@JoeTang; from a rough calculation on my side a few days ago, it appears that Lightning Charge and Divine Charge's difference in damage is because all the increase in damage skills from e.g. Elemental Void goes to %DMG, and this stacks with the Blast buff and Elemental Void Buff. Because Divine Charge has virtually no %DMG bonuses from skills whereas Elemental Void increases... like... +210%, this multiplier makes things go over the roof for Lightning Charge by a healthy percentage.
Tonight I will test it more carefully, with a full loadout check. Just bear with me for a bit.
If all the damage increases for charge skills work by %DMG as well, then we expect:
Fire/Bliz
Expected "Unbuffed" = 140% * 13358 * 3.8 * 0.9 = 63958.1 max, 61079 average
Expected Void and Charges = 140% * 13358 * 313/253 * 4.35 * 0.9 = 90578 max, 86502.4 average
Hypothesis has good agreement with data, although strangely the theoretical expected max damage for Lightning with Void and Charges is lower than the observed values. I must be missing something or there's something wrong with Nexon's data. I had recorded the values extremely carefully.
All the % increases to Charge skills are therefore %DMG (or of the same variable class as Void, Blast and Charges).
For the damage increase due to charge effects, the changes were really small, but because I don't have a fat-enough boss to twack, I went to Bergamot.
Fire -> Bliz: Bliz max range went from 72k to 75k (~4% increase)
Bliz -> Light: Light max range went from 114k to 121k (~6% increase)
Light -> Divine: Divine max range went from 65k to 68k (~5% increase)
Empirically speaking those charge effect bonuses look like %DMG bonuses of the same variable (and certainly not +115%, but rather it does "115% damage" i.e. +15%DMG bonus)
Tonight I will test it more carefully, with a full loadout check. Just bear with me for a bit.
Hadriel
so to clarify, in GMS, the damage bonuses from charge chain are working now? and lightning is still the strongest?
i switched to drk from pally so i really dont know if nexon changed this yet.
so to clarify, in GMS, the damage bonuses from charge chain are working now? and lightning is still the strongest?
i switched to drk from pally so i really dont know if nexon changed this yet.
From the looks of things, there must be a typographical error for the data set of "Lightning (Unbuffed)". The observed maximum of 96980 is a large outlier compared to every other value, and it exceeds the expectation for even minimum damage calculations. Excluding that value, the second highest attained result was 93812, which is still higher than the projected maximum, but not by such a significant amount. It also does not match the projected minimum, where if your maximum were 93812, the minimum would be 85369.
Overall, this confirms that the damage bonuses are Total Damage, which was what I had assumed in my tables. I'll need to re-evaluated the method in the tables to confirm I'm using the optimal pattern, and I need to rework how Blast is being done. I can't remember if I had tested to see if Lightning charge with Blizzard to reset Elemental Charge was actually superior due to the damage bonus, compared to using Lightning Charge as a primary with Divine as the reset. You can observe on the table though that after sufficient Boss damage, as expected, Divine is stronger than Lightning.
Solving 250 * (3.67 + x) = 411 * (1.57 + x), x = 1.69 or 169%, and factor in other things such as Blast remaining constant, or charge effect bonuses, etc.
Yup looks to be a typo. No wonder it didn't make sense. Kinda silly to use Excel for the crunching but didn't use Excel to plot to check scatter and stuff.
This... or more so, will Arans finally get some love in terms of damage? The era of Aran hate has lasted several years already.
Shouldn't get excited, surely theres a huge revamp (maybe 5th jobs) planned for summer that will once again push Aran to the bottom in comparison to other classes...
This... or more so, will Arans finally get some love in terms of damage? The era of Aran hate has lasted several years already.
Shouldn't get excited, surely theres a huge revamp (maybe 5th jobs) planned for summer that will once again push Aran to the bottom in comparison to other classes...
Aran creation will be blocked with THE SEED patch and the notice warning about the block said that Mechanics, BaM and Aran were coming back with a revamp. So, this was only a minor buff to wait.
Ive got a paladin guildie who is curious about Critical vs Speed. Ill try to give you as much info as possible, cause idk exactly how you run numbers. i dont remember if there is a min or max critical damage increase.
Question: Which is better? Decent SI potential, or Max Critical Damage 15%
Speaking of Arans again, I just want to confirm something.
Isn't Normal (6) equal of Fast (4) for Arans now? I'm sure that there was that one revamp that made Aran cap the speed with anything faster than Normal... But when I compare my SW Pole to Partisan, I'm not so sure if they're the same speed. Might just be my imagination.
Speaking of Arans again, I just want to confirm something.
