Drop rate statistics - let's party!

Been a long time since we did these.
The purpose of this round will be to find out how drop rate works in parties.
However, we need as much data as possible for all configurations, in order to establish the baseline and individual multipliers, so don't refrain from posting just because, "I'm just running solo with my Big Spider, nothing interesting about that." All data is useful.

For parties, we want
- normal party runs (2+ people going in and everyone attacking)
- mule party runs (2+ people going in, only one person attacking)
- "forgotten" party runs (1+ people going in, but they're in a party with people outside the map. This can be accomplished by inviting someone who's outside to your existing or one-man party after you've gone into the map)

General method:
1. Run DIPQ and count how many Sweetheart Chocos and Lovely Valentine's Day Boxes you loot.
2. Post, for each run:
- Whether you are in Reboot or not.
- How many people in the party, which ones are in the map, and which ones are attacking.
- Detailed list of drop enhancements of each person in the party (i.e. don't just say "I have 240% drop" but break it down to familiar, buff, equips, inner ability, and skills. Part of the purpose of these tests is to tell how all those things combine).
- How many Sweetheart Chocos and Valentine's Boxes each person in the party looted.

Details:
1. Take care to loot all chocos
2. Don't count the bonus stage.
3. If the horse in stage 2 spawns mobs, either deduct the items they drop (if you can) or don't post data for the run.
4. If you throw up due to a combo orb, don't post your Sweetheart Choco data for that run.
5. Make a single post in this thread, and edit it every day with new data, rather than adding more replies.

Thank you, and let's get this party started!

Feb 18:
Kradia, solo, Mutant Ribbon Pig familiar + 20% drop on ring
Chocos: 197, 219, 205, 212
Boxes: 36, 38, 35, 55
Kradia, solo, Big Spider Familiar + Monkey Spirits (suspected drop buff)
Chocos: 170, 182, 191, 188
Boxes: 37, 42, 35, 36

Feb 20:
Kradia, solo, no drop buffs
Chocos: 133, 134, 119, 127, 121
Boxes: 29, 20, 21, 24, 22

Feb 27:
Kradia, solo, no drop buffs
Chocos: 127, 123, 131, 127
Boxes: 14, 22, 22, 17, 27

feb 18:
bello, solo, mutant ribbon pig familiar, 8%drop IA, 40%drop chtp, greed pendant
chocos: 268
boxes: 66

Let me know what kind of data you'd prefer, @SaptaZapta, I have two characters with a good amount of drop rate as well as two computers and multiple accounts, so there's quite a large amount of possibilities. I probably won't be able to start for a few days though, been busy with moving over some files from my old computer to the new one so I haven't been playing.

Character 1: 165% drop rate, 65% tradeable, not counting 20% equip drop rate from greed pendant, 15% drop rate from IA, Wolf familiar (100%)

Character 2: 170% drop rate, 50% tradeable (or 165% drop rate and 50% tradeable, same as above), not counting 20% equip drop rate from greed pendant, no drop rate from IA, Spider/Pig familiar, 10% drop rate from Showdown*

*This character is a phantom though, and killing with showdown will result in some cards flying out and killing other mobs and not applying the 10% drop from showdown. How much this matters in the big picture is debatable, though, but I'm noting it regardless. A SP reset coupon to reset carte noire while running these tests is also an option, but honestly it's too much of an hassle to reset the SP everytime to do these tests and then having to re-assign later. :c

@Aeraxis, since you have two computers and characters with high drop rate, I think the most useful tests you could do will be:

1. Do some solo runs on Character 1
2. Do some solo runs on a character with no drop buffs from another account (we'll call it character 3).
3. Do party runs of characters 1+3, where 1 is leader and does all the killing.
4. Do party runs of characters 1+3, where 3 is leader but 1 does all the killing.
5. Do party runs of characters 1+3, where 3 is leader and does all the killing.
6. Do runs where 1 goes in alone, then parties 3 who is waiting outside.

I believe this will cover the biggest issues people have been raising doubts about: whether party drop rate goes by party leader, or by attacker, or an average of all party members regardless; and whether partying someone outside the map has any effect.

As to how many runs with each configuration: the more, the better. I would say at least 10 (so, 2 days, assuming no runs get ruined by choco frenzy or other causes) of each type.

Also, if you have an overabundance of spare time, try doing all of the above with characters 2 and 4 (some other no-drop-buff mule). Don't reset your SP. Can you avoid using Showdown? If not, then we'll just have to deal with its partial effect.

