So.... how much does it cost to be a strong magician?

[gucci]

Someone was complaining to me about how expensive it is to be a Bishop/Archmage at the moment. I decided to breakdown the cost of how much it costs to equip up a decent/strong Bis/AM to find out (Assuming the server is Scania, the rough cost of some good luk mage items using current market prices):

30int+ Zhelm : approx 200m (This is very subjective as some people are lucky and scroll a 30+int in their first try, some have broken over 20 helms and considering 70% helm int was 15m each just a while ago. I guess this goes for other classes now too since helm dex 70% has appeared)

30int Overall : approx 500m

20+stat (Int+MA) Gloves : approx 300m

Doomsday staff for Bishop : approx 600m
Elemental Wands for AM : approx 2B?? lol

12/20 Earrings : approx 500m

8/16 Shield : approx 800m?

8/10 cape : approx 200m?

LoL. I haven't even calculated lukless mage items. Nor mentioned horntail pendants/eggs (for those who have to buy, considering AM are prob the hardest to get into a ht run) & skill books. Correct me if the prices are wrong. Anyway i just think this goes to show how crazy it is if you want to be a strong mage now. New magicians watch out!

Btw can someone post how much it costs to equip a decent NL or maybe another class? I'm curious to know:redface:

[wobbufet]

It's expensive for every class if you wanna be strong.

[MaxHudson]

Op, you do know there is a diffrence from "Strong and godly" Right? the gear you posted was really uhhh Godly?

Which one are you talking about?

[gucci]

It's expensive for every class if you wanna be strong.

That's true but mage equips give the least "improvement for mesos" spent. Weapon Attack classes have stuff like weapon atk for gloves and shoes. The amount of mesos for mages to improve just 1 int is crazy.


Op, you do know there is a diffrence from "Strong and godly" Right? the gear you posted was really uhhh Godly?

Which one are you talking about?

Ask any godly mage. The gears i posted are only decent/good.

[butterfλi]

If you want to compare to an NL that uses 20+ sets of cilbis, 60+atk claw, 20+ atk glove, 5+ atk shoes, 6+ atk cape, and a bunch of other stuff, that's just silly.

Just the 20+ sets of cilbis alone is more than 2 billion. Chaos scrolled cape and shoes just makes them impossible to compare.

The two classes are very different because the power of the NL comes from equips--something you can buy. The power of the magician comes from their spell attack--something the game gives.

Metaphorically speaking, It's kinda like...

Magicians
100% damage

70% comes from base spell attack
30% comes from equips

Night Lords
100% damage

70% comes from equips
30% comes from base attack (L7, TT has 150%)

For NLs, it's almost like they're buying their power. Magicians can't. So equips are cheaper for magicians.

The market these days, the best of the best will cost billions. It just depends on how many billions.

[Kawasari Mimoto]

Having friends that has access/own LUKless I/Ls, reg-LUK Bishops, etc etc etc., I can tell you this now.. you don't need an abundance of Mesos to fund a strong Archmage/Bishop, it's not like you're trying to make a Night Lord, similar to what Butterfli said.

Cheapest path is to be a LUKless mage or of such, that way, you can dish out more damage without having to pay a ton for equipments, unless you're trying to be supremely-godly.. then you're just wasting your time, and have to pay even MORE for godly equipments than a regular LUK-mage/bishop... >_>

[Cyanne]

Well, bishops are generally richer than archmages because they spend pretty much nothing to train 1-120, and most of them regularly attend zakum or horntail runs for profit. Their ultimate also costs less, and they can let other people leech better for more money.

Also, what's your definition of strong? If you're talking about stronger than the average magician, then the equipment you listed will definitely be way over the top. For example, I doubt more than 50% of magicians have a successfully scrolled zakum helm, 20/12 earrings, or an elemental wand. And how is it harder for an archmage to get into a horntail run as a buyer as compared to any other class? Buyers just stand outside anyways.

[Kasey]

Godly iz more liek....

