View Full Version : Final Death of Necroposting
Similar to what was discussed here (http://www.southperry.net/showthread.php?t=27378), I've implemented preventative measures on replying to posts that have been dead longer than 21 days.
Stickied threads, Mods, Admins and Extractors are exempt from this restriction. Certain entire forums may also become exempt from this restriction if sufficient reason is found to do so.
The range itself may be expanded, right now it's a compromise between 45 days and the 14 that a necropost normally would occur under.
The intent here is to completely do away with the necropost warning/infraction at some point. I believe strongly that the best way to enforce a rule is simply to not make it breakable in the first place thus saving both sides time and energy that can be better spent.
Kalovale
2010-07-11, 11:26 AM
Was necroposting ever a problem? :f6:
Was necroposting ever a problem? :f6:
It's often a problem with new members, or when people just don't pay attention to dates.
Erich
2010-07-11, 11:28 AM
Was necroposting ever a problem? :f6:
But can it be a problem? Yes. Preventative measures.
Hazzy
2010-07-11, 11:50 AM
I believe strongly that the best way to enforce a rule is simply to not make it breakable in the first place thus saving both sides time and energy that can be better spent.
I can't say I back this policy in general, but on the topic of necroposting it makes sense. Some sub forums might need an exemption from this, since they hardly ever get post. However, I don't post or read those forums, so I wouldn't know.
21 days seems reasonable enough, although threads like "Math Help Thread" and "~ Rollcall Thread!" might run into problems if they aren't stickied.
IllegallySane
2010-07-11, 12:36 PM
I think necroposting should be limited to threads of a certain size or sub-sections, because it would suck to say have a thread like General Dungeon Fighter gets locked despite the fact it's a 187 page thread and going. Then we have threads in the Training Center which don't always get answers but tend to have valuable information and it would suck to have people asking the same questions over and over because the thread which they could have gotten an answer got locked. Maybe do it in sections like Amherst Island, Call to Action, MapleBugs, and Angry Dome, to name a few. Basically, places where long threads/discussions/adequate activity tend to rarely happen.
Marston
2010-07-11, 12:37 PM
>Someone bumps a thread after 20 days
>They're going to get infracted for necroposting anyway
KaidaTan
2010-07-11, 11:49 PM
Okay... so it's impossible to post in (non-sticky) threads that are older than 20 days? Or do you just get little warning saying you shouldn't?
If it just doesn't let you post at all then I wouldn't, for example, be able to post an update to my Corsair Calculator. It just seems kind of silly to auto-lock things that might still be relevant even after 20 days of inactivity.
Throes
2010-07-12, 12:26 AM
Would it be possible to exempt the Expressive Arts boards from this? I can no longer update my Open Canvas thread.
http://i29.tinypic.com/epk7l.png
Would it be possible to exempt the Expressive Arts boards from this? I can no longer update my Open Canvas thread.
http://i29.tinypic.com/epk7l.png
What thread are you referring to?
Throes
2010-07-12, 12:30 AM
My art dump thread:
http://www.southperry.net/showthread.php?t=4293
I update it sporadically, but I've been posting in it for over a year. I like keeping all my art in one thread so I can see if there's any progression in my work (there isn't.)
Wouldn't that really be more practical in your blog?
Wouldn't that really be more practical in your blog?
What about class guides? If something like the Big Bang happens and the owner of the guide wants to update their thread to fit the changes, they wouldn't be able to if it hasn't been posted in within the past 21 days.
Most of those will have to be completely rewritten anyhow because they're so out of date as to be completely irrelevant.
That aside,
1) replies are blocked, not edits
2) the sticky ones are exempt from the timer as I already said.
Throes
2010-07-12, 12:46 AM
We tend to be more lenient on boards which are less busy (Shady Tree, Gaming, Open Canvas, etc.), so this is really not too much of an issue. It's really only when people necropost in busier sections like Training Center and General Maplestory that it's frowned upon.
My thread is an art thread posted in an art forum, I don't see how it would make more sense to keep it in a blog.
I post my drawings to share them with SP, not to keep them hidden away in a blog.
IllegallySane
2010-07-12, 12:47 AM
Maybe do it in sections like Amherst Island, Call to Action, MapleBugs, and Angry Dome, to name a few. Basically, places where long threads/discussions/adequate activity tend to rarely happen.
