[Module] Big Bang | Delays & Ranges

[Fiel]

As requested:


Swordman|Iron Body|600 ms|
Fighter|Power Guard|600 ms|
Fighter|Rage|600 ms|300% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-300&lty=-200&rbx=300&rby=200&size=1024)
Fighter|Weapon Booster|600 ms|
Fighter|Ground Smash||200% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-200&lty=-113&rbx=-10&rby=0&size=1024)
Crusader|Shout|1500 ms|200% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-200&lty=-150&rbx=200&rby=150&size=1024)
Crusader|Brandish|840 ms|150% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-150&lty=-110&rbx=-10&rby=0&size=1024)
Crusader|Combo Attack|900 ms|
Crusader|Magic Crash|1500 ms|300% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-300&lty=-50&rbx=300&rby=45&size=1024)
Hero|Intrepid Slash|840 ms|175% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-175&lty=-90&rbx=-10&rby=0&size=1024)
Hero|Maple Warrior|1500 ms|400% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-400&lty=-300&rbx=400&rby=300&size=1024)
Hero|Monster Magnet||370% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-370&lty=-100&rbx=-50&rby=15&size=1024)
Hero|Power Stance|900 ms|
Hero|Rush|600 ms|270% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-270&lty=-50&rbx=0&rby=0&size=1024)
Page|Ground Smash||200% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-200&lty=-113&rbx=-10&rby=0&size=1024)
Page|Power Guard|600 ms|
Page|Threaten|600 ms|300% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-300&lty=-200&rbx=300&rby=200&size=1024)
Page|Weapon Booster|600 ms|
White Knight|Lightning Charge|900 ms|55% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-55&lty=-40&rbx=55&rby=40&size=1024)
White Knight|Magic Crash|1500 ms|300% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-300&lty=-50&rbx=300&rby=45&size=1024)
White Knight|Charged Blow|600 ms|180% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-180&lty=-113&rbx=-10&rby=0&size=1024)
White Knight|Combat Orders|1500 ms|400% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-400&lty=-300&rbx=400&rby=300&size=1024)
White Knight|Ice Charge|900 ms|55% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-55&lty=-40&rbx=55&rby=40&size=1024)
White Knight|HP Recovery|1500 ms|
White Knight|Fire Charge|900 ms|55% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-55&lty=-40&rbx=55&rby=40&size=1024)
Paladin|Maple Warrior|1500 ms|400% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-400&lty=-300&rbx=400&rby=300&size=1024)
Paladin|Divine Charge|900 ms|50% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-50&lty=-35&rbx=50&rby=35&size=1024)
Paladin|Rush|600 ms|270% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-270&lty=-50&rbx=0&rby=0&size=1024)
Paladin|Blast|840 ms|
Paladin|Heaven's Hammer|3300 ms|400% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-400&lty=-350&rbx=400&rby=250&size=1024)
Paladin|Power Stance|900 ms|
Spearman|Ground Smash||200% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-200&lty=-113&rbx=-10&rby=0&size=1024)
Spearman|Weapon Booster|600 ms|
Spearman|Iron Will|600 ms|300% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-300&lty=-200&rbx=300&rby=200&size=1024)
Spearman|Hyper Body|600 ms|300% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-300&lty=-200&rbx=300&rby=200&size=1024)
Dragon Knight|Dragon Buster|1050 ms|180% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-180&lty=-80&rbx=-16&rby=0&size=1024)
Dragon Knight|Dragon Fury|800 ms|
Dragon Knight|Magic Crash|1500 ms|300% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-300&lty=-50&rbx=300&rby=45&size=1024)
Dragon Knight|Dragon Roar|1500 ms|400% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-400&lty=-350&rbx=400&rby=250&size=1024)
Dragon Knight|Dragon Blood|600 ms|
Dark Knight|Power Stance|900 ms|
Dark Knight|Maple Warrior|1500 ms|400% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-400&lty=-300&rbx=400&rby=300&size=1024)
Dark Knight|Monster Magnet||370% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-370&lty=-100&rbx=-50&rby=15&size=1024)
Dark Knight|Beholder|600 ms|
Dark Knight|Rush|600 ms|270% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-270&lty=-50&rbx=0&rby=0&size=1024)
Magician|Magic Guard|600 ms|
Magician|Magic Armor|600 ms|
Magician|Magic Claw||250% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-250&lty=-150&rbx=0&rby=0&size=1024)
F/P Wizard|Poison Breath|800 ms|
F/P Wizard|Fire Arrow|800 ms|350% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-350&lty=-80&rbx=0&rby=0&size=1024)
F/P Wizard|Meditation|600 ms|300% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-300&lty=-200&rbx=300&rby=200&size=1024)
F/P Wizard|Slow|600 ms|250% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-250&lty=-150&rbx=250&rby=150&size=1024)
F/P Mage|Elemental Decrease|1500 ms|
F/P Mage|Explosion|660 ms|250% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-250&lty=-150&rbx=250&rby=150&size=1024)
F/P Mage|Poison Mist|1500 ms|200% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-200&lty=-150&rbx=200&rby=150&size=1024)
F/P Mage|Seal|900 ms|280% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-280&lty=-150&rbx=280&rby=150&size=1024)
F/P Mage|Spell Booster|1500 ms|
F/P Mage|Element Composition|900 ms|
F/P Mage|Teleport Mastery|600 ms|120% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-120&lty=-100&rbx=120&rby=10&size=1024)
F/P Archmage|Mana Reflection|900 ms|
F/P Archmage|Fire Demon||300% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-300&lty=-100&rbx=-15&rby=0&size=1024)
F/P Archmage|Big Bang||200% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-200&lty=-50&rbx=200&rby=45&size=1024)
F/P Archmage|Maple Warrior|1500 ms|400% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-400&lty=-300&rbx=400&rby=300&size=1024)
F/P Archmage|Meteor Shower|3480 ms|400% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-400&lty=-350&rbx=400&rby=250&size=1024)
F/P Archmage|Paralyze|800 ms|350% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-350&lty=-70&rbx=10&rby=10&size=1024)
F/P Archmage|Ifrit|600 ms|
F/P Archmage|Infinity|600 ms|
I/L Wizard|Meditation|600 ms|300% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-300&lty=-200&rbx=300&rby=200&size=1024)
I/L Wizard|Slow|600 ms|250% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-250&lty=-150&rbx=250&rby=150&size=1024)
I/L Wizard|Thunder Bolt||220% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-220&lty=-50&rbx=220&rby=50&size=1024)
I/L Mage|Spell Booster|1500 ms|
I/L Mage|Seal|900 ms|280% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-280&lty=-150&rbx=280&rby=150&size=1024)
I/L Mage|Teleport Mastery|600 ms|120% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-120&lty=-100&rbx=120&rby=10&size=1024)
I/L Mage|Element Composition|900 ms|
I/L Mage|Thunder Spear|1300 ms|
I/L Mage|Ice Strike|1050 ms|250% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-250&lty=-150&rbx=250&rby=150&size=1024)
I/L Mage|Elemental Decrease|1500 ms|
I/L Archmage|Chain Lightning|780 ms|
I/L Archmage|Blizzard|3480 ms|400% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-400&lty=-350&rbx=400&rby=250&size=1024)
I/L Archmage|Infinity|600 ms|
I/L Archmage|Elquines|600 ms|
I/L Archmage|Mana Reflection|900 ms|
I/L Archmage|Ice Demon||300% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-300&lty=-100&rbx=-15&rby=0&size=1024)
I/L Archmage|Maple Warrior|1500 ms|400% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-400&lty=-300&rbx=400&rby=300&size=1024)
I/L Archmage|Big Bang||200% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-200&lty=-50&rbx=200&rby=45&size=1024)
Cleric|Invincible|600 ms|
Cleric|Heal|600 ms|300% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-300&lty=-200&rbx=300&rby=200&size=1024)
Cleric|Holy Arrow|800 ms|
Cleric|Bless|600 ms|300% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-300&lty=-200&rbx=300&rby=200&size=1024)
Priest|Teleport Mastery|600 ms|120% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-120&lty=-100&rbx=120&rby=10&size=1024)
Priest|Summon Dragon|600 ms|
Priest|Shining Ray|1050 ms|210% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-210&lty=-80&rbx=210&rby=50&size=1024)
Priest|Doom|1500 ms|250% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-250&lty=-150&rbx=250&rby=150&size=1024)
Priest|Mystic Door|600 ms|
Priest|Holy Symbol|1500 ms|300% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-300&lty=-200&rbx=300&rby=200&size=1024)
Priest|Dispel|900 ms|300% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-300&lty=-225&rbx=300&rby=225&size=1024)
Bishop|Holy Shield|1140 ms|400% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-400&lty=-300&rbx=400&rby=300&size=1024)
Bishop|Infinity|600 ms|
Bishop|Angel Ray|800 ms|120% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-120&lty=-75&rbx=120&rby=30&size=1024)
Bishop|Resurrection|2520 ms|400% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-400&lty=-350&rbx=400&rby=250&size=1024)
Bishop|Big Bang||200% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-200&lty=-50&rbx=200&rby=45&size=1024)
Bishop|Maple Warrior|1500 ms|400% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-400&lty=-300&rbx=400&rby=300&size=1024)
Bishop|Bahamut|600 ms|
Bishop|Mana Reflection|900 ms|
Bishop|Genesis|2700 ms|400% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-400&lty=-350&rbx=400&rby=250&size=1024)
Bowman|Arrow Blow||120% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-120&lty=-75&rbx=120&rby=30&size=1024)
Bowman|Focus|600 ms|
Hunter|Soul Arrow : Bow|600 ms|
Hunter|Arrow Bomb: Bow||150% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-150&lty=-100&rbx=150&rby=100&size=1024)
Hunter|Bow Booster|600 ms|
Hunter|Power Knock-Back|800 ms|100% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-100&lty=-65&rbx=0&rby=0&size=1024)
Ranger|Inferno||150% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-150&lty=-100&rbx=150&rby=100&size=1024)
Ranger|Puppet|600 ms|
Ranger|Silver Hawk|600 ms|
Ranger|Arrow Rain||210% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-210&lty=-100&rbx=210&rby=100&size=1024)
Bowmaster|Sharp Eyes|900 ms|400% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-400&lty=-300&rbx=400&rby=300&size=1024)
Bowmaster|Maple Warrior|1500 ms|400% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-400&lty=-300&rbx=400&rby=300&size=1024)
Bowmaster|Phoenix|600 ms|
Bowmaster|Hamstring|900 ms|
Bowmaster|Vengeance||100% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-100&lty=-100&rbx=200&rby=10&size=1024)
Bowmaster|Concentrate|900 ms|
Crossbowman|Power Knock-Back|800 ms|100% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-100&lty=-65&rbx=0&rby=0&size=1024)
Crossbowman|Crossbow Booster|600 ms|
Crossbowman|Soul Arrow : Crossbow|600 ms|
Sniper|Arrow Eruption||210% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-210&lty=-100&rbx=210&rby=100&size=1024)
Sniper|Golden Eagle|600 ms|
Sniper|Puppet|600 ms|
Sniper|Blizzard||150% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-150&lty=-100&rbx=150&rby=100&size=1024)
Crossbow Master|Blind|900 ms|
Crossbow Master|Frostprey|600 ms|
Crossbow Master|Sharp Eyes|900 ms|400% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-400&lty=-300&rbx=400&rby=300&size=1024)
Crossbow Master|Maple Warrior|1500 ms|400% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-400&lty=-300&rbx=400&rby=300&size=1024)
Rogue|Dark Sight|100 ms|
Assassin|Claw Booster|600 ms|
Assassin|Haste|600 ms|300% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-300&lty=-200&rbx=300&rby=200&size=1024)
Hermit|Dark Flare|600 ms|
Hermit|Avenger|840 ms|
Hermit|Shadow Partner|1500 ms|
Hermit|Shadow Web|800 ms|250% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-250&lty=-120&rbx=0&rby=0&size=1024)
Hermit|Meso Up|900 ms|300% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-300&lty=-200&rbx=300&rby=200&size=1024)
Night Lord|Ninja Ambush|1500 ms|200% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-200&lty=-130&rbx=200&rby=70&size=1024)
Night Lord|Maple Warrior|1500 ms|400% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-400&lty=-300&rbx=400&rby=300&size=1024)
Night Lord|Taunt|1350 ms|
Night Lord|Ninja Storm|930 ms|200% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-200&lty=-70&rbx=200&rby=30&size=1024)
Bandit|Dagger Booster|600 ms|
Bandit|Haste|600 ms|300% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-300&lty=-200&rbx=300&rby=200&size=1024)
Bandit|Steal||250% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-250&lty=-63&rbx=0&rby=0&size=1024)
Bandit|Savage Blow|960 ms|
Chief Bandit|Dark Flare|600 ms|
Chief Bandit|Meso Explosion|1000 ms|300% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-300&lty=-120&rbx=300&rby=50&size=1024)
Chief Bandit|Meso Guard|900 ms|
Chief Bandit|Band of Thieves||220% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-220&lty=-100&rbx=100&rby=50&size=1024)
Chief Bandit|Pickpocket|900 ms|
Chief Bandit|Assaulter|1200 ms|250% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-250&lty=-120&rbx=0&rby=0&size=1024)
Chief Bandit|Chakra|1500 ms|
Chief Bandit|Shadow Partner|1500 ms|
Shadower|Ninja Ambush|1500 ms|200% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-200&lty=-130&rbx=200&rby=70&size=1024)
Shadower|Smokescreen|1440 ms|250% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-250&lty=-150&rbx=250&rby=150&size=1024)
Shadower|Boomerang Step|900 ms|300% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-300&lty=-110&rbx=0&rby=0&size=1024)
Shadower|Maple Warrior|1500 ms|400% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-400&lty=-300&rbx=400&rby=300&size=1024)
Shadower|Assassinate|1820 ms|100% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-100&lty=-120&rbx=-10&rby=0&size=1024)
Shadower|Taunt|1350 ms|
Semi-Dualer (20-29)|Triple Stab|870 ms|100% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-100&lty=-110&rbx=-10&rby=0&size=1024)
Semi-Dualer (20-29)|Katara Booster|600 ms|
Dualer (30-54)|Self Haste|600 ms|300% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-300&lty=-200&rbx=300&rby=200&size=1024)
Dualer (30-54)|Fatal Blow|1582 ms|142% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-142&lty=-85&rbx=0&rby=0&size=1024)
Dualer (30-54)|Slash Storm|600 ms|205% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-205&lty=-70&rbx=0&rby=0&size=1024)
Dual Master (55-69)|Flashbang|510 ms|220% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-220&lty=-110&rbx=208&rby=20&size=1024)
Dual Master (55-69)|Tornado Spin (Attack)|960 ms|280% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-280&lty=-80&rbx=0&rby=0&size=1024)
Slasher (70-119)|Upper Stab|480 ms|176% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-176&lty=-81&rbx=23&rby=0&size=1024)
Slasher (70-119)|Flying Assaulter|1380 ms|320% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-320&lty=0&rbx=0&rby=120&size=1024)
Slasher (70-119)|Mirror Image|1500 ms|
Slasher (70-119)|Owl Spirit|1410 ms|300% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-300&lty=-100&rbx=0&rby=0&size=1024)
Slasher (70-119)|Bloody Storm|870 ms|280% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-280&lty=-110&rbx=0&rby=0&size=1024)
Dual Blader (120+)|Maple Warrior|1500 ms|400% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-400&lty=-300&rbx=400&rby=300&size=1024)
Dual Blader (120+)|Monster Bomb|1200 ms|220% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-220&lty=-150&rbx=220&rby=0&size=1024)
Dual Blader (120+)|Final Cut|960 ms|350% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-350&lty=-75&rbx=0&rby=0&size=1024)
Dual Blader (120+)|Chains of Hell|1740 ms|140% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-140&lty=-110&rbx=0&rby=0&size=1024)
Dual Blader (120+)|Sudden Raid|2700 ms|400% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-400&lty=-350&rbx=400&rby=250&size=1024)
Dual Blader (120+)|Thorns|1500 ms|400% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-400&lty=-300&rbx=400&rby=300&size=1024)
Dual Blader (120+)|Mirrored Target|600 ms|
Pirate|Flash Fist|600 ms|110% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-110&lty=-30&rbx=-20&rby=10&size=1024)
Pirate|Double Shot|450 ms|
Pirate|Sommersault Kick|840 ms|110% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-110&lty=-71&rbx=-5&rby=0&size=1024)
Brawler|Backspin Blow|960 ms|155% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=0&lty=-50&rbx=155&rby=0&size=1024)
Brawler|Double Uppercut|1140 ms|
Brawler|Knuckle Booster|600 ms|
Brawler|Corkscrew Blow|840 ms|200% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-200&lty=-50&rbx=0&rby=0&size=1024)
Brawler|MP Recovery|30 ms|
Marauder|Roll of the Dice|1500 ms|
Marauder|Shockwave|1230 ms|330% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-330&lty=-140&rbx=0&rby=20&size=1024)