4 Base luk
18/110+ Maple Shiner Wand/ Wisdom Staff-Bishop // Elemental Staff-Mage
= 1.8b/2.1b

15/25 + Earrings
2.1b

11/22+ Shield
2.1b

17/15+ Lukless Gloves
2.1b+

35+ Stat Overall (Levels 0-48 Only)
~1.2b+

5 Int Yellow Snowshoes
400mil? <-- yay cheap =D

20+ Stat Cape
500m+

35+ Int Zhelm// 16-17 Luk base
Endless reloots & scrolls -> Min: 150m Max: Infinity

+23 Int/+23 Luk Horntail Pendant (8/8 base + egg)
Endless reloots -> Min: 650m Max: (Extra pendant reloots 300m. each)

There ya go =)

Its not even that much meso f3

[gucci]

Also, what's your definition of strong? If you're talking about stronger than the average magician, then the equipment you listed will definitely be way over the top. For example, I doubt more than 50% of magicians have a successfully scrolled zakum helm, 20/12 earrings, or an elemental wand. And how is it harder for an archmage to get into a horntail run as a buyer as compared to any other class? Buyers just stand outside anyways.

there's a difference between strong/decent and average. I guess everyone has their own opinions about what is strong gear but wearing a combination of those gears i posted wouldn't even get you into the top 30 magicians. btw i was talking about AM prob having the lowest chance to get into a normal ht run. Did you read wrongly lol?

[Stereo]

there's a difference between strong/decent and average. I guess everyone has their own opinions about what is strong gear but wearing a combination of those gears i posted wouldn't even get you into the top 30 magicians. btw i was talking about AM prob having the lowest chance to get into a normal ht run. Did you read wrongly lol?

Then again, the damage difference between the top equipped mage and an average geared (i.e. clean level 100 gear, maybe 60% scrolled cheaper things like staff/earring) level 150 is only about 20%. The difference for a class like a Night Lord is probably around 50%, which you can guess will cost more like 100+ billion, though it is probably server dependent (That's the typical cost of white scrolling your weapon, which is an absolute necessity if you want perfect +7 10% stats).

I'm not certain but I'd guess there's about a minimum 20 billion worth of gear to get into the top 30 Night Lords, possibly more.

[GenesisPro]

Bishops cost way more to fund than a mage. If i was a mage (making one atm) I would just buy the elemental wand and my damage would be godly enough.


oh and a 20 stats glove in scania is 500-700m now. I bought a 25 stats for nearly 3 bill.
I dunno how it is in other server


Another thing you can't compared doomsday to elemental wands maybe to elemental staffs there might be a price comparison. Comparing a lukless item to a luk item doesnt work out.

[Derimed]

I used to be a bit of a damage whore. I bought the most expensive equips, fought for every point of attack, etc. Then I went to Yollande for the 2x month-long event, and leveled a Bishop to 131, (20th in the server at the end of the event,) using a 2 dex bathrobe, 2 str Stolen Fence, and a 3 point below average clean Black Umbrella. (I had 7 starting luk.) I spent next to nothing on gear, and everything on pots to fund the next day's training. People who spent time during the event merchanting trained much less than I did. That's when I learned that while equipment is nice, lvling to a high point is MUCH more important. Let's say your magician is equipped like a damage whore, but my lukless magician is 40 lvls higher. That's 200 intelligence right there, which is not that easy to get from gear. I have much better equips now that I am back on my home server, but I am just saying, you do not need gazillions of mesos to have fun in this game. If you have to choose between spending NX on Gachopon and spending it on 2x cards so you level faster, it would be wise to pick the 2x cards. If anything, a 4th job character can waste some time collecting Ilbis at Wolf Spiders, or doing APQ easily, and the mesos come easier then anyway.

[kIkO]

Its so expensive, but mesos come and go!

[Tikey]

Wait for the economy to go down first. The meso to int rate is just outrageous. I can tell you now, when I scrolled my equips, it cost about a fraction of what it takes now.