Thanks in advance for any testing you are able to do.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by SaptaZapta

Aeraxis, since you have two computers and characters with high drop rate, I think the most useful tests you could do will be:

1. Do some solo runs on Character 1
2. Do some solo runs on a character with no drop buffs from another account (we'll call it character 3).
3. Do party runs of characters 1+3, where 1 is leader and does all the killing.
4. Do party runs of characters 1+3, where 3 is leader but 1 does all the killing.
5. Do party runs of characters 1+3, where 3 is leader and does all the killing.
6. Do runs where 1 goes in alone, then parties 3 who is waiting outside.

I believe this will cover the biggest issues people have been raising doubts about: whether party drop rate goes by party leader, or by attacker, or an average of all party members regardless; and whether partying someone outside the map has any effect.

As to how many runs with each configuration: the more, the better. I would say at least 10 (so, 2 days, assuming no runs get ruined by choco frenzy or other causes) of each type.

Also, if you have an overabundance of spare time, try doing all of the above with characters 2 and 4 (some other no-drop-buff mule). Don't reset your SP. Can you avoid using Showdown? If not, then we'll just have to deal with its partial effect.

Thanks in advance for any testing you are able to do.

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Alright, I'll start doing the tests in a few days, most likely. Another thing to note is that Character 1 and Character 2 are also on different accounts, so a combination of Char 1 + Char 2 is also possible, though that may not be wanted since the drop rate difference between them is not as large as with 1/2 and a character with no drop gear.

I'll get back to you with results as soon as possible, and there's one thing that I'd like to request but if you don't want to, it's perfectly understandable.

If you use discord, could you add me and remind me to do the tests each day? Or else I'm afraid on some days I'm just going to skip simply due to sheer laziness or forgetting .:c

I'll PM you with the details if you agree, and if not, I'll just try my best to remember.

Sorry, I don't have Discord.
Try putting a reminder in your phone or something?

And yes, a run with characters 1 and 2 is probably not going to tell us much because there is little difference between them. Might be worth it to try, just to make sure nothing absurd happens like drops rates adding up or even multiplying, but that's really unlikely and probaly not worth wasting runs on.

Rexaar2 lv 229 179% drop rate (19% inner ability, 160% from equipment)
Rexaar Lv 205 0% drop rate

Rexaar2 is leader and is killing and collecting, Rexaar is inside.
Valentine Box 73, 73
Chocolate 337


Rexaar is leader and is killing and collecting, Rexaar2 is inside.
Valentine Box 22,31
Chocolate 127


Rexaar is leader, Rexaar2 is inside killing and collecting
Valentine Box 27
Chocolate 123

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Normal Hilla (loot flies high into air)
Rexaar2 is party leader at 179% drop rate and spider familiar (x1.4 drop rate) and greed pendant (+20% equipment drop rate), Rexaar has 0% drop rate.
Run 1, Rexaar is the killer, 4 equipment dropped.
Run 2, Rexaar2 is the killer, 16 equipment dropped
New party, Rexaar2 is leader, switch leader to Rexaar, Rexaar kill, 2 equipment.
New party, Rexaar2 is leader, switch leader to Rexaar, Rexaar2 kill 17 equipment.

Switched party leader for zakum run.

Normal Zakum (loot flies high into air)
Rexaar is party leader at 0% drop rate , Rexaar has 179% drop rate and spider familiar (x1.4 drop rate) and greed pendant (+20% equipment drop rate).
Run 1, Rexaar is the killer, 2 equipment dropped.
Run 2, Rexaar2 is the killer, 16 equipment dropped
New party, Rexaar2 is party leader and killer, 16 equipment.
New party, Rexaar2 is party leader, Rexaar is killer, 3 equipment.

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New party

Normal Ranmaru (loot flies high into air)
Rexaar2 is party leader at 179% drop rate and spider familiar (x1.4 drop rate), Rexaar has 0% drop rate.
Run 1, Rexaar is the killer, 11 recipe dropped.
Run 2, Rexaar2 is the killer, 7 recipe dropped.

New party

Krexel (loot does not fly high into air)
Rexaar is leader at 0% drop, Rexaar2 at 179% drop, spider and greed
Rexaar is killer, 9 equipment dropped.
Rexaar2 is killer, 8 equipment dropped.


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Kacchuu Musha
Everything is done in a sequence.
Rexaar2 at 179% drop rate and spider familar (most of the time, 1.4x drop rate) and greed pendant
Rexaar at 0% drop rate

1. 0:20 Rexaar2 is party leader and enter the map first and kill, Rexaar enter second.
48 equipment dropped

2. 2:14 Change party leader, Rexaar is party leader and enter the map first and kill, Rexaar2 enter second.
41 equipment dropped, no spider

3. 5:28 to 8:19 Remake party, Rexaar is party leader, Rexaar2 enter first and kill.
9 equipment

4. 11:39 No party change, Rexaar2 kill alone.
43 equipment

5. 13:40 No party change, Rexaar is leader and enter second Rexaar2 enter first and kill.
16 equipment