Marauder|Energy Drain|600 ms|200% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-200&lty=-100&rbx=0&rby=0&size=1024)
Marauder|Energy Blast|720 ms|130% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-130&lty=-80&rbx=5&rby=30&size=1024)
Buccanneer|Speed Infusion|900 ms|250% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-250&lty=-150&rbx=250&rby=150&size=1024)
Buccanneer|Demolition|3120 ms|300% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-300&lty=-150&rbx=-20&rby=15&size=1024)
Buccanneer|Snatch|810 ms|300% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-300&lty=-100&rbx=-50&rby=15&size=1024)
Buccanneer|Barrage|2430 ms|
Buccanneer|Maple Warrior|1500 ms|400% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-400&lty=-300&rbx=400&rby=300&size=1024)
Buccanneer|Dragon Strike|1080 ms|400% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-400&lty=-100&rbx=25&rby=20&size=1024)
Buccanneer|Energy Orb|1170 ms|
Buccanneer|Time Leap|1440 ms|400% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-400&lty=-300&rbx=400&rby=300&size=1024)
Gunslinger|Gun Booster|600 ms|
Gunslinger|Grenade||50% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-50&lty=-50&rbx=50&rby=20&size=1024)
Gunslinger|Invisible Shot||250% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-250&lty=-80&rbx=-10&rby=40&size=1024)
Gunslinger|Recoil Shot|300 ms|
Gunslinger|Blank Shot|810 ms|250% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-250&lty=-80&rbx=-20&rby=30&size=1024)
Outlaw|Roll of the Dice|1500 ms|
Outlaw|Homing Beacon|960 ms|
Outlaw|Burst Fire|810 ms|
Outlaw|Flamethrower|600 ms|380% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-380&lty=-100&rbx=0&rby=0&size=1024)
Outlaw|Ice Splitter|600 ms|380% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-380&lty=-100&rbx=0&rby=0&size=1024)
Outlaw|Octopus|810 ms|
Corsair|Wrath of the Octopi|810 ms|
Corsair|Bullseye|960 ms|
Corsair|Battleship Torpedo|990 ms|450% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-450&lty=-80&rbx=-10&rby=20&size=1024)
Corsair|Battleship Cannon|780 ms|
Corsair|Maple Warrior|1500 ms|400% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-400&lty=-300&rbx=400&rby=300&size=1024)
Corsair|Air Strike|2880 ms|400% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-400&lty=-500&rbx=400&rby=100&size=1024)
Dawn Warrior (I)|Soul|600 ms|
Dawn Warrior (I)|Iron Body|600 ms|
Dawn Warrior (II)|Final Attack|600 ms|
Dawn Warrior (II)|Rage|600 ms|300% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-300&lty=-200&rbx=300&rby=200&size=1024)
Dawn Warrior (II)|Sword Booster|600 ms|
Dawn Warrior (II)|Soul Blade|990 ms|
Dawn Warrior (III)|Soul Charge|990 ms|50% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-50&lty=-35&rbx=50&rby=35&size=1024)
Dawn Warrior (III)|Soul Driver|1601 ms|250% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-250&lty=-150&rbx=250&rby=30&size=1024)
Dawn Warrior (III)|Brandish|840 ms|150% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-150&lty=-110&rbx=-10&rby=0&size=1024)
Dawn Warrior (III)|Combo Attack|900 ms|
Blaze Wizard (I)|Flame|600 ms|
Blaze Wizard (I)|Magic Armor|600 ms|
Blaze Wizard (I)|Magic Claw||250% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-250&lty=-150&rbx=0&rby=0&size=1024)
Blaze Wizard (I)|Magic Guard|600 ms|
Blaze Wizard (II)|Slow|600 ms|250% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-250&lty=-150&rbx=250&rby=150&size=1024)
Blaze Wizard (II)|Meditation|600 ms|300% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-300&lty=-200&rbx=300&rby=200&size=1024)
Blaze Wizard (II)|Fire Arrow|800 ms|
Blaze Wizard (II)|Elemental Reset|1500 ms|
Blaze Wizard (II)|Spell Booster|1500 ms|
Blaze Wizard (II)|Fire Pillar|1200 ms|200% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-200&lty=-110&rbx=200&rby=40&size=1024)
Blaze Wizard (III)|Ifrit|600 ms|
Blaze Wizard (III)|Flame Gear|1440 ms|200% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-200&lty=-250&rbx=200&rby=30&size=1024)
Blaze Wizard (III)|Fire Strike|840 ms|400% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-400&lty=-60&rbx=0&rby=0&size=1024)
Blaze Wizard (III)|Seal|900 ms|200% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-200&lty=-150&rbx=200&rby=150&size=1024)
Blaze Wizard (III)|Meteor Shower|3480 ms|400% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-400&lty=-350&rbx=400&rby=250&size=1024)
Wind Archer (I)|Storm|600 ms|
Wind Archer (I)|Focus|600 ms|
Wind Archer (II)|Bow Booster|600 ms|
Wind Archer (II)|Soul Arrow|600 ms|
Wind Archer (II)|Storm Break|450 ms|230% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-230&lty=-90&rbx=0&rby=0&size=1024)
Wind Archer (III)|Puppet|600 ms|
Wind Archer (III)|Wind Shot|1260 ms|
Wind Archer (III)|Wind Piercing|1200 ms|
Wind Archer (III)|Arrow Rain||210% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-210&lty=-100&rbx=210&rby=100&size=1024)
Night Walker (I)|Darkness|600 ms|
Night Walker (I)|Dark Sight|100 ms|
Night Walker (II)|Vampire|1350 ms|400% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-400&lty=-80&rbx=0&rby=20&size=1024)
Night Walker (II)|Haste|600 ms|300% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-300&lty=-200&rbx=300&rby=200&size=1024)
Night Walker (II)|Claw Booster|600 ms|
Night Walker (III)|Avenger|840 ms|
Night Walker (III)|Shadow Partner|1500 ms|
Night Walker (III)|Shadow Web|800 ms|250% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-250&lty=-120&rbx=0&rby=0&size=1024)
Night Walker (III)|Poison Bomb||100% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-100&lty=-82&rbx=100&rby=83&size=1024)
Thunder Breaker (I)|Straight|600 ms|110% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-110&lty=-30&rbx=-20&rby=10&size=1024)
Thunder Breaker (I)|Somersault Kick|840 ms|110% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-110&lty=-71&rbx=-5&rby=0&size=1024)
Thunder Breaker (I)|Lightning|600 ms|
Thunder Breaker (II)|Lightning Charge|900 ms|50% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-50&lty=-35&rbx=50&rby=35&size=1024)
Thunder Breaker (II)|Energy Blast|720 ms|100% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-100&lty=-80&rbx=5&rby=30&size=1024)
Thunder Breaker (II)|Knuckle Booster|600 ms|
Thunder Breaker (II)|Corkscrew Blow|840 ms|200% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-200&lty=-50&rbx=0&rby=0&size=1024)
Thunder Breaker (III)|Shockwave|1230 ms|330% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-330&lty=-140&rbx=0&rby=20&size=1024)
Thunder Breaker (III)|Energy Drain|600 ms|200% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-200&lty=-100&rbx=0&rby=0&size=1024)
Thunder Breaker (III)|Shark Wave|1050 ms|
Thunder Breaker (III)|Spark|900 ms|
Thunder Breaker (III)|Speed Infusion|900 ms|250% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-250&lty=-150&rbx=250&rby=150&size=1024)
Thunder Breaker (III)|Barrage|2430 ms|
Aran (I)|Polearm Booster|600 ms|
Aran (I)|Combat Step|180 ms|
Aran (I)|Double Swing|420 ms|180% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-180&lty=-120&rbx=10&rby=10&size=1024)
Aran (II)|Combo Smash|1200 ms|
Aran (II)|Combo Drain|900 ms|
Aran (II)|Triple Swing|660 ms|180% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-180&lty=-140&rbx=10&rby=10&size=1024)
Aran (II)|Final Charge|1080 ms|250% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-250&lty=-50&rbx=0&rby=0&size=1024)
Aran (II)|Body Pressure|990 ms|
Aran (III)|Combo Fenrir|1530 ms|
Aran (III)|(hidden) Full Swing - Double Swing|420 ms|
Aran (III)|Rolling Spin|840 ms|130% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-130&lty=-70&rbx=130&rby=30&size=1024)
Aran (III)|Final Toss|420 ms|210% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-210&lty=-50&rbx=0&rby=0&size=1024)
Aran (III)|(hidden) Full Swing - Triple Swing|660 ms|
Aran (III)|Smart Knockback|990 ms|
Aran (III)|Snow Charge|1200 ms|50% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-50&lty=-35&rbx=50&rby=35&size=1024)
Aran (IV)|Maple Warrior|1500 ms|400% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-400&lty=-300&rbx=400&rby=300&size=1024)
Aran (IV)|(hidden) Over Swing - Triple Swing|660 ms|
Aran (IV)|Combo Tempest|3000 ms|800% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-800&lty=-600&rbx=800&rby=600&size=1024)
Aran (IV)|Combo Barrier|2700 ms|400% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-400&lty=-300&rbx=400&rby=300&size=1024)
Aran (IV)|Freeze Standing|990 ms|
Aran (IV)|Final Blow|810 ms|350% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-350&lty=-200&rbx=0&rby=10&size=1024)
Aran (IV)|(hidden) Over Swing - Double Swing|420 ms|
Evan (I)|Magic Missile|810 ms|
Evan (II)|Fire Circle|930 ms|350% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-350&lty=-100&rbx=10&rby=40&size=1024)
Evan (III)|Lightning Bolt|1200 ms|
Evan (IV)|Ice Breath|810 ms|350% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-350&lty=-100&rbx=0&rby=0&size=1024)
Evan (IV)|Elemental Reset|1920 ms|
Evan (V)|Magic Shield|2160 ms|300% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-300&lty=-150&rbx=300&rby=150&size=1024)
Evan (V)|Magic Flare |1560 ms|
Evan (VI)|Dragon Thrust |1710 ms|300% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-300&lty=-100&rbx=0&rby=0&size=1024)
Evan (VI)|Magic Booster|1920 ms|
Evan (VI)|Slow|1800 ms|
Evan (VII)|Fire Breath |990 ms|350% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-350&lty=-100&rbx=0&rby=0&size=1024)
Evan (VII)|Magic Resistance|1920 ms|300% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-300&lty=-150&rbx=300&rby=150&size=1024)
Evan (VII)|Killer Wings |1440 ms|400% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-400&lty=-108&rbx=15&rby=15&size=1024)
Evan (VIII)|Phantom Imprint |1620 ms|
Evan (VIII)|Recovery Aura|1800 ms|200% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-200&lty=-125&rbx=200&rby=30&size=1024)
Evan (VIII)|Earthquake|1710 ms|300% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-300&lty=-200&rbx=300&rby=30&size=1024)
Evan (IX)|Flame Wheel|1800 ms|815% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-815&lty=-100&rbx=-40&rby=0&size=1024)
Evan (IX)|Hero's Will|2040 ms|
Evan (IX)|Maple Warrior|2250 ms|400% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-400&lty=-300&rbx=400&rby=300&size=1024)
Evan (IX)|Illusion|2010 ms|400% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-400&lty=-108&rbx=15&rby=15&size=1024)
Evan (X)|Blessing of the Onyx|2160 ms|
Evan (X)|Blaze|1320 ms|
Evan (X)|Dark Fog|3060 ms|400% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-400&lty=-600&rbx=400&rby=0&size=1024)
Evan (X)|Soul Stone|1680 ms|400% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-400&lty=-300&rbx=400&rby=300&size=1024)
Battlemage (I)|Triple Blow|900 ms|125% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-125&lty=-90&rbx=10&rby=10&size=1024)
Battlemage (I)|Dark Aura||200% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-200&lty=-125&rbx=200&rby=125&size=1024)
Battlemage (II)|Yellow Aura||200% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-200&lty=-125&rbx=200&rby=125&size=1024)
Battlemage (II)|Blue Aura||200% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-200&lty=-125&rbx=200&rby=125&size=1024)
Battlemage (II)|Dark Chain|1050 ms|300% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-300&lty=-100&rbx=-50&rby=15&size=1024)
Battlemage (II)|Quad Blow|900 ms|180% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-180&lty=-90&rbx=10&rby=10&size=1024)
Battlemage (II)|Staff Boost|600 ms|
Battlemage (II)|Blood Drain|600 ms|
Battlemage (III)|Teleport Mastery|600 ms|120% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-120&lty=-100&rbx=120&rby=10&size=1024)
Battlemage (III)|Advanced Dark Chain|1050 ms|470% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-470&lty=-100&rbx=-50&rby=15&size=1024)
Battlemage (III)|Summon Reaper Buff|1200 ms|
Battlemage (III)|Advanced Blue Aura||200% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-200&lty=-125&rbx=200&rby=125&size=1024)
Battlemage (III)|Quintuple Blow|930 ms|180% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-180&lty=-90&rbx=10&rby=10&size=1024)
Battlemage (III)|Dark Shock|1710 ms|400% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-400&lty=-60&rbx=0&rby=0&size=1024)
Battlemage (IV)|Advanced Dark Aura||200% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-200&lty=-125&rbx=200&rby=125&size=1024)
Battlemage (IV)|Advanced Yellow Aura||200% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-200&lty=-125&rbx=200&rby=125&size=1024)
Battlemage (IV)|Stance|900 ms|
Battlemage (IV)|Dark Genesis|3240 ms|400% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-400&lty=-350&rbx=400&rby=250&size=1024)
Battlemage (IV)|Maple Warrior|1500 ms|400% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-400&lty=-300&rbx=400&rby=300&size=1024)
Battlemage (IV)|Party Shield||200% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-200&lty=-150&rbx=200&rby=30&size=1024)
Battlemage (IV)|Twister Spin|1710 ms|100% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-100&lty=-130&rbx=100&rby=4&size=1024)
Battlemage (IV)|Finishing Blow|990 ms|180% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-180&lty=-90&rbx=10&rby=10&size=1024)
Wild Hunter (I)|Crossbow Booster|600 ms|
Wild Hunter (I)|Jag Jump|720 ms|
Wild Hunter (II)|Jaguar Rawr|1050 ms|230% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-230&lty=-90&rbx=0&rby=10&size=1024)
Wild Hunter (II)|Soul Arrow: Crossbow|600 ms|
Wild Hunter (II)|Jaguar-oshi||150% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-150&lty=-100&rbx=150&rby=10&size=1024)
Wild Hunter (II)|Jaguar-oshi|720 ms|150% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-150&lty=-100&rbx=150&rby=100&size=1024)
Wild Hunter (II)|It's Raining Mines|1350 ms|
Wild Hunter (III)|Swipe|1530 ms|180% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-180&lty=-90&rbx=5&rby=30&size=1024)
Wild Hunter (III)|Silver Hawk|600 ms|
Wild Hunter (III)|Blind|900 ms|
Wild Hunter (III)|Wild Trap||250% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-250&lty=-150&rbx=250&rby=40&size=1024)
Wild Hunter (III)|Dash 'n Slash|1320 ms|350% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-350&lty=-120&rbx=0&rby=15&size=1024)
Wild Hunter (IV)|Sharp Eyes|900 ms|400% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-400&lty=-300&rbx=400&rby=300&size=1024)
Wild Hunter (IV)|Feline Berserk|1530 ms|
Wild Hunter (IV)|Maple Warrior|1500 ms|400% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-400&lty=-300&rbx=400&rby=300&size=1024)
Wild Hunter (IV)|Exploding Arrows|2640 ms|400% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-400&lty=-350&rbx=400&rby=250&size=1024)
Wild Hunter (IV)|Sonic Roar|1980 ms|200% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-200&lty=-100&rbx=200&rby=30&size=1024)
Mechanic (I)|Gatling Gun|810 ms|
Mechanic (I)|ME-07 Drillhands|900 ms|380% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-380&lty=-50&rbx=0&rby=0&size=1024)
Mechanic (I)|Flame Launcher|270 ms|340% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-340&lty=-90&rbx=0&rby=10&size=1024)
Mechanic (II)|Enhanced Flame Launcher|270 ms|470% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-470&lty=-125&rbx=0&rby=0&size=1024)
Mechanic (II)|Rocket Booster|720 ms|120% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-120&lty=-80&rbx=120&rby=6&size=1024)
Mechanic (II)|Open Portal: GX-9|1260 ms|
Mechanic (II)|Mechanic Rage|1400 ms|
Mechanic (II)|Atomic Hammer|1230 ms|350% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-350&lty=-100&rbx=100&rby=60&size=1024)
Mechanic (II)|Enhanced Gatling Gun|810 ms|
Mechanic (III)|Rock 'n Shock|1260 ms|
Mechanic (III)|Acceleration Bot EX-7|1260 ms|
Mechanic (III)|Mech: Siege Mode|720 ms|
Mechanic (III)|Punch Launcher|1110 ms|500% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-500&lty=-90&rbx=0&rby=0&size=1024)
Mechanic (III)|Roll of the Dice|1500 ms|
Mechanic (III)|Healing Robot H-LX|1260 ms|
Mechanic (IV)|Bots 'n Tots|1260 ms|
Mechanic (IV)|Giant Robot SG-88 |5370 ms|145% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-145&lty=-114&rbx=145&rby=114&size=1024)
Mechanic (IV)|Amplifier Robot AF-11|1260 ms|200% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-200&lty=-90&rbx=200&rby=25&size=1024)
Mechanic (IV)|Mech: Siege Mode|540 ms|
Mechanic (IV)|Laser Blast|1470 ms|630% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-630&lty=-100&rbx=0&rby=25&size=1024)
Mechanic (IV)|Maple Warrior|1500 ms|400% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-400&lty=-300&rbx=400&rby=300&size=1024)
Mechanic (IV)|Mech: Missile Tank|1020 ms|120% (http://www.southperry.net/maplerange.php?ltx=-120&lty=-60&rbx=120&rby=60&size=1024)