[butterfλi]

I bought a 25 stats for nearly 3 bill.

we magicians are stupid. take off that glove and cast genesis, then put on that glove and cast genesis. how much different do you notice your damage is? if it can help you go from 2hit ko to 1hit ko, then it's worth it. if it doesnt, then it just further proves magicians are stupid for setting up a price for their own class. im sure you wouldve rather paid 2bil instead of 3bil.

25matk is the equivalent of 5 level ups but if looked at it that way, i suppose every level up is pointless too lol.

[kIkO]

we magicians are stupid. take off that glove and cast genesis, then put on that glove and cast genesis. how much different do you notice your damage is? if it can help you go from 2hit ko to 1hit ko, then it's worth it. if it doesnt, then it just further proves magicians are stupid for setting up a price for their own class. im sure you wouldve rather paid 2bil instead of 3bil.

25matk is the equivalent of 25 level ups but if looked at it that way, i suppose every level up is pointless too lol.


25 matk = 5 lvls

[Slashermills2]

Dont forget Yellow Snow shoes for int thats like 100-200m For a Godly int Pair

[Molly]

Bishops cost way more to fund than a mage. If i was a mage (making one atm) I would just buy the elemental wand and my damage would be godly enough.



never seen anything further from the truth. lest ye forget 25% of low dmg is not = to godly dmg. it CAN mean the difference between 1hko or 2hko but that would be the sole purpose for it. the holy class is the cheapest by far to own/level/boss from 30 all the way through 200. nevermind the fact that at 14x you'll be at skeles doing better than an AM at newties with an elemental weapon. Make sure you understand your AM fully before expecting an easy ride to 200.

[kIkO]

never seen anything further from the truth. lest ye forget 25% of low dmg is not = to godly dmg. it CAN mean the difference between 1hko or 2hko but that would be the sole purpose for it. the holy class is the cheapest by far to own/level/boss from 30 all the way through 200. nevermind the fact that at 14x you'll be at skeles doing better than an AM at newties with an elemental weapon. Make sure you understand your AM fully before expecting an easy ride to 200.

Elemental weapon +25% bonus
from 1k matk +25% = 1.25k

that cant be compared with any update a bishop could make

[Chompy]

never seen anything further from the truth. lest ye forget 25% of low dmg is not = to godly dmg. it CAN mean the difference between 1hko or 2hko but that would be the sole purpose for it. the holy class is the cheapest by far to own/level/boss from 30 all the way through 200. nevermind the fact that at 14x you'll be at skeles doing better than an AM at newties with an elemental weapon. Make sure you understand your AM fully before expecting an easy ride to 200.

Lets say we have a bishop with 900 magic
and an Archmage with 800 magic
Add in the awesome little .25 from our new wand.
and
We get an Archmage with 1000 magic effectively.
So as we can see.
you have to be 25% better to be equal to this archmage.
Unless you are on holy weak.:glitter:

[Stereo]

Lets say we have a bishop with 900 magic
and an Archmage with 800 magic
Add in the awesome little .25 from our new wand.
and
We get an Archmage with 1000 magic effectively.
So as we can see.
you have to be 25% better to be equal to this archmage.
Unless you are on holy weak.:glitter:

Strongest ice weak... under 60k hp, 2500 exp
Strongest fire weak... under 60k hp, 3000 exp
Strongest holy weak... 85k hp, 4700 exp

Now let's say that Bishop with 900 magic 1hkos skelosaurs... with 40% more damage, the Arch Mage is doing 120000 damage to 1hko a monster with under 60k hp. Go somewhere without elemental advantage and oh look, they're doing less than the Bishop again.

[kIkO]

Strongest ice weak... under 60k hp, 2500 exp
Strongest fire weak... under 60k hp, 3000 exp
Strongest holy weak... 85k hp, 4700 exp

Now let's say that Bishop with 900 magic 1hkos skelosaurs... with 40% more damage, the Arch Mage is doing 120000 damage to 1hko a monster with under 60k hp. Go somewhere without elemental advantage and oh look, they're doing less than the Bishop again.