My suggestion still stands. Place the restriction on places where it's very unlikely that someone would return and make a significant post/contribution or places where discussion for the sake of discussing doesn't happen.
You have a blog on SP, therefore if it's posted in there it's shared with SP. Your blog is the ideal place to store things about yourself and by yourself, including art, because it keeps everything of yours in a single easily accessed place that can be organized and categorized.
Forums are made for conversation and discussion, not personal single thread galleries.
My suggestion still stands. Place the restriction on places where it's very unlikely that someone would return and make a significant post/contribution or places where discussion for the sake of discussing doesn't happen.
You've described the entire forum.
I've seen an entire one post to a thread older than two weeks, ever, that qualified as a substantial contribution, and it honestly could've been it's own followup thread.
chrome
2010-07-12, 12:53 AM
I don't get it. Why can't you and the moderating team just infract people who necropost?
Some posts on older threads can't even be classified as necroposting, because in some cases the posts in question may still contribute to the topic, as in expressive art archives. You might as well do away with the whole Expressive Arts forum if you expect us to just blog them.
I don't get it. Why can't you and the moderating team just infract people who necropost?
Shouldn't be our responsibility to punish you for doing things we shouldn't let you do in the first place if that's the rule.
You might as well do away with the whole Expressive Arts forum if you expect us to just blog them.
And I very well may. It predates the existence of the blogs and frankly I don't see a need for it when they're available.
chrome
2010-07-12, 01:02 AM
Shouldn't be our responsibility to punish you for doing things we shouldn't let you do in the first place if that's the rule.
What? Isn't a moderator's job to moderate? If that's how it's going to be, I don't even see the need for a moderating team. Just completely bar anything that's against the rules, get rid of moderators, etc.
The moderating team's role is growing smaller and smaller, and if what you're doing becomes a trend, frankly I don't see a reason why they should exist. There will be nothing to moderate.
Throes
2010-07-12, 01:03 AM
You have a blog on SP, therefore if it's posted in there it's shared with SP. Your blog is the ideal place to store things about yourself and by yourself, including art, because it keeps everything of yours in a single easily accessed place that can be organized and categorized.
Forums are made for conversation and discussion, not personal single thread galleries.
What is the point of even having an art board then, if it's more "ideal" to post my art in a blog?
I appreciate the bump for my thread, but that's not what I was trying to accomplish. I am incredibly hurt that if I don't update my thread in the next three weeks I'll have to ask permission from a mod to get it updated or not be able to update at all due to this "feature." My work is posted exclusively on Southperry, and while that may not mean much to you, it means quite a lot to me. What about threads in the Shady Tree? Felix seems to have stopped updating his story for now, but if it takes him more than three weeks to come up with the next chapter he won't be allowed to post it in the same thread?
It just doesn't make sense to me to hold the Expressive Arts forums to the same standards as the rest of the boards. The creative process is one that can take a considerable amount of time, and that should be recognized.
What? Isn't a moderator's job to moderate? If that's how it's going to be, I don't even see the need for a moderating team. Just completely bar anything that's against the rules, get rid of moderators, etc.
.
Moderators exist to make judgments.
Whether or not a post is outside the allowed timeline is not a judgment, it's math and the forum can do that itself. Adding things to the mods list that the server can do for itself is a waste of everyones time.
IllegallySane
2010-07-12, 01:09 AM
Forums are made for conversation and discussion, not personal single thread galleries.
You've described the entire forum.
I've seen an entire one post to a thread older than two weeks, ever, that qualified as a substantial contribution, and it honestly could've been it's own followup thread.
Are you implying that the Shady Tree shouldn't belong on SP because people like Felix should write his stories in a blog? I personally see nothing with anything from the Expressive arts. I see blogs more for little things that people may not care enough about to post on the forums, such as their feelings for a specific day/event or wanting to advertise something.
As for the 2nd part, how have I described all of SP? Take for example the Pokemon subsection. The "Where are you now on your Heart Gold/ Soul Silver playthrough" may be slower now than it was before but there can always be new people wanting to talk about their experiences in the game. As for threads with barely one post, those are usually in something like Maple Q&A, Speakeasy, or even the Funhouse.
Such sections of this forum are meant for short/brief discussion that should not be expanding into an epic debate, in which they can be subjected to the No Necro restriction.
