[KMST] [1.2.278] Even moar skill balancing

[Chameleonic]

The way the game is structured is a spectrum:

Mobbing ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Single-Target

Mages --- MM --- Paladin --- Shadower --- Bucs --- Drk --- Heroes --- Aran --- BM --- NL --- Corsairs

Thats not even close to how it currently is in GMS let alone how it will be after these balance changes come into effect...

And Heroes, Paladins, DrKs, and Arans are all (far as I know) more effective mobbers than MMs. Maybe throw in Shadowers as well, I'm not as sure but BStep seems to have pretty impressive % damage.

Pierce is impressive on paper, but in reality...

So so true.

Stats on paper are very different from what a class plays like. So many are misinformed and mislead about MM, so much to correct...sigh I cant be bothered anymore.


DPS is very misleading, sure shadowers might look to have low DPS but outside of Mages/Bishops they are the fastest trainers, and they do much better on bosses since they can kill bosses MM cant even attempt.

[Avery]

I hope to God that this isn't the last update. Marksmen need more of a boost 1v1, especially since the idiotic workers at GMS fail to make snipe static

Any idea what the new pierce charge time is?

[Kawasari Mimoto22]

Are you counting MM's Pierce? Because I think 850%+ damage per monster is pretty good without criticals.

I did not count that in. I used the other person's "spectrum" chart. He had Corsair before NL when it came to single-target DPS. MMs are already mob-oriented.

[motomage]

Oblivion Monk - Weak to Ice, Weak to Lightning, Weak to Poison
Oblivion Monk Trainee - Weak to Ice, Weak to Lightning, Weak to Poison

Oblivion Guardian - Weak to Ice, Weak to Lightning, Weak to Poison
Chief Oblivion Guardian - Weak to Poison

*faints*

[Rick]

Sorry, I'm a little late to the party.

Why do I need to play a mage when they are clearly overpowered in this game?

Why do you think that there are more than 300 level 200 mages in GMS and only like 50 level 200s in other jobs

*whisper* Most of them are Bishops *whisper*. I think you're getting Mages confused with Bishops. And FYI, just because many people play something, doesn't make it overpowered.

and what's wrong with asking more DPS to make them the single target DPS king again? Since in most games paper hp = monster DPS

Why should they be? Because they suck at training? Well guess what, Arch Mages suck at bossing, but you seem to want to remove their title as the training king. Your post is thickly layered in hypocrisy.

I am sorry for your ignorance and want to make urself look like an ass

lol you are the one who is trolling since you are making zero contribution to this discussion AT ALL while spamming useless sh't that nobody cares

hahahaohwow.jpg the irony is suffocating.

because mage sucks and is boring to play

FYI mage is already the most abundant class of maple

But if Mages are so overpowered, how can they suck? You're a very confused little boy. As for the being abundant, you are again thinking of Bishops, whom I will agree are overpowered, but leave Arch Mages out of it.

Tell me something, I seem to remember a Magician hating person from forever ago named StillTheKing, from the Nexon forums. Are you him? If so, hi there it's RDal ;)

[PirateIzzy]

I love how King keeps contradicting himself.

[Dusk]

MMs definitely need a single target boost. I think they should fix Snipe's cooldown, set it to 4000% and set the damage cap to 500k. I think BMs need a small damage boost as well.

MM mobbing could be improved by allowing Pierce to fire when bumped instead of cancelled (maybe make it usable in midair but remove the ability to jump while using it?) and making Dragon Breath hit like 10 monsters.

Didn't know this. I once watched a Corsair train at Skeles and I wasn't very impressed at his speed/rate of killing. Definitely slower than Heroes/Paladins.

The majority of Corsairs in every version are terrible at playing their class. There shouldn't be that much of a gap. Corsairs are pretty good mobbers, the biggest problem we have is a lack of a rushing skill, and the increase in maneuverability provided by the new Recoil cooldown should be enough to compensate for that.