The AM wouldnt need to keep killing those monster then lol

[Chompy]

Strongest ice weak... under 60k hp, 2500 exp
Strongest fire weak... under 60k hp, 3000 exp
Strongest holy weak... 85k hp, 4700 exp

Now let's say that Bishop with 900 magic 1hkos skelosaurs... with 40% more damage, the Arch Mage is doing 120000 damage to 1hko a monster with under 60k hp. Go somewhere without elemental advantage and oh look, they're doing less than the Bishop again.

What?
Wait why is the Archmage doing 40% extra damage to a Holy Weak monster?
...
All I am saying is that with an ELemental weapon you get 25% bonus.
Which means a Priest needs another 1/4th magic to match them on equal footing at neutral monsters.:glitter:

[Stereo]

Amp gives them about a 12% damage advantage to combine with 25% bonus.

[LordVader]

>strong
>magician

wat.

really, im serious. only thing that makes us strong is our ultimates. So, go lukless, get to 120, stand in one spot gen/meteo/bliz'ing. oh my my, oh hell yes, time to fall asleep at the computer !

No, seriously <.< upgrades for mages dont do much. get an ok overall, zhelm, maybe pendant if you have friends, ok gloves, ok whatever else, and then an elemental weapon for AM's or whatever for a bish (lukless is nice <_<)

This coming from a 91 base luk f/p with just a poison staff thats crappy-scrolled. I 2hk newts and im perfectly happy with that i guess. Still faster exp than my NL gets 7 levels lower.

[kIkO]

>strong
>magician

wat.

really, im serious. only thing that makes us strong is our ultimates. So, go lukless, get to 120, stand in one spot gen/meteo/bliz'ing. oh my my, oh hell yes, time to fall asleep at the computer !

No, seriously <.< upgrades for mages dont do much. get an ok overall, zhelm, maybe pendant if you have friends, ok gloves, ok whatever else, and then an elemental weapon for AM's or whatever for a bish (lukless is nice <_<)

This coming from a 91 base luk f/p with just a poison staff thats crappy-scrolled. I 2hk newts and im perfectly happy with that i guess. Still faster exp than my NL gets 7 levels lower.

1hit ko maybe? duh...

[Russt]

we magicians are stupid. take off that glove and cast genesis, then put on that glove and cast genesis. how much different do you notice your damage is? if it can help you go from 2hit ko to 1hit ko, then it's worth it. if it doesnt, then it just further proves magicians are stupid for setting up a price for their own class. im sure you wouldve rather paid 2bil instead of 3bil.

25matk is the equivalent of 5 level ups but if looked at it that way, i suppose every level up is pointless too lol.
Skill points. The INT is pretty inconsequential; the main difference between, say, a 70 I/L and a 90 I/L is that the 90 has 3rd job skills. If you somehow gave the 70 maxed IS and Amp, and compared it to a 90 that trained with un-Amped Thunderbolt, the 70 would probably be better in terms of training rate and all.

But once you get to like 14x-15x you don't have much in the realm of skills to look forward to, so after that yeah levelups are pretty pointless :f3:

[Derimed]

Skill points. The INT is pretty inconsequential; the main difference between, say, a 70 I/L and a 90 I/L is that the 90 has 3rd job skills. If you somehow gave the 70 maxed IS and Amp, and compared it to a 90 that trained with un-Amped Thunderbolt, the 70 would probably be better in terms of training rate and all.

But once you get to like 14x-15x you don't have much in the realm of skills to look forward to, so after that yeah levelups are pretty pointless :f3:

Int is not inconsequential. Take an Onyx Apple and use it on your mage. Watch the damage. That's 20 levels worth of int. If you're doing 1 lvl in 2 days, that's a reasonable goal. Yeah, a lvl 150 has most of the useful skills maxed, but he probably won't ks a lvl 190 of the identical class. And I've yet to meet anyone who thinks using an Apple on your character is pointless.