6. 15:35 No party change, Rexaar is leader and kill, Rexaar2 enter second.
14 equipment

7. 16:55 Remake party, Rexaar2 is leader, Rexaar enter second and kill. no spider
48 equipment, no spider

8. 20:08 Change party leader, Rexaar is leader, Rexaar2 enter first and kill.
53 equipment

9. 24:15 No party change, Rexaar is leader, Rexaar cc and kill alone
14 equipment

10. 25:30 No party change, Rexaar is leader, Rexaar enter first and kill, Rexaar2 enter second.
49 equipment, no spider

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Kacchuu Musha (loot does not fly high into air) part 2
Rexaar2 at 179% drop rate and spider familar (most of the time, 1.4x drop rate) and greed pendant
Rexaar at 0% drop rate

1. New party, Rexaar2 is leader, Rexaar2 leave party, Rexaar is now leader, Rexaar kill.
7 equipment

2. New party, Rexaar2 is leader, Rexaar2 leave party, Rexaar is now leader, Rexaar2 rejoin, Rexaar kill.
47 equipment

3. New party, Rexaar is leader, Rexaar leave party, Rexaar2 is now leader, Rexaar rejoin, Rexaar2 kill.
10 equipment

4. New party, Rexaar is leader, Rexaar leave party, Rexaar2 is now leader, Rexaar2 kill.
48 equipment, no spider

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Kacchuu Musha (loot does not fly high into air) part 3
Rexaar2 at 179% drop rate and spider familar (most of the time, 1.4x drop rate) and greed pendant
Rexaar at 0% drop rate

1. New party, Rexaar2 is leader, Rexaar2 leave party, Rexaar is leader, change map, come back and rejoin party, Rexaar2 kill
52 equipment

2. New party, Rexaar2 is leader, Rexaar2 leave party, Rexaar is leader, change channel, come back and rejoin party, Rexaar2 kill
46 equipment

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Conclusion from doing it with 2 man party:
Drop rate of everyone currently in the map is set to the person (if he is present) that created the party. (Very noticeable in Muto PQ)
Changing party leader do not change the drop rate.
If the person that created the party is not present in the map, then the killer own drop rate is applied.
If the party creator leave the party, the killer own drop rate is applied.
If the party creator leave the party and rejoin it, the party creator drop rate is applied. (Even if the party creator leave party to change map or change channel (like to enter a bounty portal/ wolf))
Some bosses follow a different drop rule, killer drop rate is applied to shared loot regardless of who created the party.

What isn't tested yet:
3 or more people in a party

Data contributed by user "jeffim" on /r/MapleStory:
Original post: https://www.reddit.com/r/Maplestory/...ibute/ddxbely/

Instead of mentioning the drop rates each time, I'm just going to mention the characters and it should be tacitly assumed that this is the drop % configuration that's being used at any point they're mentioned.
Characters (all on Reboot)
jeffim (BM): 233% drop (253% drop for equips - just mentioning this so you know I'm not including greed pendant as a part of my drop % here)
CustomShop (Kanna): 0% drop
OrangeHeki (Beast Tamer): 0% drop from equps, 19% drop from BT buff
Manipuiator (NL): 80% drop
Wurmk (Kanna): 20% drop
Boldface indicates who is party leader.

Feb. 18: jeffim attacking with Big Spider familiar
jeffim created party.
Choco: 578 585 588

Feb. 19: jeffim attacking with Big Spider familiar and HS
jeffim created party.
Choco: 713, 691
Boxes: 139, 129, 146, 150

Feb. 20: jeffim attacking with Big Spider familiar. CustomShop in party
jeffim created party.
Choco: 608, 576, 584
Boxes: 118, 122, 117, 128

Feb. 21: jeffim attacking with Big Spider familiar and HS. OrangeHeki in party
jeffim created party.
pomegranate. Accidentally overwrote this info. I'll redo this later and also create a separate file with all of this data right now. Conclusion is that BT buff is overridden by HS.

Feb. 22: jeffim attacking with Big Spider familiar. Manipuiator in party
jeffim created party.
Choco: 586, 571, 593
Boxes: 138, 119, 113, 126

Feb. 23: jeffim attacking with Big Spider familiar. CustomShop in party
CustomShop created party.
Choco: 130
Boxes: 20, 25, 33, 23

Feb. 24: jeffim with Lucky Winter buff
Choco: 735
Boxes: 144, 160, 134, 137

Feb. 25: jeffim with Lucky Winter + HS
Boxes: 161, 168, 168

Feb. 26: jeffim with 2x coupon
Choco: 719, 744, 721
Boxes: 128, 139, 137, 146, 138

Feb. 27: jeffim with Wurmk
Wurmk created party
Choco: 180, 157, 147, 183
Boxes: 24, 27, 33, 36

Independent sources pointing to the conclusion that LW, Easter Buff, and 2x Drop Event is not 2x drop: base (top-left corner) and LW (top-left corner again). LW, Easter Buff, and 2x Drop Event seem to give the same drop rate. It seems like when there are other buffs present (e.g. big spider), the 2x event gives the full 2x drop amount.
Big Spider applies a 1.4x multiplier
LW, 2x drop, 2x event (in isolation of drop buffs) applies significantly less than a 2x multiplier.
I'm not confident in saying exactly what values these multipliers have.