I can understand wanting to save time and trouble from warning/infracting necroposters, but on the other hand, how often a day or even a week in SP has someone or some people decided to necro a long gone thread with a useless post?
Also, how would this stop people from trying to bump up a thread before the 21 day mark because they still think the thread has value, or in the Expressive Arts case the writer/artist is thinking of uploading a new story/artwork but isn't ready yet? Then the Necro restriction will either be reversed or newer stricter rules will be implemented because of people abusing the 21 day limit; this feature is essentially a 21 day thread lock.
Hazzy
2010-07-12, 01:10 AM
Moderators exist to make judgments.
Whether or not a post is outside the allowed timeline is not a judgment, it's math and the forum can do that itself. Adding things to the mods list that the server can do for itself is a waste of everyones time.
Defining the allowed time line is a judgment. A week is old for General MapleStory Discussion, but 4 is not in the Art Section.
chrome
2010-07-12, 01:10 AM
Moderators exist to make judgments.
Whether or not a post is outside the allowed timeline is not a judgment, it's math and the forum can do that itself. Adding things to the mods list that the server can do for itself is a waste of everyones time.
The time factor is the only thing the forum can see. There is still judgment to be done in a post, even if it is three weeks old.
"Some posts on older threads can't even be classified as necroposting, because in some cases the posts in question may still contribute to the topic, as in [but not limited to] expressive art archives."
EDIT: Hazzy is also right.
It just doesn't make sense to me to hold the Expressive Arts forums to the same standards as the rest of the boards. The creative process is one that can take a considerable amount of time, and that should be recognized.
I was quite clear that "Certain entire forums may also become exempt from this restriction if sufficient reason is found to do so."
This is the first attempt anyone's made at providing such a reason. Your previous request was "exempt the entire forum just for my one thread", which forgive me, was not particularly moving. It's good to see other people waking up and actually participating now but it'd nice to see people focusing on how to make things work best, rather than just complaining about what they don't want.
Also, how would this stop people from trying to bump up a thread before the 21 day mark because they still think the thread has value, or in the Expressive Arts case the writer/artist is thinking of uploading a new story/artwork but isn't ready yet? Then the Necro rule will either be reversed or newer stricter rules will be implemented because of people abusing the 21 day limit.
Bumping with out adding anything would be spam and there is already a mechanism to address spam.
MetaSeraphim
2010-07-12, 01:19 AM
Forums are made for conversation and discussion, not personal single thread galleries.
The first part of this does not go with the second part since the second part is an opinion of yours. And if you're going to be an owner of a forum you can't have opinions like that.
Before blogs existed forums were created with the idea of people to gather for conversation and discussion, just as you said, but also part of that is for your so called "personal threads" in which people share something they created and for people of the forum to give opinions on. Just because blogs are the new in thing does not mean the purpose of forums change.
Forums can take many shapes and forms and be about all sorts of subjects, but no one owner of any forum can change the main purpose of a forum. To serve the people for their thoughts and ideas even if they're "worthless personal threads/posts".
xBTAx
2010-07-12, 01:23 AM
I don't understand why you can't just have it (assuming this is possible) warn people when they post within a thread that's over 21 days old, instead of closing it automatically. That way all the exceptions don't need to be dealt with personally, since the person posting is posting for a reason, and then any newcomer who posts in an old thread by accident also knows better.
IllegallySane
2010-07-12, 01:23 AM
Bumping with out adding anything would be spam and there is already a mechanism to address spam.
Who said the posts would be spam? They can just make contributing posts just for the sake of keeping the thread from getting locked rather than sheerly for discussion, and it can't be considered spam at all because the posts have some level of meaning pertaining to the thread.
y0y0y0y0shi0
2010-07-12, 01:26 AM
I was quite clear that "Certain entire forums may also become exempt from this restriction if sufficient reason is found to do so."
Is it really that much of a hassle for you to sit down and think about which forums are needed to be exempt from this restriction? Clearly this idea isn't very well thought out if such is true. If this is to be a fully implemented idea, you should have thought about which boards may the rule not be applied to, waited for a while to see which boards are most often targeted with necro posts, and then suggested the idea to the forum. You shouldn't need to wait for sufficient reasoning to be found.
The first part of this does not go with the second part since the second part is an opinion of yours. And if you're going to be an owner of a forum you can't have opinions like that.