Isn't Normal (6) equal of Fast (4) for Arans now? I'm sure that there was that one revamp that made Aran cap the speed with anything faster than Normal... But when I compare my SW Pole to Partisan, I'm not so sure if they're the same speed. Might just be my imagination.
I'm pretty sure if your weapon speed is Normal (6), you hit speedcap because Booster is -3 and Mastery has a -1.
Zero: Uses a perfect scenario Tag/Assist situation, where Alpha cycles Combination 4 -> Combination 2 + Combination 3, Beta cycles Combination 2 -> Combination 4 -> Combination 2. Tag/Assists whenever it becomes available. Throwing Weapon is assumed to do its full number of hits. At approximately 150% Boss, Advanced Throwing Weapon is detrimental, and should be replaced with Combination 1. Uses Shadow Rain whenever possible, as well as its other Transcendent buffs.
Hello community, I got a question about zero's still. I read the provided "ideal" combination to do max damage but I still don't understand it. Their single target is at ~52k no sharp eyes, which is still so much higher than almost everyone except beast tamer, and I don't feel like I am doing this combination right. My logic behind it, if combination 4 does the most damage, why not alternate between combo 4 beta and combo 4 alpha? This is training with mobs being rushed to a corner in HoH. Rush everything to one side than, start the combo. Starting alpha, do combo 4 beta ( tags with both doing combo 4 dmg). So now you are switched to beta and than just do Apha's combo 4. This tags and does combo 4 with both chars. Now you are back on alpha and rince and repeat. This is what I was doing because I did not fully understand the provided list. Tag buff lasts for the duration of 1 skill and once you switch and come back the Cooldown of that skill is back up. So if alpha is supposed to cycle 4 into 2 but you tag in between with beta, when you come back to alpha 4 cooldown is back up and 2 does less damage, so whats the point of cycling? I just don't see this and really need clarification please.
So alpha is supposed to do 4, than 2, than 3 and beta is supposed to do 2, than 4, than 2 but the 2 is replaced by 1 if your boss damage is 150%, so on bosses it becomes 1, than 4, than 1. But I am training on normal monsters at the moment so the original applies to me. Than I am told to tag whenever available. This is where I get lost, and don't understand. Can someone please dumm this down for me so its stupid-proof, or maybe a clip or demonstration of someone properly doing this combination. Thanks again!
thank you
Edit: I also wanted to ask about the 2 zero skills they get. Divine Force, and Divine Speed. Divine Force = 20 WPN att, and Divine Speed = 1 attack speed level.
I do not have decent SI, or the unique ability that provides attack speed. I just have the provided weapons at their respective attack speed with alpha of 356 wpn att, and beta of 418 wpn att ( unbuffed). At this stage what would be more beneficial to use, and when would one be better than another, if ever? or am I just supposed to use Divine Force ( the 20 wpn att) always?
Hello community, I got a question about zero's still. I read the provided "ideal" combination to do max damage but I still don't understand it. Their single target is at ~52k no sharp eyes, which is still so much higher than almost everyone except beast tamer, and I don't feel like I am doing this combination right. My logic behind it, if combination 4 does the most damage, why not alternate between combo 4 beta and combo 4 alpha? This is training with mobs being rushed to a corner in HoH. Rush everything to one side than, start the combo. Starting alpha, do combo 4 beta ( tags with both doing combo 4 dmg). So now you are switched to beta and than just do Apha's combo 4. This tags and does combo 4 with both chars. Now you are back on alpha and rince and repeat. This is what I was doing because I did not fully understand the provided list. Tag buff lasts for the duration of 1 skill and once you switch and come back the Cooldown of that skill is back up. So if alpha is supposed to cycle 4 into 2 but you tag in between with beta, when you come back to alpha 4 cooldown is back up and 2 does less damage, so whats the point of cycling? I just don't see this and really need clarification please.
So alpha is supposed to do 4, than 2, than 3 and beta is supposed to do 2, than 4, than 2 but the 2 is replaced by 1 if your boss damage is 150%, so on bosses it becomes 1, than 4, than 1. But I am training on normal monsters at the moment so the original applies to me. Than I am told to tag whenever available. This is where I get lost, and don't understand. Can someone please dumm this down for me so its stupid-proof, or maybe a clip or demonstration of someone properly doing this combination. Thanks again!
thank you
Edit: I also wanted to ask about the 2 zero skills they get. Divine Force, and Divine Speed. Divine Force = 20 WPN att, and Divine Speed = 1 attack speed level.