[MissAsh]

I dunno who it was that said Bishops are more expensive than AMs, cause that's just not true at all -.- (somewhere on previous page). You just have to look at amp to see that.

Also I don't think it's really fair for everyone to play the elemental wand card just yet, since they are still ridiculously expensive and out of 90% of the mage population's price range. Besides that though, isn't the whole reason for the elemental wands because Bishops aren't supposed to be out damaging AMs by so much in 4th?

Okay, an AM and Bishop with equal gear, level and maxed ultimates on neutral monster. The AM will only do more damage by a little, and that's only because of amp. It's still costing them twice as much MP, and from an ecconomical point of view it's wasteful. I still think bishops have the advantage, cause elemental wand or no, the bishop can do more damage when you view it in terms of MP usage.


As for funding godly chars. No, it really isn't cheap, I know from experience.. But it's cheaper if you buy them rather than scroll yourself -_-. I used to be a stat whore, but I just can't care less anymore. You shouldn't define yourself by other people's definitions of "godly" cause it will just drive you insane and bankrupt. If you want to make good equips or do bigdamij, do it for yourself, not to compete, becasue you will never win against merchanters.

[Derimed]

I dunno who it was that said Bishops are more expensive than AMs, cause that's just not true at all -.- (somewhere on previous page). You just have to look at amp to see that.

Also I don't think it's really fair for everyone to play the elemental wand card just yet, since they are still ridiculously expensive and out of 90% of the mage population's price range. Besides that though, isn't the whole reason for the elemental wands because Bishops aren't supposed to be out damaging AMs by so much in 4th?

Okay, an AM and Bishop with equal gear, level and maxed ultimates on neutral monster. The AM will only do more damage by a little, and that's only because of amp. It's still costing them twice as much MP, and from an ecconomical point of view it's wasteful. I still think bishops have the advantage, cause elemental wand or no, the bishop can do more damage when you view it in terms of MP usage.


As for funding godly chars. No, it really isn't cheap, I know from experience.. But it's cheaper if you buy them rather than scroll yourself -_-. I used to be a stat whore, but I just can't care less anymore. You shouldn't define yourself by other people's definitions of "godly" cause it will just drive you insane and bankrupt. If you want to make good equips or do bigdamij, do it for yourself, not to compete, becasue you will never win against merchanters.

Bishops are indeed more expensive. In Khaini Meteor Shower 30 goes for 7-10 million. Genesis 30 goes for about 600mil. Yesterday my guild had a good laugh because one of my friends sold Gen 30 for 500 mil because "he did not care about mesos," (it sold within a couple hours of being up in his ch 1 fm 1 store.) 600 mil is a bit steep for something that fails 50% of the time. So, let's say you fail 3 and succeed on your 4th try; at that point being a F/P Archmage might not have been such a bad idea. I play Bishop because the party skills make it more fun because I can help people. But I know full well that the Archmages will have lvl 30 Ultimates way before I will. And an Archmage with equal funding to a Bishop will use his billions to buy an Elemental Wand lvl 130, whereas the Bishop will probably have to pay for his Gen 30, or spend like 3 months for a chance to use one by going to HT.

Edit: Ash, it's you. You can't possibly be as poor as me, lol.

[heronz]

... proves magicians are stupid for setting up a price for their own class.

mages didnt set up the pricing. its all the hp washers creating the demand to increase the price for supply.

im an hpwashing who bought all my int gear before the inflation. i bought everything at 1/3 to 1/4 of the price now.