That would be where you're mistaken. As owner I can frankly have any opinion I want - The site exists to reflect my ideals, just as it did Paul's when it was his. I do in fact dictate the purpose of this forum and all subforums within it.
If I choose to draw the line of what content belongs where that is entirely my prerogative. Blogs are an egocentric successor of forums. They're topical to the interests of the owner, a microcosm of the normal forumscape.
Just because part of the forum existed that sort of served that purpose previously does not mean it will do so in the future, or that it was the ideal way in the first place. Evolution is an ongoing process.
You're welcome to defend why things should remain the way they are - But simply telling me I don't have the option doesn't cut it, because I do. You need to focus on why doing it is a bad idea (and preferrably with better arguments than 'because everyone will leave/quit/hate you').
I don't understand why you can't just have it (assuming this is possible) warn people when they post within a thread that's over 21 days old, instead of closing it automatically. That way all the exceptions don't need to be dealt with personally, since the person posting is posting for a reason, and then any newcomer who posts in an old thread by accident also knows better.
This was the approach I tried first, it didn't play well. A passive warning is useless, it'll be skimmed right over and ignored, then be replied to with "but i didn't see it" when infracted. The checkbox to submit a reply on older stuff was much preferred but didn't work right.
Who said the posts would be spam? They can just make contributing posts just for the sake of keeping the thread from getting locked rather than sheerly for discussion, and it can't be considered spam at all because the posts have some level of meaning pertaining to the thread.
In the scenario you've described there's no problem, so what was the point of bringing it up? If they're contributing and it keeps the post alive it sounds win-win to me.
Is it really that much of a hassle for you to sit down and think about which forums are needed to be exempt from this restriction?
I could've, but you'd just complain I was being dictatorial anyhow by not including the community in the decision making process. You're included now, enjoy.
xBTAx
2010-07-12, 01:43 AM
That would be where you're mistaken. As owner I can frankly have any opinion I want - The site exists to reflect my ideals, just as it did Paul's when it was his. I do in fact dictate the purpose of this forum and all subforums within it.
If I choose to draw the line of what content belongs where that is entirely my prerogative. Blogs are an egocentric successor of forums. They're topical to the interests of the owner, a microcosm of the normal forumscape.
Just because part of the forum existed that sort of served that purpose previously does not mean it will do so in the future, or that it was the ideal way in the first place. Evolution is an ongoing process.
You're welcome to defend why things should remain the way they are - But simply telling me I don't have the option doesn't cut it, because I do. You need to focus on why doing it is a bad idea (and preferrably with better arguments than 'because everyone will leave/quit/hate you').
You having an opinion doesn't mean everyone agrees with it, as you've seen. And them not having a good justification is not a reason to ignore them. Even if you're leading a group of idiots, you still need to lead them in a way that pleases them.
This was the approach I tried first, it didn't play well. A passive warning is useless, it'll be skimmed right over and ignored, then be replied to with "but i didn't see it" when infracted. The checkbox to submit a reply on older stuff was much preferred but didn't work right.
Why do you assume that people will do that? And I was thinking of a pop up that you have to accept to move on to the thread, but again, I don't know if that's possible.
I could've, but you'd just complain I was being dictatorial anyhow by not including the community in the decision making process. You're included now, enjoy.
That is the major complaint about your decisions right now, to be frank.
KaidaTan
2010-07-12, 01:44 AM
What of things like my Calculator? I make periodic updates to it, and people chime in with questions/comments/suggestions every now and then.
Why do you assume that people will do that? And I was thinking of a pop up that you have to accept to move on to the thread, but again, I don't know if that's possible.
Because it's really no different from having the limit posted in the R&R and expecting people to abide by it.
A pop-up would be client side and easily circumnavigated by most modern browsers, which then goes back to the "I never saw it" excuse. The solution needs to be server-side to actually work consistently.
That is the major complaint about your decisions right now, to be frank.
I'm aware, but I'm not also not going to sit on my ass and wait for everyone's approval before I do things and I doubt any new administration would've had any less complaints because people hate change, period. I've already demonstrated that I compromise quite easily on negotiables when provided alternatives, so it's really in people's best interest to focus on those alternatives instead of complaining. Not liking it is fine, but I can't use that. Give me other options that still accomplish approximately what I'm trying to do and don't expect them to instantly materialize when they take time and effort to research & deploy.