[KaidaTan]

The majority of Corsairs in every version are terrible at playing their class. There shouldn't be that much of a gap. Corsairs are pretty good mobbers, the biggest problem we have is a lack of a rushing skill, and the increase in maneuverability provided by the new Recoil cooldown should be enough to compensate for that.

It's possible that the Corsair he was watching didn't have a decent level of Torpedo. Torp is pretty nuts though, as is Air Strike every 9 seconds.

[shouri]

In regards to the statement "In most games paper hp = monster DPS" I'd like to point out that this occurs typically in RPGs except that instead of damage per second, it's just damage (see Glass Cannon). And this is the trade off that those specific RPG makers chose to make.

On another note, why does that HAVE to be the trade off? Why can't it just happen be something else... like oh say... maneuverability... or maybe easier training... or something else. Why does every game have to conform to 1 standard trade off? All I'm saying is that you shouldn't apply the standard other games set to another, completely different game.

[FrozNlite]

I guess this makes it obvious that Nexon is not planning on making ArchMages / Bishops strong enough to boss, but rather balance them with each other. This, to me, confirms the idea of the concept Nexon Korea has of Mages, fast trainers but bad bosshunters (the total opposed to Bowmasters) and they are not plannign on changing that.

I sadly have to agree with this, which kills me to say. Draconius on SW and I got into it over this fact, as he said the major updates Nexon Korea would give to ArchMages would be to boost their mobbing abilities. Sadly, Korea doesn't get it: (1) Ultimates, as they are currently, are already stronger than they need to be. (2) Creating a class built around mobbing is FANTASTIC if there's SOMETHING ELSE TO MOB BESIDES TRAINING MONSTERS. This is the key point I don't think people really understand yet. If you understand the first point, then you'll recognize that, if Korea is trying to keep ArchMages the best mobbing class in the game, they *technically* don't need any boosts. Which is clearly untrue, as no one plays the classes. Why? Because there's nothing to look forward to with your skills. Nothing to use them on.

By all means make us the best mobbing class in the game; hell, we'd love to be a godly mobbing class over a godly single target class anyday provided we had something that actually CHALLENGED OUR MOBBING ABILITIES.

Get it together, Nexon.

From the look of it Nexon is going to give all bucs moves stunning properties and not give them passive critical.

Aww, poor Buccs. Oh wait, Mages don't have passive crits either, and you still solo bosses four times faster than us. Yeah, maybe the mobbing is different, but hey, at least you get something fun and challenging to do when you level. We get to stay at Skeles - just like the last level!

Nice to see a Bishop Monopoly will soon crumble. Now let's do something about that Mage monopoly. .__.
Glad to see F/P finally having more powerful base skills than I/L. Now let's nerf Genesis to 600, or buff F/P and I/L to 670. There's no reason a Bishop skill should have a higher base than actual attack classes. *inb4AMPragingbishops*

Again, such a boost is not needed. Honestly I'm surprised the ultimates were strengthened at all; they're already strong enough. The element aspect of this game that completely obliterates Magician damage as a whole is what needs to be looked at, not boosting ultimates.

Fire/Ice immune mobs still take 1 damage with every ultimate cast no matter how strong you make the base attack power .

Um wow they basically made ILs the new lolFPs. Seems really unfair to me, ILs basically have nothing on FPs except for being able to freeze now. >_>;

I sadly agree :(. But hey, at least there are more ILs!

Another idea could be progressively stronger snipe as you level (they just made fire arrow change at level 40 and level 50 so I don't see why not). say starting with 100k til level 140 or 150, 200k at 160 or 170 and 300k afterward or something like that.

Just to clarify: the Fire Arrow change was animation changes at Lv. 40 and 50. It had nothing more to do with the skill than make it flashy.

PRAISE ALLAH, 30 MORE BASE ATTACK AT MOST, THESE UPDATES HAVE MADE LIFE COMPLETE!

That was sarcasm, they're hardly good updates. Continuously buffing ultimates shows they don't understand the problem. And the measly boost to other skills was complemented by Chief Oblivions being the only ones NOT made ice weak to form a complete slap in the face to I/L at least. They are now also starting to break the balance between I/L and F/P. Pending more I/L updates, F/P now dominate in 2nd, 3rd and 4th job.