[Anonymous Moose]

Intrepid Slash > 1140ms

Please tell me this is some kind of mistake... I thought the BB - Brave Slash was suppose to be 840ms.

[Locked]

No delay listed for Arrow Rain and Eruption.. o.o

[Mike]

Strafe? Or is it not possible to find out?

[Anonymous Moose]

Most unlisted skills tend to have the Standard 810ms (800ms rounded to 810ms) delay. In the case of the Bowman related skills, I'm certain this is the case.

[Manu]

Thank you very much.

[hamad138]

So no aran Delays changes after RB 2

[Dusk]

Oh snap, Intrepid Slash was nerfed way earlier than we thought. How did we miss that?

[Viaje]

Seems as good a place to ask as any:

I know these are the normal speeds, but how do we go about figuring how much the speeds after Booster and what-have-you.
Is there a standard rate (-30ms per speed), or is it all based on what weapon you're using and what jump you're making?

[Sorien]

Blast's attack range wasn't in that list, is it no longer fixed or just unknown?

[Forad]

Seems as good a place to ask as any:

I know these are the normal speeds, but how do we go about figuring how much the speeds after Booster and what-have-you.
Is there a standard rate (-30ms per speed), or is it all based on what weapon you're using and what jump you're making?

delay=delay(normal(6))*(10+weapon speed)/16
if your weapon is fast(5),weapon speed is 5 and weapon speed is 3 with booster

[Russt]

^ In general. Seems to have exceptions. Also I'm not sure if it's the same post-BB but other people might.

[jing713]

Thanks for the range table......


This is POST BB right?


Do you know if Shining Ray's range has been increased or not?

If so, by how much?

[Viaje]

Thanks, Forad.

@Russt - From what I've found, speed calculations seem to be the one thing Big Bang did not change.

[StormFury]

Correct me if I'm wrong - These times correspond to the time to finish the animation and preform another skill/attack, correct? More specifically 900 ms to preform B-Step. What is the delay from one B-Step to another (keydown)?

[Baklava]

Lol so this means you guys were all complaining about Brave Slash over nothing. :T

[ghostofhalo]

Intrepid Slash > 1140ms

Please tell me this is some kind of mistake... I thought the BB - Brave Slash was suppose to be 840ms.


Oh snap, Intrepid Slash was nerfed way earlier than we thought. How did we miss that?
Whhhaaaaaaaaaat?

For real? All the videos would indicate 840ms. The only thing I can imagine is that Nexon Korea never changed Brave Slash's delay away from Brandish (the two share the same ID) and therefore uses 840ms instead of 1140ms.

If this is the case, DON'T TELL THEM!

[CrossMyHeart]

Wow intrepid slash....what is going on here. This would make heros far and away one of the weakest classes in MS.

[Russt]

Whhhaaaaaaaaaat?

For real? All the videos would indicate 840ms. The only thing I can imagine is that Nexon Korea never changed Brave Slash's delay away from Brandish (the two share the same ID) and therefore uses 840ms instead of 1140ms.

If this is the case, DON'T TELL THEM!

That could be easily checked within Skill.wz.

[CrossMyHeart]

I hope that is a mistake. Heros slower than Darks??? All heros have are DPS. Were not a buffing class were FIGHTERS. This better be a mistake.

[Viaje]

Whhhaaaaaaaaaat?

For real? All the videos would indicate 840ms. The only thing I can imagine is that Nexon Korea never changed Brave Slash's delay away from Brandish (the two share the same ID) and therefore uses 840ms instead of 1140ms.

If this is the case, DON'T TELL THEM!
What's to tell?

Go check the The Restructuring | Delays & Ranges (http://www.southperry.net/showthread.php?t=35237) thread.
Intrepid Slash - 1140ms.

[ghostofhalo]

I'm saying that if they are linking Brave Slash to Brandish's delay instead of its own delay, then Korea shouldn't need to know or it would kill any DPS the Hero has.

EDIT: Hopefully Fiel can check the Skills.wz file. Here's a video of a Post BB Hero (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pC9tsTyJCRg) using Brave Slash. The speed is almost identical if not the same as Brandish.

[Dusk]

How can you tell? He uses Soul Driver way too often and the FPS is terrible. Best to ask a GMST player that played a Hero. Or wait til Tuesday. Even with 1140 ms Brave Slash, Heroes aren't weak, anyway.

[JoeTang]

How can you tell? He uses Soul Driver way too often and the FPS is terrible. Best to ask a GMST player that played a Hero. Or wait til Tuesday. Even with 1140 ms Brave Slash, Heroes aren't weak, anyway.

Stereo had a Hero I'm fairly sure. I didn't hear any complaints about the speed, but best to ask in person.

[Baklava]

Brave Slash's animation is longer than Brandishes' so I'm guessing the 1140 somehow offsets as 840 when the animation is taken into consideration?

I don't know lol.

[Stereo]

Stereo had a Hero I'm fairly sure. I didn't hear any complaints about the speed, but best to ask in person.

It definitely wasn't slower than Crusher, and I was using a Normal speed weapon.

The animation is insanely huge though so it really should be slower than Brandish. It just.... doesn't look like a fast attack.

[Bloodjedi]

Good Luck for the extractions of the official BB Fiel!

[ghostofhalo]

Even with 1140 ms Brave Slash, Heroes aren't weak, anyway.Assuming Brave Slash is 1140ms and Brandish is still 840ms, it would take a full 28 points in Brave Slash to beat Brandish in DPS. I think that sounds pretty weak.

[Anonymous Moose]

How can you tell? He uses Soul Driver way too often and the FPS is terrible. Best to ask a GMST player that played a Hero. Or wait til Tuesday. Even with 1140 ms Brave Slash, Heroes aren't weak, anyway.

Actually, I did the math, and Heroes would only be superior to a Paladin against bosses that are resistant to all elements, zakum's arms and Pink Bean. Then of course, ACB would beat brandish in almost every mobbing situation.
Then to add insult to injury, in the handful of cases a Hero would be superior to a Paladin the Dark Knight would be vastly superior.

And to make it worse, the Paladin and Dark Knight have useful abilities to benefit the party (CO, HB, Threaten, etc.) while the Hero only can offer damage and the easy to replace Rage.

[IPunketOz]

You forgot to add Sacrifice Delay, Dragon knight skill :o

[OB3LISK]

Lol you seem to have mixed up Ifrit being the IL skill and Elquines being the FP skill. It's up there as vice versa.

Not like it matters.

[Phoenix]

You forgot to add Sacrifice Delay, Dragon knight skill :o


Most unlisted skills tend to have the Standard 810ms (800ms rounded to 810ms) delay. In the case of the Bowman related skills, I'm certain this is the case.

^ I think that's the answer.

[ghostofhalo]

Actually, I did the math, and Heroes would only be superior to a Paladin against bosses that are resistant to all elements, zakum's arms and Pink Bean. Then of course, ACB would beat brandish in almost every mobbing situation.I too did the math. If Brave Slash is really 1140ms, it is the worst mobbing skill and is ranked lower than Blast and Sacrifice in one-on-one DPS (using Enrage). If Brave Slash is 840ms, it will be stronger than Sacrifice (unless the mob has high PDRate and only if/when it ignores it), ~20% weaker than Blast if the mob is weak to an element (element and weapon types vary) and ~10% stronger than Blast if the monster isn't weak or strong against an element. Zakum's arms only have resistances on the 2nd row (Fire and Ice resistance) which Holy and Lightning (Dual Charge) won't have any effect against. Pink Bean is also neutral to Lightning, so you still have +25% damage at bare minimum, but it's still plenty to beat Brave Slash with a 1140ms delay.

[Mute]

Lol you seem to have mixed up Ifrit being the IL skill and Elquines being the FP skill. It's up there as vice versa.

Not like it matters.

Nope. After BB i/L's get elquines, and f/p's get Ifrit.

[ghostofhalo]

Nope. After BB i/L's get elquines, and f/p's get Ifrit.
This is true, just as Fire Demon and Ice Demon use to create a weakness the opposite element, it now creates a weakness to its own element.

[AceWiz]

you guys factor in the 50% crit bonus going for blast right?

it has potential to do a lot more w/ decent SE + Crit ring + [crit potentials]

[ghostofhalo]

you guys factor in the 50% crit bonus going for blast right?

it has potential to do a lot more w/ decent SE + Crit ring + [crit potentials]Yes, sir, I did. I factored in everything about the class just shy of PDRate and Combat Orders (so Paladin would effectively be stronger).

[byakugan]

Reading about Brave Slash's delay just know flipped my stomach upside down. I never wished for heroes to be the best warrior (as this would keep bringing more and more bandwagoners to my job), but being the weakest warrior and possible one of the weakest jobs in 4th job all of a sudden? F'uck you nexon. I cannot even have any hopes that it will get fixed or at least get better, because as of now, KMS is nerfing it even further with the reorganization patch.

Sigh... I guess after BB, going 1handed is gonna be a must.

[ghostofhalo]

Sigh... I guess after BB, going 1handed is gonna be a must.1H isn't going to save your DPS at all. Players go 1H to double on potential. If Brave Slash really ends up 1140ms, the Hero's DPS is as good as dead, but videos of post-BB indicate that the speed is no different than Brandish which is clearly possible as it is the same ID as Brandish is now (pre-BB). It could be a mistake. We'll have to wait until tomorrow before we nerd-rage (don't worry, I'm including myself there).

[MysticHLE]

Actually, I did the math, and Heroes would only be superior to a Paladin against bosses that are resistant to all elements, zakum's arms and Pink Bean.

And how about Horntail, the boss where a Hero can mob arm + legs + wings all at once due to the ridiculous range of Brandish/Intrepid (Brave) Slash?


1H isn't going to save your DPS at all. Players go 1H to double on potential. If Brave Slash really ends up 1140ms, the Hero's DPS is as good as dead, but videos of post-BB indicate that the speed is no different than Brandish which is clearly possible as it is the same ID as Brandish is now (pre-BB). It could be a mistake. We'll have to wait until tomorrow before we nerd-rage (don't worry, I'm including myself there).

Besides for bossing expectations based on the current status quo, logically, is there any particular reason why you'd expect a 3-hit triple mob skill to outdamage any specialized single target skill?

And it's quite interesting how we're getting the delays and ranges of Restructuring in our BB patch~ Good that Nexon can keep up with these changes in KMS. =)

[ghostofhalo]

Besides for bossing expectations based on the current status quo, logically, is there any particular reason why you'd expect a 3-hit triple mob skill to outdamage any specialized single target skill?You are aware that Enrage is no longer a weapon attack buff but a damage buff that magically makes all skills hit one target, right? You deal an additional 60% (x1.6) on all attacks but can only hit one target. So to answer your question, yes, I do think it should compete.

[KhainiWest]

This looks like it was a last minute change based on the reconstruction patch, Post-BB in this case would have no relevance which is probably why you're so confused. Why they made such a radical change last minute is beyond me, and is certaintly unfair.

[ghostofhalo]

This looks like it was a last minute change based on the reconstruction patch, Post-BB in this case would have no relevance which is probably why you're so confused. Why they made such a radical change last minute is beyond me, and is certaintly unfair.I highly doubt it was a last minute change since the damage would be much higher in Restructuring to balance the classes out. I'm assuming they just screwed up somewhere with the delay whether it's referencing Brandish (likely) or has some crazy Booster gain (unlikely).

[OB3LISK]

And how about Horntail, the boss where a Hero can mob arm + legs + wings all at once due to the ridiculous range of Brandish/Intrepid (Brave) Slash?