What of things like my Calculator? I make periodic updates to it, and people chime in with questions/comments/suggestions every now and then.
Stickied.
ImagineAll
2010-07-12, 01:55 AM
I'd be curious to see how many actual infractions were handed out due to "Necro posting" to warrant this change. I get that you're on your whole "it's my site I'll do what I want with it" train, but don't undermine threads that have meant a great deal to people long before you ever owned the site. You have a fairly large moderation team, if they can't deal with a few necroposts I'd suggest looking for a new set of people.
y0y0y0y0shi0
2010-07-12, 01:56 AM
...So is this whole thing just going to come down to "If someone makes periodic updates to the thread; STICKIED!" now?
I'd be curious to see how many actual infractions were handed out due to "Necro posting" to warrant this change
You have a fairly large moderation team, if they can't deal with a few necroposts I'd suggest looking for a new set of people.
Necroposting is the #4 most commonly given infraction, below Spam, Flaming and Trolling, making it the single most common, preventable infraction.
The volume of moderators is not relevant to this, it's something they shouldn't have to concern themselves with in the first place.
...So is this whole thing just going to come down to "If someone makes periodic updates to the thread; STICKIED!" now?
No, that was a calculator thread. It should've been stickied anyhow to ever be consistently findable based on precedent.
Kalovale
2010-07-12, 02:08 AM
The reasonings are all sensible in my book, except one thing. Necroposting never was, never is and probably never will be a problem here on SP; why should everyone's time be wasted on arguing over this is it wasn't even a problem in the beginning?
chrome
2010-07-12, 02:08 AM
You make a decision, we don't like it, and you have the nerve to attack us and assume that we'll complain?
I'm not even going to argue with you anymore. Have fun with your forum.
KaidaTan
2010-07-12, 02:08 AM
About the only "alternative" suggestion I can think of is just... make it 30 days. Er.. I guess I should first ask how many days after the last post are necroposts usually?
The reasonings are all sensible in my book, except one thing. Necroposting never was, never is and probably never will be a problem here on SP; why should everyone's time be wasted on arguing over this is it wasn't even a problem in the beginning?
Er... didn't he just say it's one of the most-given infractions? I'd say that classifies it as a "problem."
ImagineAll
2010-07-12, 02:09 AM
Necroposting is the #4 most commonly given infraction, below Spam, Flaming and Trolling, making it the single most common, preventable infraction.
The volume of moderators is not relevant to this, it's something they shouldn't have to concern themselves with in the first place.If reinforcing the rules isn't something they should have to concern themselves, what's the point of their position to begin with? But hey, let's just ban all users while we're at it as a preventive measure to get rid of flaming & trolling as well. While we're at it the site may as well not exist since there might be some problems that arise. Guess that's the end of SouthPerry guys.
Feeling a lot like the Minority Report in here.
Edit: It's a whopping number four, Alex. When you consider how many other infractions are frequently handed out I'd hardly consider it a pertinent issue. Eos proposed a fix, and some of us disagree with it. Tweaking rules is one thing, insulting the members and undermining their hard work is a completely different matter.
Kalovale
2010-07-12, 02:13 AM
About the only "alternative" suggestion I can think of is just... make it 30 days. Er.. I guess I should first ask how many days after the last post are necroposts usually?
Er... didn't he just say it's one of the most-given infractions? I'd say that classifies it as a "problem."
Oh, I got ninja'd. I'm cool with this then, it's no biggie whether it happens or not, to me.
EDIT: I personally think some of you are confusing between fretting over a small detail and getting off your system over Eos. Sure, you're free to voice your concern, but save it for something that's worth it.
If reinforcing the rules isn't something they should have to concern themselves, what's the point of their position to begin with? But hey, let's just ban all users while we're at it as a preventive measure to get rid of flaming & trolling as well. While we're at it the site may as well not exist since there might be some problems that arise. Guess that's the end of SouthPerry guys.
I'm still not getting exactly what you're complaining about? Why don't you try actually stating your issue instead of just lashing out at change in general?
Mods should not have to waste time on things that can be automated. This is true of every ounce of life. You don't waste time writing a paper when you can print it. You don't waste time walking all over town when you can use faster transportation. The less easily automated crap a mod has to deal with the more they can devote to other things and the fewer mods we need overall.
About the only "alternative" suggestion I can think of is just... make it 30 days. Er.. I guess I should first ask how many days after the last post are necroposts usually?