I do not have decent SI, or the unique ability that provides attack speed. I just have the provided weapons at their respective attack speed with alpha of 356 wpn att, and beta of 418 wpn att ( unbuffed). At this stage what would be more beneficial to use, and when would one be better than another, if ever? or am I just supposed to use Divine Force ( the 20 wpn att) always?
The combo should be doable at Fast (5), with the final hit of Beta's 4 still Assisting. Advanced Weapon Throw is the strongest if all the hits can connect. In many training situations, this may not be the case, especially if you're rushing into corners and you activate it the wrong way.
Alpha 4-2-3 is the strongest because they just chain together well. If for some reason there's still a CD on 4, use the first hit of 1 to clear it. Do that until you can tag to Beta, and if you can hit the monsters with most or all of the hits of AWT, use 2-4-2. Otherwise, I would use 3-4-1. You can use Beta's combination 3 and have it Assist with the first hit, and then Assist with Whirlwind. Immediately switch to combination 4, and you can Assist on Giga Crash, leaving the twisters on the monsters you pulled or already rushed beforehand. Alternatively, you can Assist twice on Whirlwind and then switch to Combination 4. Not 100% sure if you can Assist twice on whirlwind and switch to Giga Crash to get an Assist on that too.
Depending on the situation, beta's Combination 4 isn't necessarily the strongest to Assist with. If monsters are all stacked together, only Assisting with Giga Crash will be stronger. Having Advanced Rolling Assaulter come out twice from Advanced Whirlwind is really strong. Advanced Weapon Throw is super strong if all its hits connect, and the Assist helps that, but even on its own it has the highest damage potential. Otherwise, Assist on Combination 4 is good for covering a huge area.
Originally Posted by zebroid
Is kaiser's hits/s assuming all 3 wingbeats trigger cursebite?
In my experience, you have to jump around and use Gigas if you want Wingbeat to proc Cursebite while still using your main attack
after the 50 100 input limit, 'final attack' effects will not proc until the character moves.
kaiser is slightly different, it's changed back & forth between working & not working, so i dont know, even though i'm a kaiser :(
I'm struggling with a new equip upgrade. unbuffed pic below. I'd like to ignore the 2% str neb.
weapon empress scimitar
unbreakable will 40%
Leafre Codex 30%
Gollux Set 30%
light wash L2 15%
Rhinne's 10%
BTamer card 6%
3 Pirates card 6%
missing 10% shrugs
looks like 0.82114 = 1 - (1-0.4)*(1-0.3)*(1-0.3)*(1-0.15)*(1-0.1)*(1-0.1)*(1-0.06)*(1-0.06)
vs 0.91862 = 1 - (1-0.4)*(1-0.35)*(1-0.3)*(1-0.3)*.... FIXED ty JoeTang
and i only have one additional 9%atk potential besides the unique emblem
Spoiler
Spoiler
keep the ignore? or just cube for +21% atk? secondary option, keep ignore, and recube the unique one to legendary
i think this is enough information o_o
Last edited by kayeyearekay; 2014-01-30 at 12:44 PM.
Reason: math error
I'm struggling with a new equip upgrade. unbuffed pic below. I'd like to ignore the 2% str neb.
weapon empress scimitar
unbreakable will 40%
Leafre Codex 30%
Gollux Set 30%
light wash L2 15%
Rhinne's 10%
BTamer card 6%
3 Pirates card 6%
missing 10% shrugs
looks like 0.82114 = 1 - (1-0.4)*(1-0.3)*(1-0.3)*(1-0.15)*(1-0.1)*(1-0.1)*(1-0.06)*(1-0.06)
vs 0.92862 =1 - (1-0.4)*(0.35)*(1-0.3)*(1-0.3)*....
and i only have one additional 9%atk potential besides the unique emblem
Spoiler
Spoiler
keep the ignore? or just cube for +21% atk? secondary option, keep ignore, and recube the unique one to legendary
i think this is enough information o_o
Your math is about there but I think you got something wrong. (1-0.4)*(1-0.3)*....... gives you the PDR reduction factor, which you multiply to a boss's PDR to find the effective PDR. You then subtract that from 1 to give your effective DPS after factoring in PDR and PDRignore.
The earlier set of PDRignore values mean that the boss's PDR is down to ~20% of its original value, and with the emblem the boss's PDR is down to ~9%. How much DPS increase that is for you is dependent on the boss, and bigger PDR means bigger DPS increase. For reference, against Hilla, the earlier set lets you do 90% of your full DPS, and with the emblem that goes up to 95.5%.
Is that alot for you? Are you going to C/bosses often? If no, then no.
Re: Warrior %/s (KMS RED & GMS Unleashed)
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Originally Posted by hadriel
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