Still planning on having warriors hit more than one part of HT at once, and making warriors the main attackers of HT eh? Not like it matters, since good profitable HT squads are 6 people these days. ANd if you have 6 people lol they better be potential $$irl$$ stacked.

[ghostofhalo]

And how about Horntail, the boss where a Hero can mob arm + legs + wings all at once due to the ridiculous range of Brandish/Intrepid (Brave) Slash?I'll repeat, with a 1140ms delay, Heroes would have the worst mobbing attack. Charged Blow has a larger range in comparison (5 further out, 23 higher) and Crusher has a near equivilant (5 further out, 10 lower). Since the two would rank higher in DPS, Brave Slash would still fail in comparison. Even a fully self-buffed Paladin with no advantage using ACB beats Brave Slash on 3 targets (around 6-10% overall depending on charges/weapon type). A buffed Dark Knight with Crusher would beat it by about 28% overall. It even does less damage than Fury.

[MysticHLE]

I'll repeat, with a 1140ms delay, Heroes would have the worst mobbing attack. Charged Blow has a larger range in comparison (5 further out, 23 higher) and Crusher has a near equivilant (5 further out, 10 lower). Since the two would rank higher in DPS, Brave Slash would still fail in comparison. Even a fully self-buffed Paladin with no advantage using ACB beats Brave Slash on 3 targets (around 6-10% overall depending on charges/weapon type). A buffed Dark Knight with Crusher would beat it by about 28% overall. It even does less damage than Fury.

Well, if DPS and damage down to the exact % (out of like 2000% damage) are all you look at in balance, then...I don't have much to say. =|


Still planning on having warriors hit more than one part of HT at once, and making warriors the main attackers of HT eh? Not like it matters, since good profitable HT squads are 6 people these days. ANd if you have 6 people lol they better be potential $$irl$$ stacked.

Play the game however you want - for profit, fun, or speed of a run; smart strategy is still smart strategy. If it really doesn't matter to you, perhaps you can try to convince people too that 28% damage on a 2000% damage scale doesn't matter either.

[ghostofhalo]

Well, if DPS and damage down to the exact % (out of like 2000% damage) are all you look at in balance, then...I don't have much to say. =|I'm not looking for ideal matches. I'm saying that an attack that hits 3 targets should deal more than an attack that hits 6 targets. If Enrage buffs that attack 60% and decreases targets to 1, it should compete with other 1v1 skills. Blast gains power from elemental advantage and crit rate, Sacrifice (in theory) gains damage as the monster has more defense, and Brave Slash should be on the middle ground with raw damage and no elemental advantage. There is no reason a skill should fail so terribly that it's a joke to consider an attack when all other 1v1 attacks at the same level and attacks that hit double the mob count can outdamage it.

[MysticHLE]

I'm not looking for ideal matches. I'm saying that an attack that hits 3 targets should deal more than an attack that hits 6 targets. If Enrage buffs that attack 60% and decreases targets to 1, it should compete with other 1v1 skills. Blast gains power from elemental advantage and crit rate, Sacrifice (in theory) gains damage as the monster has more defense, and Brave Slash should be on the middle ground with raw damage and no elemental advantage. There is no reason a skill should fail so terribly that it's a joke to consider an attack when all other 1v1 attacks at the same level and attacks that hit double the mob count can outdamage it.

Mind showing me how you're doing your raw damage % calculations for Hero vs. Paladin? Intrepid Slash vs. ACB, that is.

[ghostofhalo]

Mind showing me how you're doing your raw damage % calculations for Hero vs. Paladin? Intrepid Slash vs. ACB, that is.

All characters have clean weapons, stats of 999/23/4/4, and only have their own buffs (Combat Orders/PDRate/identical buffs not included).

Max = 1.32 (4 * 999 + 23) * ((110 + 20) / 100)
Min = Max * 70%
Avg = (Max + Min) / 2
Avg = 5862

Avg crit = (120% + 150%) / 2
With crits = (Avg * 5% * 135%) + (Avg * 95%)
With crits = 5,965

ACA damage = With crits * 200%
ACA damage = 11,929

Skill damage = ACA damage * 210% * 3
Skill damage = 75,153

Attacks/Sec = 1000/840ms
Attacks/Sec = 1.19047619

DPS = Attacks/Sec * Skill damage
DPS = 89,471 per mob
Max = 1.32 (4 * 999 + 23) * ((110 + 20) / 100)
Min = Max * 70%
Avg = (Max + Min) / 2
Avg = 5862

Avg crit = (120% + 150%) / 2
With crits = (Avg * 5% * 135%) + (Avg * 95%)
With crits = 5,965

ACA damage = With crits * 200%
ACA damage = 11,929

Skill damage = ACA damage * 210% * 3
Skill damage = 75,153

Attacks/Sec = 1000/1140ms
Attacks/Sec = 0.877192982

DPS = Attacks/Sec * Skill damage
DPS = 65,926
per mob
Max = 1.32 (4 * 999 + 23) * ((110 + 30) / 100)
Min = Max * 90%
Avg = (Max + Min) / 2
Avg = 7,056

Avg crit = (120% + 150%) / 2
With crits = (Avg * 5% * 135%) + (Avg * 95%)
With crits = 7,179

Elemental damage = With crits * (135% * 150% + 12.5%)
Elemental damage = 15,435

Skill damage = Elemental damage * 460%
Skill damage = 71,001

Attacks/Sec = 1000/810ms
Attacks/Sec = 1.234567901

DPS = Attacks/Sec * Skill damage
DPS = 87,655 per mob
Max = 1.32 (4 * 999 + 23) * ((110 + 30) / 100)
Min = Max * 90%
Avg = (Max + Min) / 2
Avg = 7,056

Avg crit = (120% + 150%) / 2
With crits = (Avg * 5% * 135%) + (Avg * 95%)
With crits = 7,179

Non-Elemental damage = With crits * (135% + 12.5%)
Non-Elemental damage = 10,589

Skill damage = Non-Elemental damage * 460%
Skill damage = 48,709

Attacks/Sec = 1000/810ms
Attacks/Sec = 1.234567901

DPS = Attacks/Sec * Skill damage
DPS = 60,135 per mob
Brave Slash 840ms compared to ACB advantage: +2.07%
Brave Slash 840ms compared to ACB no advantage: +48.78%
Brave Slash 1140ms compared to ACB advantage: -24.79%
Brave Slash 1140ms compared to ACB no advantage: +9.63%
Booster, Final Attack, and Maple Warrior (for example) will raise each other's stats equally. Booster may not, but I'm unaware of the Fast (4) speed of an 1140ms attack. If you see something wrong, let me know. I'll gladly update my table and edit this appropriately.

EDIT: Compared to ACB (which hits double the targets), it's pretty decent in Big Bang in either case (preference to 840ms since it does not stun or hit 6 targets). In Restructuring, not so much as ACB gets buffed far beyond Brave Slash.

[andyandythin]

anyone have a link for a video which shows the slow brave slash?

[JoeTang]

All characters have clean weapons, stats of 999/23/4/4, and only have their own buffs (Combat Orders/PDRate/identical buffs not included).

Max = 1.32 (4 * 999 + 23) * ((110 + 20) / 100)
Min = Max * 70%
Avg = (Max + Min) / 2
Avg = 5862

Avg crit = (120% + 150%) / 2
With crits = (Avg * 5% * 135%) + (Avg * 95%)
With crits = 5,965

ACA damage = With crits * 200%
ACA damage = 11,929

Skill damage = ACA damage * 210% * 3
Skill damage = 75,153

Attacks/Sec = 1000/840ms
Attacks/Sec = 1.19047619

DPS = Attacks/Sec * Skill damage
DPS = 89,471 per mob
Max = 1.32 (4 * 999 + 23) * ((110 + 20) / 100)
Min = Max * 70%
Avg = (Max + Min) / 2
Avg = 5862

Avg crit = (120% + 150%) / 2
With crits = (Avg * 5% * 135%) + (Avg * 95%)
With crits = 5,965

ACA damage = With crits * 200%
ACA damage = 11,929

Skill damage = ACA damage * 210% * 3
Skill damage = 75,153

Attacks/Sec = 1000/1140ms
Attacks/Sec = 0.877192982

DPS = Attacks/Sec * Skill damage
DPS = 65,926
per mob
Max = 1.32 (4 * 999 + 23) * ((110 + 30) / 100)
Min = Max * 90%
Avg = (Max + Min) / 2
Avg = 7,056

Avg crit = (120% + 150%) / 2
With crits = (Avg * 55% * 135%) + (Avg * 45%)
With crits = 8,414

Elemental damage = With crits * (135% * 150% + 12.5%)
Elemental damage = 18,090

Skill damage = Elemental damage * 460%
Skill damage = 83,214

Attacks/Sec = 1000/810ms
Attacks/Sec = 1.234567901

DPS = Attacks/Sec * Skill damage
DPS = 102,734 per mob
Max = 1.32 (4 * 999 + 23) * ((110 + 30) / 100)
Min = Max * 90%
Avg = (Max + Min) / 2
Avg = 7,056

Avg crit = (120% + 150%) / 2
With crits = (Avg * 55% * 135%) + (Avg * 45%)
With crits = 8,414

Non-Elemental damage = With crits * (135% + 12.5%)
Non-Elemental damage = 12,410

Skill damage = Non-Elemental damage * 460%
Skill damage = 57,089

Attacks/Sec = 1000/810ms
Attacks/Sec = 1.234567901

DPS = Attacks/Sec * Skill damage
DPS = 70,480 per mob
Brave Slash 840ms compared to ACB advantage: -12.91%
Brave Slash 840ms compared to ACB no advantage: +26.94%
Brave Slash 1140ms compared to ACB advantage: -35.83%
Brave Slash 1140ms compared to ACB no advantage: -6.46%
Booster, Final Attack, and Maple Warrior (for example) will raise each other's stats equally. Booster may not, but I'm unaware of the Fast (4) speed of an 1140ms attack. If you see something wrong, let me know. I'll gladly update my table and edit this appropriately.

Blast's critical rate only applies to Blast as far as I know.

[ghostofhalo]

Blast's critical rate only applies to Blast as far as I know.Oh, right. I'll double check my numbers, but most of which were copied straight from my excel file, so it's fairly safe to assume the results are still correct. I'll check and edit them now.

EDIT: I've updated my prior post and my table. Brave Slash (1140ms) now ranks above ACB when attacking targets that aren't elementally weak but not above Fury. This of course is geared toward Restructuring while my prior post is Big Bang.

[Baklava]

All characters have clean weapons, stats of 999/23/4/4, and only have their own buffs (Combat Orders/PDRate/identical buffs not included).

Max = 1.32 (4 * 999 + 23) * ((110 + 20) / 100)
Min = Max * 70%
Avg = (Max + Min) / 2
Avg = 5862

Avg crit = (120% + 150%) / 2
With crits = (Avg * 5% * 135%) + (Avg * 95%)
With crits = 5,965

ACA damage = With crits * 200%
ACA damage = 11,929

Skill damage = ACA damage * 210% * 3
Skill damage = 75,153

Attacks/Sec = 1000/840ms
Attacks/Sec = 1.19047619

DPS = Attacks/Sec * Skill damage
DPS = 89,471 per mob
Max = 1.32 (4 * 999 + 23) * ((110 + 20) / 100)
Min = Max * 70%
Avg = (Max + Min) / 2
Avg = 5862

Avg crit = (120% + 150%) / 2
With crits = (Avg * 5% * 135%) + (Avg * 95%)
With crits = 5,965

ACA damage = With crits * 200%
ACA damage = 11,929

Skill damage = ACA damage * 210% * 3
Skill damage = 75,153

Attacks/Sec = 1000/1140ms
Attacks/Sec = 0.877192982

DPS = Attacks/Sec * Skill damage
DPS = 65,926
per mob
Max = 1.32 (4 * 999 + 23) * ((110 + 30) / 100)
Min = Max * 90%
Avg = (Max + Min) / 2
Avg = 7,056

Avg crit = (120% + 150%) / 2
With crits = (Avg * 5% * 135%) + (Avg * 95%)
With crits = 7,179

Elemental damage = With crits * (135% * 150% + 12.5%)
Elemental damage = 15,435

Skill damage = Elemental damage * 460%
Skill damage = 71,001

Attacks/Sec = 1000/810ms
Attacks/Sec = 1.234567901

DPS = Attacks/Sec * Skill damage
DPS = 87,655 per mob
Max = 1.32 (4 * 999 + 23) * ((110 + 30) / 100)
Min = Max * 90%
Avg = (Max + Min) / 2
Avg = 7,056

Avg crit = (120% + 150%) / 2
With crits = (Avg * 5% * 135%) + (Avg * 95%)
With crits = 7,179

Non-Elemental damage = With crits * (135% + 12.5%)
Non-Elemental damage = 10,589

Skill damage = Non-Elemental damage * 460%
Skill damage = 48,709

Attacks/Sec = 1000/810ms
Attacks/Sec = 1.234567901

DPS = Attacks/Sec * Skill damage
DPS = 60,135 per mob
Brave Slash 840ms compared to ACB advantage: +2.07%
Brave Slash 840ms compared to ACB no advantage: +48.78%
Brave Slash 1140ms compared to ACB advantage: -24.79%
Brave Slash 1140ms compared to ACB no advantage: +9.63%
Booster, Final Attack, and Maple Warrior (for example) will raise each other's stats equally. Booster may not, but I'm unaware of the Fast (4) speed of an 1140ms attack. If you see something wrong, let me know. I'll gladly update my table and edit this appropriately.

EDIT: Compared to ACB (which hits double the targets), it's pretty decent in Big Bang in either case (preference to 840ms since it does not stun or hit 6 targets). In Restructuring, not so much as ACB gets buffed far beyond Brave Slash.

So is that what you want? Where Brave Slash is grossly overpowered compared to Advanced Charge Blow, even when it has an elemental advantage?

Sure thing. You sound like you know about balance, bro.
Because those tiny area bosses really make a paladin useful.

Mhm.

also

IGN: ViralAvenger
Server: Demethos
Level: 15X
Job: Hero

lolbiased

[ghostofhalo]

So is that what you want? Where Brave Slash is grossly overpowered compared to Advanced Charge Blow, even when it has an elemental advantage?I wasn't aware that +2.07% was grossly overpowered. ACB stuns 90% of the time and hits double the targets. A fraction of extra damage is fair with a tradeoff like that.

[Anonymous Moose]

So is that what you want? Where Brave Slash is grossly overpowered compared to Advanced Charge Blow, even when it has an elemental advantage?

Sure thing. You sound like you know about balance, bro.
Because those tiny area bosses really make a paladin useful.

Mhm.

also


lolbiased

Why should Blast and ACB be vastly superior in almost every situation?

Anyway Post BB:
Brandish: 1579.34% x3
ACB: 1330.87% x7
This is what I would call balance. Brandish is superior on small groups, and ACB is superior on large groups (and this doesnt factor in elemental advantages).

Enraged Brandish: 2767.60%
Blast: 2299.11%
Blast (Ice Charge/Ice Weak): 2768.15% (I'd add in lightning charge, but I dont know how if affects the elemental advantage)
Here, it shows Heroes have the advantage on Elementally Resistant and Neutral targets, while Paladins will be superior on all that are weak to at least one element.

However, post-restucture:

Brandish: 1255.46%
ACB: 1544.96%
So now ACB is vastly superior and it stuns...

Enraged Brandish: 2187.30%
Blast: 2450.36%
And in this case, we would only have a handful of situations where Brandish would be stronger than Blast: A PDR of 50% or higher (although these calculations do not factor in threaten, and threaten obviously makes the Paladin a better choice at Zakum and HT), and elementally resistant monsters.