Completely agree with this. Either design the classes to contribute something to bosses or release challenging mobbing-related content worth leveling for.

Tell me why NLs shouldn't be buffed?

Why do I need to play a mage when they are clearly overpowered in this game?

Why do you think that there are more than 300 level 200 mages in GMS and only like 50 level 200s in other jobs

Biggest joke on this thread.

NLs should be "buffed" in making useless skills useful, like many have already said.

We're overpowered at an aspect of the game that isn't worth playing for if it's all we get.

There are more because we have faster training skills, and BF/Anego availability is limited, so competition is fierce. I guarantee you if Bigfoot and/or Anego mini-dungeons were released, you'd see infinitely more Lv. 200 weapon attack classes as compared to Magicians.

[IllegallySane]

Aww, poor Buccs. Oh wait, Mages don't have passive crits either, and you still solo bosses four times faster than us. Yeah, maybe the mobbing is different, but hey, at least you get something fun and challenging to do when you level. We get to stay at Skeles - just like the last level!

Not what the stats in Dusk's spreadsheet says. Paralyze alone seems to only be slightly weaker than the Untransformed state. Add in Elquines and F/P AMs are hitting around as hard as a Buccaneer? o.O

Reference: http://img6.imageshack.us/img6/2439/screeny5.png

[Chameleonic]

For those who read Korean...do the KMS forums have this much lively discussion about the rebalancing?

[Xakris]

I also would like to see better Ifrit and Elquiness, because it not fair that mage class has worse summon than archer :P

[Schrono]

Increasing the range on summons by 100% would be all that's really needed.

[Magatia]

I'm not sure if anyone noticed this, but the new rings made snipe less useful than ever. Now snipe's dmg can be crap compared to an appled strafe.

[Tikey]

I also would like to see better Ifrit and Elquiness, because it not fair that mage class has worse summon than archer :P

Well, since the summons are due to the two AMs "expanding their knowledge" outside of their branch, it makes sense that the summons themselves are slightly defective and not as strong due to lack of knowledge of the target element. Of course, this is Nexon.

[Russt]

Well, since the summons are due to the two AMs "expanding their knowledge" outside of their branch, it makes sense that the summons themselves are slightly defective and not as strong due to lack of knowledge of the target element. Of course, this is Nexon.

It's not like mastery of fire and ice are particularly central to archery either.

[TamilTiger1]

I also would like to see better Ifrit and Elquiness, because it not fair that mage class has worse summon than archer :P

LOL i find my summon on Bowmaster completely useless. The ice based summons are somewhat usefull as they freeze monsters nearby, but the fire type are completely useless at this point. The extra damage they add is just pathetic, even compared to a mages already low dps. You should be able to see how the extra damage is useless to a BM who are near the top of single target damages. You can't even notice the damage their summons add to their dps. Only thing I can see the archers summons have over the mage summon is just looks lol...

[Chilly]

I'm not sure if this has been posted yet, but this gives I/L AMs 25% more DPS, which brings a luk AM up to about 80k DPS. It's a 22.4% increase for F/P AMs, bringing them up to 84k DPS. I'd say that the rebalancing thus far is a success.

So...I am still looking forward to Evan since I am a mage at heart and I would gladly sacrifice some (apparently even more) excess mobbing for some decent DPS but if I remember correctly an F/P AM does not lag too far behind an Evan in single-target DPS and with these changes I think the gap has closed considerably or has it? Number wizards, if it pleases you could you just give me a rough estimate of the "new" AM versus Evans because I don't want to go crazy scrolling and such only to find that my AM damage will not really be greater than a new character I will likely put too much time into.

[Tikey]

It's not like mastery of fire and ice are particularly central to archery either.

Well, Hunters started out with exploding arrows, so I guess the fire part can be justified to a degree. I got nothing on the ice part though. x3