Default


    I tested with Freezer on KMS today and it was still ~3030ms so unless if Spirit Link makes it attack faster or a stationary boss makes a difference, it's still 3030ms.

    Made an adjustment to Charge Drive's toss speed, which is 300ms, and added Gust Drive's link delay which is 900ms when linking to Charge Drive or Lightning Edge.
    Last edited by JoeTang; 2011-12-21 at 03:28 AM.

  9. Default Re: Archer %/s (Justice Archer, Wild Hunter, and Mercedes)


    I've added Sharp Eyes and Threaten to the Mercedes tables. I'm not 100% sure about adding Threaten, since that opens up the idea of adding Threaten, Legendary Spear, Purge Area, and some other skill I'm forgetting and all their differing combinations for every character to be fully complete. I'll be working on getting more accurate hits/s for Warriors, and then moving in order across all jobs so this will be done after Magicians.

    I found a rather significant typo in the Mercedes' table where they had a base defense ignore of 30%, which I've fixed in the OP. A rather steep loss in final damage output vs 70% Defense but still significantly better than other Archers and this does not effect their full potential strength at 0% defense monsters.
    Last edited by JoeTang; 2012-02-19 at 12:38 AM.

  10. Default Re: Archer %/s (Justice Archer, Wild Hunter, and Mercedes)


    Mercedes still takes the lead when it comes to 0% defence monsters compared to the other archers there?

  11. Default Re: Archer %/s (Justice Archer, Wild Hunter, and Mercedes)


    Can't you just read it and find out for yourself? It isn't like you have to decrypt the information. It's right in front of you.

  12. Default Re: Archer %/s (Justice Archer, Wild Hunter, and Mercedes)


    Are you referring to Bowmaster on this?

    I did and i figure mercedes is the strongest archer compared to the others until i saw the above statement which got me doubting a little here.

  13. Default Re: Archer %/s (Justice Archer, Wild Hunter, and Mercedes)


    Seriously?

  14. Default Re: Archer %/s (Justice Archer, Wild Hunter, and Mercedes)


    The reason why it got me confused is because I thought Joe was referring to Bowmaster's Phoenix summon & I didn't read the previous post that the phoenix & freezer comments was for fodjgngf, & Locked I know that you're trying to help and clear things up for people but if you don't have the patience to answer my question you can choose not to. I haven't done anything to you, there is no need for you to show me your attitude. But nonetheless thank you.

  15. Default Re: Archer %/s (Justice Archer, Wild Hunter, and Mercedes)


    Do you have little to no reading comprehension?
    This isn't the first question that has proven that statement above.

    Here's Joe, stating and directing you to sources to answer your questions.

    And this is you basically asking for a tl;dr because you seem to not like to read anything given to you.

    I don't have anything against you. Just do some research before you ask questions after they've already been answered more than once.

  16. Default Re: Archer %/s (Justice Archer, Wild Hunter, and Mercedes)


    I did read all the links that Joe has provided me, but I just need somebody to confirm this for me that's all. Just in case I didn't read the thread right, I was asking similar questions all around hoping you guys can give me a hand here. I mean is it hard for you guys to just say : "Yes Phantom is the stronger DPS class compared to Mercedes", i mean you can just say yes/no prior to the questions I have asked in this two different threads, it really isn't that hard you know?

  17. Default Re: Archer %/s (Justice Archer, Wild Hunter, and Mercedes)


    I think they just get annoyed with you repeating asking the same question when the answer is very simple in which you compare two numbers and the larger one wins. But you really should just read more and confirm for yourself. JoeTang makes himself very clear when it comes to math.

  18. Default Re: Archer %/s (Justice Archer, Wild Hunter, and Mercedes)


    I was wondering what were your assumptions when you did the numbers. My own calculations completely failed to get anywhere close to your numbers, they were far too low.

    My calculation did not consider buff time, which implies the results should be even higher. Also I don't see how a change from speed 4 to 2 affected the % per second for some but not all pdr mobs, as seen:
    Since phoenix did not appear (to me) to be affected by booster, and booster does not affect SE, why did the % per second change so inconsistently? Was it due to boostered buffs?

    As an example, my calculation in %s^-1 for a clean 200 BM did this, assuming 25% pdr mob, and the buffs mw30,SL30,SE30:
    (base % per second)*(30%damage)*(25% pdr on 25% pdri)*(1+critrate*(maxcrit+mincrit)/2)*((1+mastery)/2)
    (220/.12+(210*0.7)/.12)*(1.3)*(1-(0.25*0.75))*(1+0.65*(0.35+0.8)/2)*(1.85/2)=4105% not including phoenix's hits

    For your checking and confirmation, my equation in Excel was
    =((B3+C3*D3/100)/0.12)*(1+E3/100)*(1-((G3*(1-F3/100))/100))*((100+L3)/200)*(1+((I3)/100)*((J3+K3)/200))
    Cells are:
    B-G:
    soa%,afa%,afaproc%, %damage buff, %pdr ignore, %pdr, with values
    220 210 70 30 25 25
    I-L:
    critrate, mincrit, maxcrit, mastery, with values
    65 35 80 85



    If I had made any mistakes in my assumptions, please kindly point them out so I can correct my damage model.

  19. Default Re: Archer %/s (Justice Archer, Wild Hunter, and Mercedes)


    The small damage difference from speed is due to randomness. I don't include Maple Warrior. It's impossible to determine the damage increase it provides unless you have a set value for base stats, bonuses, and potential. Hurricane is 250% in Justice.
    I apparently haven't updated these, which I will do soon.

    Updated.
    Last edited by JoeTang; 2012-04-10 at 10:01 PM.

  20. Default Re: Archer %/s (Justice Archer, Wild Hunter, and Mercedes)


    How did you determine the values given though? Even with MW, which you did not include, and 250% each arrow, I am getting 4440% s^-1 with BM Hurricane, which is still a far cry from your updated 5111.
    I assumed MW calculations were valid, since it increased 15% of both primary and secondary stat including stat from scrolling/potential which results in it being a stacked 15% damage. I guess that will increase the %damage as compared to being a flat additional 15%damage, but the change is not very large. Furthermore, you did not appear to have included it in your 5111% value?
    If it was done through a simulation of some sort, will it be possible for you to provide the algorithm or source code of some sort? The large difference implies that either of us has made a very serious mistake in assumptions.

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