You also need to keep in mind that Paladins have far more defensive skills, at least two "buffs" to help the party significantly, and are more likely to reach their optimal DPM. Heroes, excluding shared skills, only have offensive skills and rage, their only party buff, is easily replaced.

Edit: These calculations are in %/second and assuming a fast 5 weapon. Also note that Blave Slash is nerfed to the point where players that hit the speed cap will see Brandish outdamaging Brave Slash.

[CrossMyHeart]

Ghostofhalo has been extremely coherent and unaggressive. If this is indeed true, Heros just became the new Shadower or Buccaneer. Paladins and DrKs have useful buffs. Heros are meant to be a DPS class. Again, I hope this is some mistake before I nerdrage as well.

[ghostofhalo]

Why should Blast and ACB be vastly superior in almost every situation?I completely agree with you. Heroes should be more powerful on neutral and resistant monsters even just marginally. Although, I'm more curious to know the logic behind how you came up with Brandish out-damaging Brave Slash.

EDIT:


Ghostofhalo has been extremely coherent and unaggressive.I appreciate the comment. I've really been trying to keep my nerdrage to a minimum seeing as how I devoted a lot of time to this (my Hero). I'm more so waiting to see how Brave Slash works in Big Bang since it would appear to have the same speed as Brandish although the delay says different.

[ghostofhalo]

Slipped and double posted. Sorry.

[monkeyfist]

Is there a reason to make a Hero anymore?

Paladin- High Defense, Invincibility, added crit to their 1v1 + c/o + 94% Mastery
Dark Knight- H/B, added crit to dragon skills, 90% mastery
Hero- Rage?

[hadriel]

This might not necessarily be the last of the restructuring patches. Take things with a little salt.

Hadriel

[ghostofhalo]

Is there a reason to make a Hero anymore?

Paladin- High Defense, Invincibility, added crit to their 1v1 + c/o + 94% Mastery
Dark Knight- H/B, added crit to dragon skills, 90% mastery
Hero- Rage?According to Nexon...


The main advantage is that they can incur a huge attacking damage with their immense attacking skills, but they are conversely weak against spells. Enemies that are strong against weapon attacks also give them fits. The stamina and attacking abilities are just right, making them the safe choice for the warriors looking to make the advancement.In all honesty, the only thing that's worrying most Heroes right now is the delay. Other than that, I'd really appreciate a boost to Panic/Coma when raising the level of ACA (similar to Boomerang Step raising other skills) in Restructuring so they become a bit more useful.

Anyway, Big Bang should (lightly used) release in about 16 hours from now. We can tell what happens from there. I'll be here the minute I find out what the delay is. I'm not a big fan of uploading to YouTube, so I'll have to leave hard evidence to someone else, but the very least I could do is test it and let the community know what I found the speed to (roughly) be.

EDIT: GMST Hero video (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RKFfiBMjQkM) using Brave Slash at several bosses. Hopefully someone can compare the speed to Brandish.

[Baklava]

Elemental advantage isn't x1.5 anymore, it's x1.2 by the way. And dual charging doesn't stack so something that's weak to both lightning and holy will only be counted towards holy for a paladin.

Elementally weak monsters are far and between too, and not all of them are weak to the most optimal (holy).

None of them have that crazy 90%/94% mastery what are you talking about? That doesn't make any sense at all.
Paladins have 70% and Dark Knights have 80%

If this was the case, and Brave Slash is how it is (1140ms) in kMS right now, why are heroes literally the most popular class next to mechanics?


Oh and then heroes have the skill that lets them ignore 40% of a monster's PDrate...

[Fiel]

None of them have that crazy 90%/94% mastery what are you talking about? That doesn't make any sense at all.
Paladins have 70% and Dark Knights have 80%

70% + 20% base = 90%

Then add 4% from combat orders boost = 94%

did you do your homework on this or are you just spewing stuff you don't know

[Baklava]

70% + 20% base = 90%

Then add 4% from combat orders boost = 94%

did you do your homework on this or are you just spewing stuff you don't know

What 70% + 20% base.
50% + 20% base, is it not?
And dark knights have 50% mastery + 20% base + 10% beholder, no?
What is this.

Where does the 70% come in? If it were 70%, shouldn't the slashes be like golden instead of red by the time you max 2nd job mastery?


Oh wait, I messed up, forgot advanced charge gave mastery too.

So it would be 60% + 20% for Paladins and 50% + 10% + 20% for Dark Knights.

[ghostofhalo]

Elemental advantage isn't x1.5 anymore, it's x1.2 by the way. And dual charging doesn't stack so something that's weak to both lightning and holy will only be counted towards holy for a paladin.
Oh and then heroes have the skill that lets them ignore 40% of a monster's PDrate...Where did you get 1.2x advantage? Also, I never included Lightning as an advantage, just Holy. That and we're not positive that PDRate ignore is additive or multiplicative. Blast might ignore all PDRate 20% of the time (skill description). That much we can figure out. Combat Mastery is something that needs testing.

EDIT: On mastery, melee weapons have 20% base, ranged weapons have 15%, and staves/wands have 15%. The mastery skill adds 50% mastery to that amount. ACB adds 20% more when charged (4% more with Combat Orders) and Beholder adds 20% more while active. Heroes get 20 + 50 = 70%, Paladins get 20 + 50 + 20 + 4 = 94%, and Dark Knights get 20 + 50 + 20 = 90%.

[Baklava]

Where did you get 1.2x advantage? Also, I never included Lightning as an advantage, just Holy. That and we're not positive that PDRate ignore is additive or multiplicative. Blast might ignore all PDRate 20% of the time (skill description). That much we can figure out. Combat Mastery is something that needs testing.

EDIT: On mastery, melee weapons have 20% base, ranged weapons have 15%, and staves/wands have 15%. The mastery skill adds 50% mastery to that amount. ACB adds 20% more when charged (4% more with Combat Orders) and Beholder adds 20% more while active. Heroes get 20 + 50 = 70%, Paladins get 20 + 50 + 20 + 4 = 94%, and Dark Knights get 20 + 50 + 20 = 90%.

They changed it from x1.5 to x1.2 when they introduced dual charging. :T

[ghostofhalo]

They changed it from x1.5 to x1.2 when they introduced dual charging. :TOther sources would indicate otherwise. I'd like to see a source on this since last I checked, dual charging's (for Holy in this example) formula was: (135% * 150%) + ((125% / 10) * 150%) if both had advantage (Anego is weak to both). I could really use a second opinion on this as it would help my DPS table on the three warriors.

[Baklava]

Other sources would indicate otherwise. I'd like to see a source on this since last I checked, dual charging's (for Holy in this example) formula was: (135% * 150%) + ((125% / 10) * 150%) if both had advantage (Anego is weak to both). I could really use a second opinion on this as it would help my DPS table on the three warriors.

Dual Charging doesn't stack weaknesses, and it was x1.25 not x1.2, my bad. I remember somewhere that instead of attaining +125% from lightning, it just became a x1.25 additive to the primary charge. Holy + Lightning looked like ((135% * 1.25) * 125%)
And either way, heroes are still top dog at bosses that matter.

I'm almost certain that Brave Slash went through 3 speed transitions in KMST. Too slow (1410ms), too fast(840ms), and what it is now(1140ms).
It doesn't really make any logical sense that a 3-hit attack with that animation would move as swiftly as a 2-hit attack with a more compressed animation. And I'm guessing that the delay starts as sooner than other skills, which makes it shorter than it really is. :T

Double Fire's 450ms goes into a whopping 810 ms after Triple Fire by adding 1 hit so... :T

[ghostofhalo]

I'm almost certain that Brave Slash went through 3 speed transitions in KMST. Too slow (1410ms), too fast(840ms), and what it is now(1140ms).
It doesn't really make any logical sense that a 3-hit attack with that animation would move as swiftly as a 2-hit attack with a more compressed animation.
The slowed delay makes is so that Brandish is better until Brave Slash hits level 28. While slowed by that much, Blast on a neutral mob even beats Brave Slash with Enrage. Anyway, Stereo played a Post-BB Paladin (http://www.southperry.net/showthread.php?t=34205&p=572897&viewfull=1#post572897) on GMST and tested the damage and even put the Dual Charge formula there.

[Baklava]

The slowed delay makes is so that Brandish is better until Brave Slash hits level 28. While slowed by that much, Blast on a neutral mob even beats Brave Slash with Enrage. Anyway, Stereo played a Post-BB Paladin (http://www.southperry.net/showthread.php?t=34205&p=572897&viewfull=1#post572897) on GMST and tested the damage and even put the Dual Charge formula there.


And I'm guessing that the delay starts as sooner than other skills, which makes it shorter than it really is. :T

Because one thing I noticed is that the slashy animation overlaps by a bit if you hold the key down.

[ghostofhalo]

Because one thing I noticed is that the slashy animation overlaps by a bit if you hold the key down.I saw that, but I'm more or so waiting on tomorrow's release before I decide to start nerdraging anymore about the delay. I'd rather test it and rage than to rage over a number that makes no sense.

[Baklava]

I saw that, but I'm more or so waiting on tomorrow's release before I decide to start nerdraging anymore about the delay. I'd rather test it and rage than to rage over a number that makes no sense.

But really, you want paladins to be 48% weaker than Heroes when they don't have elemental advantage and still 21% weaker than Heroes even when they have elemental advantage?

Ok.

[ghostofhalo]

But really, you want paladins to be 48% weaker than Heroes when they don't have elemental advantage and still 21% weaker than Heroes even when they have elemental advantage?

Ok.If we're referring to ACB vs Brave Slash, I would like to see Brave Slash, a 3-mob attack, deal more damage than ACB, a stunning, 6-mob attack. Not nearly by that much which is why Restructuring buffed Brave Slash by a bit and ACB by a considerable amount.

EDIT: I can see the 48% gain, but where do you see 21%?

EDIT2: For clarification, it doesn't mean ACB is 48% weaker, it means Brave Slash is 48% stronger. In other words, ACB isn't 52% of Brave Slash's damage, Brave Slash is 148% of ACB's damage (neutral mobs).

[Baklava]

If we're referring to ACB vs Brave Slash, I would like to see Brave Slash, a 3-mob attack, deal more damage than ACB, a stunning, 6-mob attack. Not nearly by that much which is why Restructuring buffed Brave Slash by a bit and ACB by a considerable amount.

EDIT: I can see the 48% gain, but where do you see 21%?

EDIT2: For clarification, it doesn't mean ACB is 48% weaker, it means Brave Slash is 48% stronger. In other words, ACB isn't 52% of Brave Slash's damage, Brave Slash is 148% of ACB's damage (neutral mobs).

But why should Blast, a 1 mob attack, be weaker than Brave Slash, a 3 mob attack with and without elemental advantage?


:T

[ghostofhalo]

But why should Blast, a 1 mob attack, be weaker than Brave Slash, a 3 mob attack with and without elemental advantage?


:TIt's not? I never said it was. I was asked to do ACB calculations. Enrage is the only reason Brave Slash should be stronger than Blast on neutral/resistant mobs and no other reason since it limits attacks to one target (effectively making it and all other attacks 1v1).

Brave Slash (1140ms) with Enrage: 40.85% weaker than Blast with advantage (59.15% of Blast's damage)
Brave Slash (1140ms) with Enrage: 13.78% weaker than Blast without advantage (86.22% of Blast's damage)
Brave Slash (840ms) with Enrage: 19.72% weaker than Blast with advantage (80.28% of Blast's damage)
Brave Slash (840ms) with Enrage: 17.02% stronger than Blast without advantage (117.02% of Blast's damage)

EDIT: For poops and giggles, I looked up the skills and added Combat Orders to the Paladin. Keeping the same order as above:
54.75% of Blast's damage
79.83% of Blast's damage
74.30% of Blast's damage
108.34% of Blast's damage

Without Combat Orders, the Hero only beats Blast (on neutral mobs) by 8.34% but falls behind by 25.70% damage when the mob is weak to Holy.

[MysticHLE]

Brave Slash 1140ms compared to ACB advantage: -24.79%

All characters have clean weapons, stats of 999/23/4/4, and only have their own buffs (Combat Orders/PDRate/identical buffs not included).
Brave Slash 840ms compared to ACB advantage: +2.07%
Brave Slash 840ms compared to ACB no advantage: +48.78%
Brave Slash 1140ms compared to ACB advantage: -24.79%
Brave Slash 1140ms compared to ACB no advantage: +9.63%


I'm actually not too good with critical hit calculations, so I'm going to take for granted that those numbers are correct (Yes, I read them, and I can't seem to find anything wrong on the non-critical damage parts).

However, I would like to know how you got:
Non-Elemental damage = With crits * (135% + 12.5%) under ACB no advantage.

I'm going to proceed with posting my calculations done by pure skill % over time, without factoring in criticals (maybe you can explain how it works to me so we can try to figure something out solidly)...and the results are actually somewhat interesting. Please let me know if you find anything wrong with it.

But given your results, I don't understand this...if Braveslash/IS is indeed stronger than ACB where there is no elemental advantage, what are you complaining about? Is it not rightfully so that Paladins (and AMs) should excel at elementally weak targets? Most big bosses (HT, Zak, PB), last time I checked, have no elemental advantage. And stunning at bosses isn't even a concern at all since bosses can't be stunned.

With regards to some of the number posted by Anonymous Moose...please show how you obtained your calculations...it's very frustrating to try to check/believe validity of analysis when all you throw out is the final result.

Here are my calculations and analysis for multi-mob vs. single - without criticals...someone else can analyze/add to my results (which I think are a bit interesting compared to the numbers presented by others so far) based on criticals. These numbers are for post Restructuring. However, since Paladin and Hero both get boosts in Intrepid Slash and Blast/ACB, these results should still roughly reflect meta-game post BB prior to Restructuring (especially since Brandish remains unchanged from BB to Restructuring...as shown below~)


Brandish: 840 ms
Intrepid Slash: 840 ms

Brandish without Coma:
240% * 2 hits * 2 = 960% at 840 ms = 960% / .84 sec = 1142.857% / sec

Intrepid Slash without Coma:
225% * 3 hits * 2 = 1350 % at 1140 ms = 1350% / 1.14 sec = 1184.2% / sec

Coma: 840 ms? (I couldn't find extraction data to check...so I'm going off of experience based on playing a Crusader/Hero of friends)

If we were to calculate the effect of Coma on the overall DPS of Hero...then:

First of all, the probability of getting 2 orbs per attack is 80%, so on average, one can expect an average of 1/.8 hits (expectance of geometric distribution variable) before 2 orbs are charged. Thus, to charge 10 orbs, it would take an average of 5 * (1/.8) = 6.25 hits.

Since the damage increase of each additional orb obtained grows linearly, we may calculate the average damage done over 6.25 hits for Brandish and IS from 0 orbs to 10 orbs by simply: [(initial non-charged damage + final 10 orb damage) / 2 ] * 6.25

Brandish average damage: ([(240% * 2 hits) + (240% * 2 hits * 2) ] / 2) * 6.25 = 4500%
Since each Brandish is 840 ms, 6.25 hits of Brandish = 6.25 * 840ms = 5.25 seconds
Average DPS for 6.25 hits of Brandish (from initial 0 orbs to 10 orbs) = 4500% / 5.25 sec = 857.14% / sec

Intrepid Slash average damage: ([(225% * 3 hits) + (225% * 3 hits * 2) ] / 2) * 6.25 = 6328.125%
Since each Intrepid Slash is 1140 ms, 6.25 hits of Intrepid Slash = 6.25 * 1140ms = 7.125 seconds
Average DPS for 6.25 hits of Intrepid Slash (from initial 0 orbs to 10 orbs) = 6328.125% / 7.125 sec = 888.16% / sec

The above numbers are for when Coma is not used. Thus, if we add Coma and its additional damage and 840 ms delay to the result, we'll get as follows:

6.25 hits of Brandish/Intrepid Slash + 1 Coma = total hits
Coma damage is 400% per orb. So with 10 orbs, Coma = 4000% damage.