First of all, I'd like to thank Rexaar and jeffim for all their hard work collecting data with two characters in various situations.
Second, I must apologize for taking so long to write this summing-up post.

So, what have we learned?

Unfortunately, we do not have enough data points in any one configuration to draw quantitative conclusions about specific drop buffs, as we did in previous tests. It appears (from jeffim's data) that Lucky Winter and 2x coupons either do not truly double drop rate, or are not fully multiplicative with drop rate on equipment or inner ability for whatever reason. But the data points are too few to be conclusive.
Other than that, we do not see any data that contradicts what we already know.

However, because of the very high drop rate difference between party members in both Rexaar's and jeffim's tests, we do have enough information to draw conclusions regarding drop rate in parties. At least parties of two people.

For normal mobbing:

Drop rate of all party members in the same map is set to the drop rate of the character that created the party, as long as they are in the party and in the map. Changing party leader, or having the creator leave (for example to go to wolf/bounty portal) and rejoin, doesn't change the party's drop rate.

If the party creator is not in the party or not in the map, their drop rate no longer applies. Since we only checked 2-person parties, we do not know whether each character's own drop rate applies to their kills, or the party leader's (if not the creator), or some kind of average between present members.

For bossing:

Some bosses follow a different drop rule: killer drop rate is applied to shared loot regardless of who created the party.
Tested bosses where killer drop rate applies: Hilla and Zakum.
Tested bosses where party creator drop rate applies: Ranmaru, Krexel, Kacchuu Musha

It is possible that the difference is KMS vs. non-KMS bosses, but this requires more testing.

Things that still need testing:

1. Party creator changing drop rate after party creation - does new rate apply to just the creator, everyone, or no-one?
2. Parties of 3 or more people - what happens when the party creator is not present?
3. More bossing:
- What happens with the drops of "killer drop rate" bosses when more than one character damages the boss?
- Which bosses follow which rule (and why?)
- Do instanced drops always go by the drop rate of the person they're meant for?


Thanks, again, to all who participated.

wow awesome job with this guys

https://orangemushroom.net/2017/03/2...-rate-changes/

Might have some meaning for you @SaptaZapta

Quote:

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Originally Posted by fodjgngf

https://orangemushroom.net/2017/03/2...-rate-changes/

Might have some meaning for you SaptaZapta

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Means we're going to have to keep a close eye on what the KMS community figures out about the new formula, and then might have to redesign our testing procedures.
We've always tested using event drops in DIPQ, because it's a very consistent number of kills. However, the new drop formula does not (fully?) apply to event drops. On the other hand, event drops behave funny in KMS anyway (they expire in 20 or 30 seconds on the ground, as opposed to 2.5-3 minutes for normal drops), so maybe our event drops will continue to be affected by drop rate.
We'll see.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by SaptaZapta

Means we're going to have to keep a close eye on what the KMS community figures out about the new formula, and then might have to redesign our testing procedures.
We've always tested using event drops in DIPQ, because it's a very consistent number of kills. However, the new drop formula does not (fully?) apply to event drops. On the other hand, event drops behave funny in KMS anyway (they expire in 20 or 30 seconds on the ground, as opposed to 2.5-3 minutes for normal drops), so maybe our event drops will continue to be affected by drop rate.
We'll see.

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Well they say some key things regarding drop rate, mainly that each source is used separately and they're combining them all. KMS doesn't have familiars after all so we may get negative scaling with familiars or the same as a drop coupon or a final multiplier on drop rate.

I'm also fairly sure that the change to event drops and drop rate is so people don't just do 1 DIPQ run and get all the drops that they want you to get over the course of 4 hours.

It turned out that the (party member drop rate = party creator drop rate) has been patched out. It is now only based on the killer drop rate.

Round 1 of DIPQ only, Rexaar is party creator, Rexaar2 kill (179% drop rate + spider):
24, 32 overdrive boxes

Round 1 of DIPQ only, Rexaar2 is party creator, Rexaar kill (0% drop rate):
7, 2, 5 overdrive boxes

Normal Hilla, Rexaar2 is party creator, Rexaar kill (0% drop rate):
6 equipment

Normal Hilla, Rexaar is party creator, Rexaar2 kill (199% drop rate + spider):
16 equipment