[butterfλi]

mages didnt set up the pricing. its all the hp washers creating the demand to increase the price for supply.

im an hpwashing who bought all my int gear before the inflation. i bought everything at 1/3 to 1/4 of the price now.

magicians with extra money and who "pay extremely well" for their equipment have been around long before people even knew what washing is. ie people have been buying int earrings, int cape way for a high price much before people started using int things for washing. washers only contribute to the demands.

if the magic formula is as crappy as people say it is, would people be paying 50mill to upgrade an 11int cape to a 12int cape (before dark scrolls, and before hp washing)? pay 50mil for 1 int when you wont even experience a noticeable change in damage?

that mentality still exists today. magicians will pay hundreds of millions to a 9/15 earrings to a 10/17 earrings. thats only 3 matk.

[VladTheLvr]

Also, besides the element wand (which is a muliplier)
The higher level you are the additional few more int OR MA becomes more insignificant to your overall damage. This is un-like the NLs who have a totally different formula, and there will be SIGNIFICANT CHANGE OF DAMAGE if one NL has 1 att more than the other (LEVEL 200)

[Derimed]

magicians with extra money and who "pay extremely well" for their equipment have been around long before people even knew what washing is. ie people have been buying int earrings, int cape way for a high price much before people started using int things for washing. washers only contribute to the demands.

if the magic formula is as crappy as people say it is, would people be paying 50mill to upgrade an 11int cape to a 12int cape (before dark scrolls, and before hp washing)? pay 50mil for 1 int when you wont even experience a noticeable change in damage?

that mentality still exists today. magicians will pay hundreds of millions to a 9/15 earrings to a 10/17 earrings. thats only 3 matk.

In all fairness, that's not just the magicians. One point of attack for non-magicians is more than one point of int for magicians, but give me a break. 15 att wgs are at like 800-900 mil, and that's high enough, but if you get a 16 att wg in the market the high-lvls will descend on it like vultures, paying God knows how much. I think settling for a 14 att wg is perfectly fine, considering that if you average out your "settling" with various parts of your equipment you'll probably end up with better gear overall. That is, the 2 points between 14 att wg and 16 att wg are such a difference that you can get a godly overall, or a godlier weapon, by settling for a 14 att wg. I think most of the people with such mesos simply don't have to settle for anything, whatever class they are. My friend could do max damage on holy weak monsters already, but he bought a lvl 130 elemental wand over his 105 ma att shine wand so he could do more damage to the non-holy weak monsters. I don't understand that because if you 1hko skeles, I think that's pretty much all you have to shoot for; that's where the big xp is at. But not all people think like that.

If none of that convinces you, keep in mind your own words in an earlier thread -- you said that at lvl 138 you get as much xp per hour as some lvl 19x Night Lord. Two guesses which of you spent more on your equipment. I completely fail to see why the NL is considered the min/max class when the mages (including the "sucky" f/p) completely total him in xp accumulation.

[butterfλi]

If none of that convinces you, keep in mind your own words in an earlier thread -- you said that at lvl 138 you get as much xp per hour as some lvl 19x Night Lord. Two guesses which of you spent more on your equipment. I completely fail to see why the NL is considered the min/max class when the mages (including the "sucky" f/p) completely total him in xp accumulation.

wow good memory lol. yes, i did say that. if you read this video's comments, you'll see he gets 7mil an hour soloing on 1x exp--the same as any 13x archmage.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DLzFrZ7kDLs

but whats different here is the comparison of two classes; they have different skills, different abilities and different lives. what i was comparing in the quote you quoted was the comparison of the same class--magician. watk classes rely heavily on watk.

-repeats content mentioned here (http://www.southperry.net/forums/showpost.php?p=55433&postcount=5)-

if you had a constant running zak/HT (you probably do :P), and have a constant income, have more than enough to pay for training, and if you can "buy" higher damage, would you? its why i didnt say anything about elemental weapons--because 2billion is a 'fair' price to pay to be 125% stronger. if a NL who hits 40k stars can pay 2billion to hit 50k stars, they'll pay it.

the thing is, by buyer higher damage, magicians who do end up disrupting the ratio of x mesos:y matk:z likeliness to scroll 'godly' item.