Brandish + Coma = 4500% + 4000% = 8500%
Time of Brandish + Coma = 6.25 * 840 ms + 840 ms = 6.09 sec
Average damage of 6.25 hits of Brandish + Coma = 8500% / 6.09 sec = 1395.73% / sec

Intrepid Slash + Coma = 6328.125% + 4000% = 10328.125%
Time of Intrepid Slash + Coma = 6.25 * 1140 ms + 840 ms = 7.965 sec
Average damage of 6.25 hits of Intrepid Slash + Coma = 10328.125% / 7.965 sec = 1296.69% / sec

Compared to Brandish and Intrepid Slash damage without Coma and with constantly fully charged orb:

So we can see from the results so far, for a Hero, the smartest thing to do given the current stats of Restructuring is actually to combine Brandish + Coma for mobs.

Now to compare this result to ACB:

ACB is 600 ms each hit

ACB (Post Restructuring):
Dual Charge Thunder + Holy no advantage: 510% * 1.35 * 1.25 = 860.625% at 600 ms = 860.625% / .6 = 1434.375% / sec
With any elemental advantage, the Paladin would be stronger. However, since I'm not entirely clear yet on Single Charge vs. Multi-Charge elemental advantage calculations (yes, there is a huge diff), I'm not going to delve deeper into this - but it makes sense that Paladins are (much) stronger at elemental mobs just like AMs with Elemental Wands on top of their innate skills.

Conclusion: On average, for target sizes of 2-3, Hero is slightly weaker than Paladin if they use Brandish + Coma. Without Coma, Hero will be much weaker after Restructuring if they stick to only Brandish and Intrepid Slash. For mobs of 4-7 (if we throw in CO), you may do your calculations and compare...I'm too lazy to type that out. If we factor in Hero's Combat Mastery, then roughly speaking, Paladin and Hero should be about equal on mobs with regards to ACB vs. Brandish + Coma.



Assuming that you have read the explanations for the derivations for multiple mobs above, I'm not going to go into as much details of explanation word-wise now.

Assuming Panic delay is also 840 ms (again, I can't find values in current extractions, so I'm going by experience)

Brandish + Enrage:
240% * 2 * 2 * 1.6 = 1536% at 840 ms = 1536% / .840 sec = 1828.57% / sec

Intrepid Slash + Enrage:
225% * 3 * 2 * 1.6 = 2160% at 1140 ms = 2160% / 1.14 sec = 1894.74% / sec

Brandish + Panic + Enrage:
1.6 * (4500% + 480% * 10) = 14880%
Delay: 6.25 * 840 ms + 840 ms = 6.09 sec
Average DPS: 2443.35% / sec

Intrepid Slash + Panic + Enrage:
1.6 * (6328.125% + 480% * 10) = 17805%
Delay: 6.25 * 1140 ms + 840 ms = 7.965 sec
Average DPS: 2235.41% / sec

Dual charge thunder + holy Blast no elemental advantage (if we do not factor critical - yes, I know this makes a huge diff now since Blast has inherent critical rate, but I'm honestly not too familiar with critical formulas atm):

300% * 3 * 1.35 * 1.25 = 1518.75% at 840 ms = 1518.75% / .84 sec = 1808.04% / sec

Conclusion: If I take for granted the value of Blast posted by Anonymous Moose, then for single target DPS, Brandish + Panic + Enrage is pretty on par with Blast.


So...after all said and done...


With the current system as it is, it seems that Heros are not at a clear disadvantage compared to Paladins both on mobs and single target DPS. However, this requires that they use Coma and Panic with Brandish and ditch Intrepid Slash altogether. So while there may seem to be a damage balance (if Heros exploit Brandish + Coma/Panic -/+ Enrage), the Hero class itself would indeed need some rework on Intrepid Slash's delay so that Intrepid Slash is not useless - while still maintaining balance throughout 3rd and 4th job altogether...hm...well, maybe someone can critique these calculations. =)

[CrossMyHeart]

According to Nexon...

In all honesty, the only thing that's worrying most Heroes right now is the delay. Other than that, I'd really appreciate a boost to Panic/Coma when raising the level of ACA (similar to Boomerang Step raising other skills) in Restructuring so they become a bit more useful.

Anyway, Big Bang should (lightly used) release in about 16 hours from now. We can tell what happens from there. I'll be here the minute I find out what the delay is. I'm not a big fan of uploading to YouTube, so I'll have to leave hard evidence to someone else, but the very least I could do is test it and let the community know what I found the speed to (roughly) be.

EDIT: GMST Hero video (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RKFfiBMjQkM) using Brave Slash at several bosses. Hopefully someone can compare the speed to Brandish.

That video looks fast.... No worries then?

EDIT: Just noticed he used a 2 handed sword in that video? It's damn fast... What's going on with the numbers then?

[MysticHLE]

That video looks fast. Almost as fast as a lunchbox or even as fast... No worries then?

EDIT: Nevermind...I timed portions of the video...it's about the same speed of Blast/Brandish with Normal 5 weapon with Booster (~80-82 attacks/min). But we won't know for sure until tomorrow~ :f3:

[ghostofhalo]

However, I would like to know how you got:
Non-Elemental damage = With crits * (135% + 12.5%) under ACB no advantage.It's your damage (including criticals) multiplied by your Holy Charge damage AND one-tenth of your Lightning Charge damage (Dual Charging formula).


But given your results, I don't understand this...if Braveslash/IS is indeed stronger than ACB where there is no elemental advantage, what are you complaining about?I would like to see some kind of advantage for the fact that Brave Slash hits half as many targets using all of my numbers that I did before:
Brave Slash (1140ms) on 3 targets is an average of 197,777 damage.
Brave Slash (840ms) on 3 targets is an average of 268,412 damage.
ACB with advantage on 3 targets is an average of 262,973 damage; on 6 targets is an average of 525,945 damage.
ACB without advantage on 3 targets is an average of 180,411 damage; on 6 targets is an average of 360,823 damage.

On 6 targets without advantage and Brave Slash at 840ms, ACB still causes more damage. In fact, ACB doesn't cause as much damage on 4 targets, but can kill those 4 before the Hero can. With Combat Orders, the Paladin can hit 7 targets with ACB. It's just a matter of targets rather than raw damage.


With regards to some of the number posted by Anonymous Moose...please show how you obtained your calculations...it's very frustrating to try to check/believe validity of analysis when all you throw out is the final result.Back a page is the core elements to my formulas. I'm not entirely sure how I could be more direct without naming things as variables.



Brandish: 840 ms
Intrepid Slash: 840 ms

Brandish without Coma:
240% * 2 hits * 2 = 960% at 840 ms = 960% / .84 sec = 1142.857% / sec

Intrepid Slash without Coma:
225% * 3 hits * 2 = 1350 % at 1140 ms = 1350% / 1.14 sec = 1184.2% / sec

Coma: 840 ms? (I couldn't find extraction data to check...so I'm going off of experience based on playing a Crusader/Hero of friends)

If we were to calculate the effect of Coma on the overall DPS of Hero...then:

First of all, the probability of getting 2 orbs per attack is 80%, so on average, one can expect an average of 1/.8 hits (expectance of geometric distribution variable) before 2 orbs are charged. Thus, to charge 10 orbs, it would take an average of 5 * (1/.8) = 6.25 hits.

Since the damage increase of each additional orb obtained grows linearly, we may calculate the average damage done over 6.25 hits for Brandish and IS from 0 orbs to 10 orbs by simply: [(initial non-charged damage + final 10 orb damage) / 2 ] * 6.25

Brandish average damage: ([(240% * 2 hits) + (240% * 2 hits * 2) ] / 2) * 6.25 = 4500%
Since each Brandish is 840 ms, 6.25 hits of Brandish = 6.25 * 840ms = 5.25 seconds
Average DPS for 6.25 hits of Brandish (from initial 0 orbs to 10 orbs) = 4500% / 5.25 sec = 857.14% / sec

Intrepid Slash average damage: ([(225% * 3 hits) + (225% * 3 hits * 2) ] / 2) * 6.25 = 6328.125%
Since each Intrepid Slash is 1140 ms, 6.25 hits of Intrepid Slash = 6.25 * 1140ms = 7.125 seconds
Average DPS for 6.25 hits of Intrepid Slash (from initial 0 orbs to 10 orbs) = 6328.125% / 7.125 sec = 888.16% / sec

The above numbers are for when Coma is not used. Thus, if we add Coma and its additional damage and 840 ms delay to the result, we'll get as follows:

6.25 hits of Brandish/Intrepid Slash + 1 Coma = total hits
Coma damage is 400% per orb. So with 10 orbs, Coma = 4000% damage.

Brandish + Coma = 4500% + 4000% = 9500%
Time of Brandish + Coma = 6.25 * 840 ms + 840 ms = 6.09 sec
Average damage of 6.25 hits of Brandish + Coma = 9500% / 6.09 sec = 1559.93% / sec

Intrepid Slash + Coma = 6328.125% + 4000% = 10328.125%
Time of Intrepid Slash + Coma = 6.25 * 1140 ms + 840 ms = 7.965 sec
Average damage of 6.25 hits of Intrepid Slash + Coma = 10328.125% / 7.965 sec = 1296.69% / sec

Compared to Brandish and Intrepid Slash damage without Coma and with constantly fully charged orb:

So we can see from the results so far, for a Hero, the smartest thing to do given the current stats of Restructuring is actually to combine Brandish + Coma for mobs.

Now to compare this result to ACB:

ACB is 600 ms each hit

ACB (Post Restructuring):
Dual Charge Thunder + Holy no advantage: 510% * 1.35 * 1.25 = 860.625% at 600 ms = 860.625% / .6 = 1434.375% / sec
With any elemental advantage, the Paladin would be stronger. However, since I'm not entirely clear yet on Single Charge vs. Multi-Charge elemental advantage calculations (yes, there is a huge diff), I'm not going to delve deeper into this - but it makes sense that Paladins are (much) stronger at elemental mobs just like AMs with Elemental Wands on top of their innate skills.

Conclusion: On average, for target sizes of 2-3, Hero is still stronger if they use Brandish + Coma. Without Coma, Hero will be much weaker after Restructuring if they stick to only Brandish and Intrepid Slash. For mobs of 4-7 (if we throw in CO), you may do your calculations and compare...I'm too lazy to type that out.



Assuming that you have read the explanations for the derivations for multiple mobs above, I'm not going to go into as much details of explanation word-wise now.

Assuming Panic delay is also 840 ms (again, I can't find values in current extractions, so I'm going by experience)

Brandish + Enrage:
240% * 2 * 2 * 1.6 = 1536% at 840 ms = 1536% / .840 sec = 1828.57% / sec

Intrepid Slash + Enrage:
225% * 3 * 2 * 1.6 = 2160% at 1140 ms = 2160% / 1.14 sec = 1894.74% / sec

Brandish + Panic + Enrage:
1.6 * (4500% + 480% * 10) = 14880%
Delay: 6.25 * 840 ms + 840 ms = 6.09 sec
Average DPS: 2443.35% / sec

Intrepid Slash + Panic + Enrage:
1.6 * (6328.125% + 480% * 10) = 17805%
Delay: 6.25 * 1140 ms + 840 ms = 7.965 sec
Average DPS: 2235.41% / sec

Dual charge thunder + holy Blast no elemental advantage (if we do not factor critical - yes, I know this makes a huge diff now since Blast has inherent critical rate, but I'm honestly not too familiar with critical formulas atm):

300% * 3 * 1.35 * 1.25 = 1518.75% at 840 ms = 1518.75% / .84 sec = 1808.04% / sec

Conclusion: If I take for granted the value of Blast posted by Anonymous Moose, then for single target DPS, Brandish + Panic + Enrage is pretty on par with Blast.

One thing you will need to redo is Panic/Coma's damage. Stereo tested it on GMST. Refer to this (http://www.southperry.net/showthread.php?t=34205&p=574525&viewfull=1#post574525) post in this (http://www.southperry.net/showthread.php?t=34205) thread about the findings. Other than that, I'd love to see what your DPS comes out to after the adjustments.

[Baklava]

We should all just realistically remember that Brave Slash's 1140 isn't the typical 1140 as we can clearly see.

And you guys are talking as if everything has a potential elemental weakness. Realistically, for regular mobs some, but for bosses, not really.
And I'm talking about big bosses like Zakum, Lionheart, Horntail, Pink Bean.
None of them have any significant elemental weakness.

[ghostofhalo]

We should all just realistically remember that Brave Slash's 1140 isn't the typical 1140 as we can clearly see.And kill the fun sport of math? Naw.
At this point, I'm just sharing my findings and waiting until tomorrow for some solid proof of the attack speed when I can test it.

[Viaje]

Elemental advantage isn't x1.5 anymore, it's x1.2 by the way. And dual charging doesn't stack so something that's weak to both lightning and holy will only be counted towards holy for a paladin.
Source?

Because, unless they changed it with Big Bang (something I missed if they did), elements should act the exact same way they did as of the balance patch.

[ghostofhalo]

Source?

Because, unless they changed it with Big Bang (something I missed if they did), elements should act the exact same way they did as of the balance patch.He was under the assumption that Dual charging was Holy% * Lightning% * 125% (half advantage) which is fair. I first believed that myself. I posted this just after: link (http://www.southperry.net/showthread.php?t=34205&p=572897&viewfull=1#post572897). It's Stereo's GMST findings on Paladin damage. It includes the Dual Charge formula. We've since passed that error.

[MysticHLE]

It's your damage (including criticals) multiplied by your Holy Charge damage AND one-tenth of your Lightning Charge damage (Dual Charging formula).

I would like to see some kind of advantage for the fact that Brave Slash hits half as many targets using all of my numbers that I did before:
Brave Slash (1140ms) on 3 targets is an average of 197,777 damage.
Brave Slash (840ms) on 3 targets is an average of 268,412 damage.
ACB with advantage on 3 targets is an average of 262,973 damage; on 6 targets is an average of 525,945 damage.
ACB without advantage on 3 targets is an average of 180,411 damage; on 6 targets is an average of 360,823 damage.

On 6 targets without advantage and Brave Slash at 840ms, ACB still causes more damage. In fact, ACB doesn't cause as much damage on 4 targets, but can kill those 4 before the Hero can. With Combat Orders, the Paladin can hit 7 targets with ACB. It's just a matter of targets rather than raw damage.

Back a page is the core elements to my formulas. I'm not entirely sure how I could be more direct without naming things as variables.


One thing you will need to redo is Panic/Coma's damage. Stereo tested it on GMST. Refer to this (http://www.southperry.net/showthread.php?t=34205&p=574525&viewfull=1#post574525) post in this (http://www.southperry.net/showthread.php?t=34205) thread about the findings. Other than that, I'd love to see what your DPS comes out to after the adjustments.

Ah, wasn't aware that the text of Coma/Panic lies and isn't accurate (not surprised again). If that is the case, then you're right - Hero would indeed be grossly underpowered. I can see that now without even doing the adjustment~ lol

But a quick adjustment since you requested it:


Brandish + Coma = 4500% + 1600% = 6100%
Time of Brandish + Coma = 6.25 * 840 ms + 840 ms = 6.09 sec
Average damage of 6.25 hits of Brandish + Coma = 6100% / 6.09 sec = 1001.64% / sec

Intrepid Slash + Coma = 6328.125% + 1600% = 7928.125%
Time of Intrepid Slash + Coma = 6.25 * 1140 ms + 840 ms = 7.965 sec
Average damage of 6.25 hits of Intrepid Slash + Coma = 7928.125% / 7.965 sec = 995.37% / sec




Brandish + Panic + Enrage:
1.6 * (4500% + 1920%) = 10272%
Delay: 6.25 * 840 ms + 840 ms = 6.09 sec
Average DPS: 1686.70% / sec

Intrepid Slash + Panic + Enrage:
1.6 * (6328.125% + 1920%) = 13197%
Delay: 6.25 * 1140 ms + 840 ms = 7.965 sec
Average DPS: 1656.87% / sec

[ghostofhalo]

Ah, wasn't aware that the text of Coma/Panic lies and isn't accurate (not surprised again). If that is the case, then you're right - Hero would indeed be grossly underpowered. I can see that now without even doing the adjustment~ lol

But a quick adjustment since you requested it:


Brandish + Coma = 4500% + 1600% = 6100%
Time of Brandish + Coma = 6.25 * 840 ms + 840 ms = 6.09 sec
Average damage of 6.25 hits of Brandish + Coma = 6100% / 6.09 sec = 1001.64% / sec

Intrepid Slash + Coma = 6328.125% + 1600% = 7928.125%
Time of Intrepid Slash + Coma = 6.25 * 1140 ms + 840 ms = 7.965 sec
Average damage of 6.25 hits of Intrepid Slash + Coma = 7928.125% / 7.965 sec = 995.37% / sec




Brandish + Panic + Enrage:
1.6 * (4500% + 1920%) = 10272%
Delay: 6.25 * 840 ms + 840 ms = 6.09 sec
Average DPS: 1686.70% / sec

Intrepid Slash + Panic + Enrage:
1.6 * (6328.125% + 1920%) = 13197%
Delay: 6.25 * 1140 ms + 840 ms = 7.965 sec
Average DPS: 1656.87% / sec
I appreciate the findings. If Brave Slash does turn out to be 1140ms (fingers crossed for 840ms), at least I'll know to use Brandish/Panic for a while until KMS notices.

[Baklava]

And kill the fun sport of math? Naw.


This is a lie and you know it.

[MysticHLE]

I appreciate the findings. If Brave Slash does turn out to be 1140ms (fingers crossed for 840ms), at least I'll know to use Brandish/Panic for a while until KMS notices.

Thanks for the correction actually. But no, since Panic and Coma are not as the string describes, then pure Intrepid Slash is the way to go still...sadly.


This is a lie and you know it.

No lie, this was fun! xD

[Alilatias]

[Censored], I completely forgot what the answer to this was, and where to even start looking for it without being swamped by hundreds of pages of discussions about unrelated stuff, so I guess I'll ask again here since this seems to be the right thread for it.

Over at MSEA, I've decided to do this Q/A thing regarding Big Bang changes that the MSEAers are wondering about. One of them just asked me a question regarding weapon speed. Is the weapon speed cap the same as before, or was it altered in some way? (The answer will basically become the decision on whether he uses a Purple Surfboard or a Sky Ski.)

EDIT: Damn that was fast. Thanks, guys.

[ghostofhalo]

This is a lie and you know it.lol, I actually enjoy math. Hell, I'm having more fun now than I have all day. It's not every day I get to do stuff like this, which is a bit ironic since I'm in college to program.

EDIT:
Thanks for the correction actually. But no, since Panic and Coma are not as the string describes, then pure Intrepid Slash is the way to go still...sadly.
No lie, this was fun! xD
Oh bugger, oh well.


One of them just asked me a question regarding weapon speed. Is the weapon speed cap the same as before, or was it altered in some way?Same cap. No changes.

[Viaje]

[Censored], I completely forgot what the answer to this was, and where to even start looking for it without being swamped by hundreds of pages of discussions about unrelated stuff, so I guess I'll ask again here since this seems to be the right thread for it.

Over at MSEA, I've decided to do this Q/A thing regarding Big Bang changes that the MSEAers are wondering about. One of them just asked me a question regarding weapon speed. Is the weapon speed cap the same as before, or was it altered in some way?
THe cap seems to be still in place, so weapons are stuck at Fastest (2).

[MysticHLE]

lol, I actually enjoy math. Hell, I'm having more fun now than I have all day. It's not every day I get to do stuff like this, which is a bit ironic since I'm in college to program.

Funny that you say that, I have Computer Networks and Computer Graphics finals tomorrow. xD Thanks for the enlightenment...now to study.

But you got me as a strong supporter for making Intrepid Slash 840 ms now even though I'm a Paladin! :f2:

[Baklava]

You know that since this is directly from GMS' Test Server, the delay listed here should be exactly as shown in-game...and we can clearly see that it's now how it looks.



SOMETIMES THE MATH DOESN'T WORK THAT WAY.

[MysticHLE]

You know that since this is directly from GMS' Test Server, the delay listed here should be exactly as shown in-game...and we can clearly see that it's now how it looks.



SOMETIMES THE MATH DOESN'T WORK THAT WAY.

Math always works. You just gotta blame Nexon and their programming. :f3:

[Baklava]

Math always works. You just gotta blame Nexon and their programming. :f3:

USE MATH TO SOLVE RELIGION.


I DARE YOU.


But anyway, there has to be something else that we're not getting.

[ghostofhalo]

But anyway, there has to be something else that we're not getting.The only thing I could think of is Brave Slash is using the wrong delay since it's the same skillID as Brandish is pre-BB. I was hoping someone who could extract would notice all the activity here and would double-check for us. Fiel could have listed Brave Slash's delay as 1140ms because the delay variable "braveslash" (assuming it's the same name from KMS) is 1140ms although it might still be using the variable "brandish" which has a value of 840ms.

<shrug> We'll find out soon.

[MysticHLE]

USE MATH TO SOLVE RELIGION.


I DARE YOU.


But anyway, there has to be something else that we're not getting.

Sorry for going off topic here...but this is too fun... xD

It's simple to solve religion with math~

Nothingness =
Nothingness + Creator = Us
Nothingness + Creator = Us + Nothingness
Creator = Us

When we die, creator dies. :f2:

[Anonymous Moose]

But why should Blast, a 1 mob attack, be weaker than Brave Slash, a 3 mob attack with and without elemental advantage?


:T

Paladins still have the advantage against elementally weak monsters, and its important to balance the entire skill set of one class with the entire skill set of all other classes. Balancing two different skills on two different characters without taking into consideration the full skill set of each class is no less than foolish.

Edit: I almost forgot. We are not comparing a mobbing skill to Blast. When Enrage is active we are comparing a 1 target skill with another 1 target skill.

[TagerBustah]

i am loving this, i never thought id ever see the day that heros would start complaining that us paladins are overpowered. BigBang is a whole new era indeed and its about dam time. From loladins to Proadins :glitter:
i guess we should start calling you guys LoLeroes now :f3:

[Baklava]

The only thing I could think of is Brave Slash is using the wrong delay since it's the same skillID as Brandish is pre-BB. I was hoping someone who could extract would notice all the activity here and would double-check for us. Fiel could have listed Brave Slash's delay as 1140ms because the delay variable "braveslash" (assuming it's the same name from KMS) is 1140ms although it might still be using the variable "brandish" which has a value of 840ms.

<shrug> We'll find out soon.

Brave Slash is Brave Slash in KMS.

It's some silly named skill called Intrepid Slash in GMS.

[0^2]

i am loving this, i never thought id ever see the day that heros would start complaining that us paladins are overpowered. BigBang is a whole new era indeed and its about dam time. From loladins to Proadins :glitter:
i guess we should start calling you guys LoLeroes now :f3:
Honestly I would think theyd say something about Paladins being nigh unkillable not damage. Frankly Heroes are no worse off and Enrage is an insane power up. I still believe Paladin should do superior 1v1 damage than a Hero regardless of them using Enrage. Where is a Paladin's ability to turn Blast into a giant laser of mob destruction if Heroes can make their mob skill be better than our 1v1?

[Fiel]

The only thing I could think of is Brave Slash is using the wrong delay since it's the same skillID as Brandish is pre-BB. I was hoping someone who could extract would notice all the activity here and would double-check for us. Fiel could have listed Brave Slash's delay as 1140ms because the delay variable "braveslash" (assuming it's the same name from KMS) is 1140ms although it might still be using the variable "brandish" which has a value of 840ms.

<shrug> We'll find out soon.

Nope. I look at the skillID for braveslash, check "action/0" to get the delay class, then go to where the delay classes are, grab that delay class, sum the absolute value of all the given delays, and output that.

[Dusk]

Delays aren't always accurate. For example, Explosion has a very short cast time, but it includes a dummy weapon attack before it goes off. We'll have to do some testing.

[JoeTang]

Delays aren't always accurate. For example, Explosion has a very short cast time, but it includes a dummy weapon attack before it goes off. We'll have to do some testing.

Of all the delays we've ever seen, only Explosion has one that's unexplainable I believe. I tested it in GMST to be 1440ms Normal (6) unboostered I believe. Something ridiculously long and slow, and you could only Teleport once during it or something, making it even worse.

[Anonymous Moose]

Honestly I would think theyd say something about Paladins being nigh unkillable not damage. Frankly Heroes are no worse off and Enrage is an insane power up. I still believe Paladin should do superior 1v1 damage than a Hero regardless of them using Enrage. Where is a Paladin's ability to turn Blast into a giant laser of mob destruction if Heroes can make their mob skill be better than our 1v1?

Lose ACB and HH (reducing you to 1 viable attack skill) and then the arguement of "Blast should do more damage than Brandish/Brave Slash" would hold water.

And Brave Slash is not a mob skill when Enrage is active.

[0^2]

Lose ACB and HH (reducing you to 1 viable attack skill) and then the arguement of "Blast should do more damage than Brandish/Brave Slash" would hold water.

And Brave Slash is not a mob skill when Enrage is active.

Heavens Hammer is a viable attack? Since when can it kill monsters or not have a cooldown? Anyway what im saying is Heroes have a way to super power themselves for bosses making blasts high damage &#37; a moot point despite all the other bonuses they could have. Few bosses have weaknesses so the whole elemental advantage shtick is meaningless. Oh i suppose Pianus and a couple of Zakum arms account for all the rest of the time Heroes are superior right? Oh right it doesn't because Heroes can hit many arms at once then crush the body into pebbles with Enrage.

[Anonymous Moose]

Heavens Hammer is a viable attack? Since when? Anyway what im saying is Heroes have a way to super power themselves for bosses making blasts high damage % a moot point despite all the other bonuses they could have. Few bosses have weaknesses so the whole elemental advantage shtick is meaningless. Oh i suppose Pianus and a couple of Zakum arms account for all the rest of the time Heroes are superior right? Oh right it doesn't because Heroes can hit many arms at once then crush the body into pebbles with Enrage.
People always underestimate the power of decreasing several monster's HP to 1, but my point is that Paladins have several skills and are able to more easily adapt to different situations. Heroes have only one an are no where near as good as adapting to more situations.
It also makes sense that a Paladin would be weaker against neutral targets, especially because they are a defensive class and the Hero is practically pure offense (with the exception of some shared skills). Logically focusing on defense and offense would produce a warrior that does less damage than a warrior that focused on pure offense.

Anyway...
Bosses over 100:
Fire Weak:
Pianus
Big Foot
Azure Ocelot
Scarlion
Relik
Body Guard A
The Boss
Munin

Ice Weak:
Manon
Scarlet Phoenix
Kacchuu Musha
Hsalf
Targa
Body Guard B
Hugin

Lightning Weak:
Headless Horseman
Kacchuu Musha
Anego
Lilynouch
Black Crow

Holy Weak:
Scarlet Phoenix
Azure Ocelot
Kacchuu Musha
Anego

Neutral (or lacks complete elemental resistance):
Leviathan
Dodo
Snowman
Papulatus
Red Nirg
Zakum
Lyka
HT
Dunas Type D
Pink Bean
Soloman
Rex
Feudal Lord

Resistant to all of the above:
Ergoth
Margana
Krexel
Ariel

I love it when people pretend that there are no elementally weak bosses.

[0^2]

People always underestimate the power of decreasing several monster's HP to 1, but my point is that Paladins have several skills and are able to more easily adapt to different situations. Heroes have only one an are no where near as good as adapting to more situations.
It also makes sense that a Paladin would be weaker against neutral targets, especially because they are a defensive class and the Hero is practically pure offense (with the exception of some shared skills). Logically focusing on defense and offense would produce a warrior that does less damage than a warrior that focused on pure offense.

Anyway...
Bosses over 100:
Fire Weak:
Pianus
Big Foot
Azure Ocelot
Scarlion
Relik
Body Guard A
The Boss
Munin

Ice Weak:
Manon
Scarlet Phoenix
Kacchuu Musha
Hsalf
Targa
Body Guard B
Hugin

Lightning Weak:
Headless Horseman
Kacchuu Musha
Anego
Lilynouch
Black Crow

Holy Weak:
Scarlet Phoenix
Azure Ocelot
Kacchuu Musha
Anego

Neutral (or lacks complete elemental resistance):
Leviathan
Dodo
Snowman
Papulatus
Red Nirg
Zakum
Lyka
HT
Dunas Type D
Pink Bean
Soloman
Rex
Feudal Lord

Resistant to all of the above:
Ergoth
Margana
Krexel
Ariel

I love it when people pretend that there are no elementally weak bosses.
Hm lets see...CWK bosses are meaningless since weakness/resistances are so jumbled up in the fight. All of the bosses in Neutral only add to the idea that theres a huge lack in elementally weak bosses. Can a warrior even use their main attack on Munin and Hugin without dooming the squad from mass seduce? So we are left with 2 squad bosses, Targa & Scarlion of which have elemental weakness of one isnt even that good (ice is weak).

[yo72]

People always underestimate the power of decreasing several monster's HP to 1(bb changed it to 10k)
Anyway...
Bosses over 100:
Fire Weak:
Pianus(Doesn't he not drop anything post bb?_
Big Foot(Nerfed to hell)
Azure Ocelot(comes in at least 2)
Scarlion(Decent but not good exp)
Relik(Most time cwkpq bosses going to be ina group)
Body Guard A(Most warriors dont go to bg)
The Boss(Same^)
Munin(Decent example)

Ice Weak:
Manon(Such little hp the advantage shouldn't matter)
Scarlet Phoenix(Usually in a mob)
Kacchuu Musha(Decent but isnt he nerfed badly also?)
Hsalf(In a mob)
Targa(Decent)
Body Guard B(Most warriors dont bg)
Hugin(Decent)

Lightning Weak:
Headless Horseman(Lol?)
Kacchuu Musha(Decent if not nerfed)
Anego(Decent if not nerfed)
Lilynouch(Arent ToT bosses weaker now?)
Black Crow(Decent-ish?)

Holy Weak:
Scarlet Phoenix(Ina mob)
Azure Ocelot(Comes in twos)
Kacchuu Musha(Decent if not nerfed)
Anego(Same)

Neutral (or lacks complete elemental resistance):
Leviathan
Dodo
Snowman
Papulatus
Red Nirg
Zakum
Lyka
HT
Dunas Type D
Pink Bean
Soloman
Rex
Feudal Lord

Resistant to all of the above:
Ergoth
Margana
Krexel
Ariel

I love it when people pretend that there are no elementally weak bosses.

Answers next to boss name

[Anonymous Moose]

Make any excuse you want. It wont change the fact that there is a good number of elementally weak bosses. And even if there arent enough that you care about, that isnt a good excuse to make Paladins superior to Heroes (especially with their defense buffs). If the problem is a lack of bosses that are elementally weak, then complain about that and demand a greater variety of bosses. Its much more logical to fix the problem rather than attack factors unrelated to the problem.

Edit: also keep in mind that a later patch will buff most area bosses, and possibly some WT bosses if nexon isnt too lazy about it.

[Fiel]

As you've shown, there are elementally weak bosses. I just parsed through all mobs and found those with the following requirements:

- Be a boss
- Be greater than level 100
- Have some sort of elemental immunity, strength, or weakness

Here's my list:


Bergamot|113|Fire strong, Lightning weak, Ice weak, Poison immune
Bergamot|113|Fire strong, Lightning weak, Ice weak, Poison immune
Bergamot|113|Fire strong, Lightning weak, Ice weak, Poison immune
Manon|120|Fire strong, Ice weak
Griffey|120|Lightning strong, Poison weak
Leviathan|145|Fire strong, Ice strong
Dodo|150|Fire strong, Ice strong, Lightning strong, Poison strong
Lilynouch|159|Ice strong, Lightning weak
Lyka|168|Fire strong, Poison weak
Dunas|117|Poison immune
Aufheben|117|Ice weak, Poison weak
Oberon|122|Fire strong, Poison strong
Nibelung|130|Fire strong, Lightning weak, Ice weak, Poison immune
Nibelung|130|Fire strong, Lightning weak, Ice weak, Poison immune
Nibelung|130|Fire strong, Lightning weak, Ice weak, Poison immune
Soaring Griffey|120|Lightning strong, Poison weak
Pianus|110|Fire weak
Pianus|110|Fire weak
Zakum's Arm 3|110|Fire strong, Ice weak, Poison immune
Zakum's Arm 4|110|Ice strong, Lightning strong, Fire weak
Chaos Zakum Arm 3|140|Fire strong, Ice weak, Poison immune
Chaos Zakum Arm 4|140|Ice strong, Lightning strong, Fire weak
Blue Wyvern|101|Fire weak, Ice strong
Dark Cornian|105|Poison strong
Chaos Blue Wyvern|101|Fire weak, Ice strong
Chaos Dark Cornian|105|Poison strong
Pink Bean|180|Physical strong, Holy strong, Fire strong, Ice strong, Dark strong
Ariel|180|Holy immune, Fire strong, Lightning strong, Ice strong, Dark strong
Hugin|180|Fire strong, Ice weak
Munin|180|Ice strong, Fire weak
Mini Bean|150|Poison strong, Ice weak, Fire weak
Hugin|180|Fire strong, Ice weak
Munin|180|Ice strong, Fire weak
Poison Gas Generator|120|Lightning strong, Ice weak
Ergoth|115|Ice strong, Fire strong, Lightning strong, Holy strong, Poison strong, Dark strong
The Elemental Thanatos|108|Fire weak, Ice immune, Lightning immune, Poison immune, Holy immune, Physical immune, Dark immune
Phoenix|120|Fire strong, Ice weak
Freezer|120|Fire weak, Ice strong
The Elemental Thanatos|108|Ice weak, Fire immune, Lightning immune, Poison immune, Holy immune, Physical immune, Dark immune
Manon|105|Fire strong, Ice weak
Griffey|105|Lightning strong, Poison weak
Leviathan|120|Fire strong, Ice strong
Black Crow|115|Lightning weak
Bodyguard A|152|Fire weak, Poison immune
Bodyguard B|155|Ice weak
Female Boss|130|Lightning weak, Holy weak
The Boss|175|Fire weak
Kacchuu Musha|120|Fire strong, Lightning weak, Holy weak, Ice weak, Poison immune
Castellan|180|Poison weak
Castellan Toad|180|Poison immune
Bigfoot|102|Fire weak, Ice immune, Holy immune
Margana|120|Holy immune, Lightning strong, Fire strong, Ice strong, Fire strong
Rellik|120|Holy immune, Fire weak
Hsalf|120|Ice weak, Holy immune
Master Guardian|105|Ice immune, Fire immune, Poison immune, Lightning immune, Holy immune
Scarlet Phoenix|120|Fire immune, Poison immune, Ice weak, Holy weak
Azure Ocelot|120|Ice immune, Lightning immune, Holy weak, Fire weak
Bully Visitor|120|Fire strong, Ice weak, Lightning weak
Bully Visitor|120|Fire strong, Ice weak, Lightning weak
Bully Visitor|120|Fire strong, Ice weak, Lightning weak
Unjust Visitor|120|Fire strong, Ice weak, Poison weak
Destroyer|120|Fire strong, Ice weak, Lightning weak
Commander|120|Fire weak, Ice strong, Poison weak
Ultimate Visitor|120|Fire strong, Ice strong, Holy weak
Krexel|140|Fire strong, Ice weak
Krexel|140|Fire strong, Ice strong, Poison strong, Holy strong, Lightning strong
Furious Targa|140|Fire strong, Ice weak, Poison immune
Furious Scarlion Boss|140|Ice strong, Lightning strong, Fire weak
Manon|105|Fire strong, Ice weak
Griffey|105|Lightning strong, Poison weak
Leviathan|120|Fire strong, Ice strong
Pianus|110|Fire weak

[Anonymous Moose]

As you've shown, there are elementally weak bosses. I just parsed through all mobs and found those with the following requirements:

- Be a boss
- Be greater than level 100
- Have some sort of elemental immunity, strength, or weakness

Here's my list:


Bergamot|113|Fire strong, Lightning weak, Ice weak, Poison immune
Bergamot|113|Fire strong, Lightning weak, Ice weak, Poison immune
Bergamot|113|Fire strong, Lightning weak, Ice weak, Poison immune
Manon|120|Fire strong, Ice weak
Griffey|120|Lightning strong, Poison weak
Leviathan|145|Fire strong, Ice strong
Dodo|150|Fire strong, Ice strong, Lightning strong, Poison strong
Lilynouch|159|Ice strong, Lightning weak
Lyka|168|Fire strong, Poison weak
Dunas|117|Poison immune
Aufheben|117|Ice weak, Poison weak
Oberon|122|Fire strong, Poison strong
Nibelung|130|Fire strong, Lightning weak, Ice weak, Poison immune
Nibelung|130|Fire strong, Lightning weak, Ice weak, Poison immune
Nibelung|130|Fire strong, Lightning weak, Ice weak, Poison immune
Soaring Griffey|120|Lightning strong, Poison weak
Pianus|110|Fire weak
Pianus|110|Fire weak
Zakum's Arm 3|110|Fire strong, Ice weak, Poison immune
Zakum's Arm 4|110|Ice strong, Lightning strong, Fire weak
Chaos Zakum Arm 3|140|Fire strong, Ice weak, Poison immune
Chaos Zakum Arm 4|140|Ice strong, Lightning strong, Fire weak
Blue Wyvern|101|Fire weak, Ice strong
Dark Cornian|105|Poison strong
Chaos Blue Wyvern|101|Fire weak, Ice strong
Chaos Dark Cornian|105|Poison strong
Pink Bean|180|Physical strong, Holy strong, Fire strong, Ice strong, Dark strong
Ariel|180|Holy immune, Fire strong, Lightning strong, Ice strong, Dark strong
Hugin|180|Fire strong, Ice weak
Munin|180|Ice strong, Fire weak
Mini Bean|150|Poison strong, Ice weak, Fire weak
Hugin|180|Fire strong, Ice weak
Munin|180|Ice strong, Fire weak
Poison Gas Generator|120|Lightning strong, Ice weak
Ergoth|115|Ice strong, Fire strong, Lightning strong, Holy strong, Poison strong, Dark strong
The Elemental Thanatos|108|Fire weak, Ice immune, Lightning immune, Poison immune, Holy immune, Physical immune, Dark immune
Phoenix|120|Fire strong, Ice weak
Freezer|120|Fire weak, Ice strong
The Elemental Thanatos|108|Ice weak, Fire immune, Lightning immune, Poison immune, Holy immune, Physical immune, Dark immune
Manon|105|Fire strong, Ice weak
Griffey|105|Lightning strong, Poison weak
Leviathan|120|Fire strong, Ice strong
Black Crow|115|Lightning weak
Bodyguard A|152|Fire weak, Poison immune
Bodyguard B|155|Ice weak
Female Boss|130|Lightning weak, Holy weak
The Boss|175|Fire weak
Kacchuu Musha|120|Fire strong, Lightning weak, Holy weak, Ice weak, Poison immune
Castellan|180|Poison weak
Castellan Toad|180|Poison immune
Bigfoot|102|Fire weak, Ice immune, Holy immune
Margana|120|Holy immune, Lightning strong, Fire strong, Ice strong, Fire strong
Rellik|120|Holy immune, Fire weak
Hsalf|120|Ice weak, Holy immune
Master Guardian|105|Ice immune, Fire immune, Poison immune, Lightning immune, Holy immune
Scarlet Phoenix|120|Fire immune, Poison immune, Ice weak, Holy weak
Azure Ocelot|120|Ice immune, Lightning immune, Holy weak, Fire weak
Bully Visitor|120|Fire strong, Ice weak, Lightning weak
Bully Visitor|120|Fire strong, Ice weak, Lightning weak
Bully Visitor|120|Fire strong, Ice weak, Lightning weak
Unjust Visitor|120|Fire strong, Ice weak, Poison weak
Destroyer|120|Fire strong, Ice weak, Lightning weak
Commander|120|Fire weak, Ice strong, Poison weak
Ultimate Visitor|120|Fire strong, Ice strong, Holy weak
Krexel|140|Fire strong, Ice weak
Krexel|140|Fire strong, Ice strong, Poison strong, Holy strong, Lightning strong
Furious Targa|140|Fire strong, Ice weak, Poison immune
Furious Scarlion Boss|140|Ice strong, Lightning strong, Fire weak
Manon|105|Fire strong, Ice weak
Griffey|105|Lightning strong, Poison weak
Leviathan|120|Fire strong, Ice strong
Pianus|110|Fire weak


Thank you for the list. It even had some monsters that I had difficulty finding the weaknesses/restances for earlier.

Edit: New list:
Fire Weak:
Bergamot
Pianus
Munin
Body Guard A
The Boss
Big Foot
Relik
Azure Ocelot
Commander (vpq)
Scarlion

Ice Weak:
Bergamot
Aufheben
Nibelung
Hugin
Poinson Gas Generator (not sure if this would count or not at the moment)
Manon
Body Guard B
Kacchuu Musha
Hsalf
Scarlet Phoenix
Bully Visitor (vpq)
Unjust Visitor (vpq)
Destroyer (vpq)
Krexel (apparently only one of his forms, the other is resistant)
Targa

Lightning Weak:
Lilynouch
Nibelung
Black Crow
Anego
Kacchuu Musha
Bully Visitor
Destroyer

Holy Weak:
Angeo
Kacchuu Musha
Scarlet Phoenix
Azure Ocelot
Ultimate Visitor (vpq)

Lightning Resistant (important to mention, because of Dual Charging)
Griffey
Dodo
Ariel
Gas Poison Generator
Ergoth
Margana
Krexel (the other form)
Scarlion

[Forad]

And kill the fun sport of math? Naw.
At this point, I'm just sharing my findings and waiting until tomorrow for some solid proof of the attack speed when I can test it.

I guess the brave slash in BB-patched GMS will remain 840ms.
Brave slash is changed in KMS 1.2.355,I don't think BB-patched GMS will use this version.

[TagerBustah]

Honestly I would think theyd say something about Paladins being nigh unkillable not damage. Frankly Heroes are no worse off and Enrage is an insane power up. I still believe Paladin should do superior 1v1 damage than a Hero regardless of them using Enrage. Where is a Paladin's ability to turn Blast into a giant laser of mob destruction if Heroes can make their mob skill be better than our 1v1?

This times infinity, you are absolutely right.


I guess the brave slash in BB-patched GMS will remain 840ms.
Brave slash is changed in KMS 1.2.355,I don't think BB-patched GMS will use this version.

i guess you missed Fiel's post on top of this very page.

[Baklava]

But how many of those are bosses that people actually care about?

[CrossMyHeart]

Since I cant get on Scania Im dying to know if In trepid Slash is nerfed or not.

[monkeyfist]

Since I cant get on Scania Im dying to know if In trepid Slash is nerfed or not.

I just tested it and it's the same speed as Brandish. All Heroes can breath a little easier now.

[Phoenix]

I just tested it and it's the same speed as Brandish. All Heroes can breath a little easier now.

Hmm, I got about 6x Slashes in a minute with a Normal 6 Sword. But I only got to try it once before it kicked me off. So it might be ok.

I should get 71 without booster right with a normal sword right?

[JoeTang]

Hmm, I got about 6x Slashes in a minute with a Normal 6 Sword. But I only got to try it once before it kicked me off. So it might be ok.

I should get 71 without booster right with a normal sword right?

Yes. If it was 1140, you'd get 53 in a minute.

[ODERS]

I got the same speed as brandish with intrepid slash

[Fiel]

I got the same speed as brandish with intrepid slash

Finally found the answer, but the quest for truth is often more interesting than the truth itself. I will give a spoiler alert, though. I found a bug!

This utterly baffled me, so I went searching for answers. I checked the results of my regex and it turns out it was spitting out an additional 300 ms garbage value at the end. But how is this possible? It shouldn't be doing that. I then changed a simple ".*?" to "\d+" and it worked perfectly. Turns out ".*?" is too permissive which allowed the query to find 3 - 4 lines instead of just one, singular line. So it stole delay values from other delay classes causing it to spew out wrong values. How disheartening. I did do some preliminary testing before calling this method stable, but the ones I tested on were unaffected by this bug. Damn.

I sincerely, really apologize for the mistake and for causing such an uproar. Mia culpa. The correct delays are now posted.

[byakugan]

Finally found the answer, but the quest for truth is often more interesting than the truth itself. I will give a spoiler alert, though. I found a bug!

This utterly baffled me, so I went searching for answers. I checked the results of my regex and it turns out it was spitting out an additional 300 ms garbage value at the end. But how is this possible? It shouldn't be doing that. I then changed a simple ".*?" to "\d+" and it worked perfectly. Turns out ".*?" is too permissive which allowed the query to find 3 - 4 lines instead of just one, singular line. So it stole delay values from other delay classes causing it to spew out wrong values. How disheartening. I did do some preliminary testing before calling this method stable, but the ones I tested on were unaffected by this bug. Damn.

I sincerely, really apologize for the mistake and for causing such an uproar. Mia culpa. The correct delays are now posted.

Nah, it's all ok. Even when I did nothing at all, I had fun reading all the comments and calculations in this thread. I'm sure most of us feel the same way (except Paladins xD).

[TagerBustah]

Nah, it's all ok. Even when I did nothing at all, I had fun reading all the comments and calculations in this thread. I'm sure most of us feel the same way (except Paladins xD).

its was fun seeing heroes rage. theres nothing for paladins to wory about we still get large damage buffs to blast and Acb in the restructuring update.

[Stereo]

I don't know where the Charge Blow 600ms delay is coming from, but I tested it at speed 2 and 3, and both matched with 800ms delay (100 and 92 per min?). It's listed as 600ms both here and in Dusk's BB skill thread...