That point varies wildly. Sometimes a day or two, sometimes by over a year. I did initially state however the 21 was an arbitrary compromise between the 14 and 45 to determine if it was too soon/too long.
So far the best alternative I've heard is giving some forums a longer window than others, but that's approximately the same as just excluding those altogether so is already an available option.
TaliaNCo
2010-07-12, 03:36 AM
I think everyone needs to understand that the MODS of this, (and every other forum), have lives outside of SP. Trying to ease things up just a little bit will help them manage their time better. However, trying to find a happy medium isn't always easy. Finding valid arguments as to "why" this wouldn't work or shouldn't be in place, is what the focus should be. Lashing out because something might change isn't the way to get your point across.
Finding valid arguments as to "why" this wouldn't work or shouldn't be in place, is what the focus should be.
Or how to make it work best, really.
Identifying what's wrong is only the beginning.
KaidaTan
2010-07-12, 04:11 AM
What about making it so that the rule only applies to anyone who's had a necroposting infraction in the past 6 months? Or are there rarely repeat offenders?
Misses the point of preventing the initial offense.
The goal is to never have to do another necropost infraction, period.
Devil
2010-07-12, 04:55 AM
Geeez, comon people, If -ONE- thread is -SO- important that it deservers to be necroposted, and if it isn't stickied, just create a new one with all the major quotes from the whole old thread... That also saves people from having to read that whole old thread in the first place...
I don't really see any problem here...
Breakout of where the Necroposting infractions occur.
Section|Total
A&E|8.28%
Extractions|1.38%
Main|4.14%
Maple|60.69%
MHM|3.45%
Deleted|4.14%
Social|17.93%
At this time the following forums are exempt based on previous history & user communication:
Donor Forum, Open Canvas, Shady Tree, Game Mechanics, Quests
The definition of Necroposting currently in the R&R says "The posting in a thread in which the discussion material is more than 2 weeks old and an insignificant contribution is made to the thread."
While the forum can easily determine whether 2 weeks (or 3, or whatever time limit is decided upon) have passed, it can't tell whether the contribution is significant. So, saying this rule can easily be automated, to save work for the moderators and infractions for users, is inaccurate.
The scenario that most worries me is one where someone posts a problem or question, and no-one has a good solution or answer, so the thread dies. A month later someone finds the solution but can't post it... They can make a "follow-up thread", but the forum's Search function is so flawed, a person looking for a solution for the same problem might easily find only the problem-statement but not the follow-up thread containing the solution.
As for constructive suggestions: Is it possible to make it so threads older than X don't get bumped when updated? It works that way on another forum I know, but that one uses a proprietary engine that is nothing like vBulletin. If we could have that here, "necroposting" ceases to be a problem. People can post in old threads if they want, it does not interfere with anyone else's browsing.
TøbiasBlack
2010-07-12, 07:02 AM
Geeez, comon people, If -ONE- thread is -SO- important that it deservers to be necroposted, and if it isn't stickied, just create a new one with all the major quotes from the whole old thread... That also saves people from having to read that whole old thread in the first place...
I don't really see any problem here...
thats a lot of work just to make a thread.
why would anyone want to recreate something to use to their own ends when they can save the time and effort to just add into the already existing thing? its like building a boat to ride in because you didn't like the beds of the first one. just make the bed work, dont go through the hassle of making a new boat.
and yeah, seems like it was already resolved, i just wanted to voice my opinion on the necro--A&E thing if i may:
And I very well may. It predates the existence of the blogs and frankly I don't see a need for it when they're available.
sorry, gotta say this is pretty narrow-minded. the blogs could, in theory, also do away with some aspects from the other forums as well, say for instance the speakeasy and the angry dome. to generalize the whole of the expressive arts forums to a blog is undermining the importance of the forum and overgeneralizing the blog system.
lol, some day you guys will learn how to work with Eos. Fighting against him when he's clearly wanting your opinion probably isn't the way to go.
I recommend these boards be exempt:
- Maple Cinema - The board does not receive much traffic. Older videos can still have current relevance.
- Training Center - The board does not receive much traffic. Also, older posts that have no answer need to have answers. This helps to provide a resource for the boards.
Also, I do agree that Shady Tree belongs better in a blog. It allows each chapter to be commented on in isolation of other chapters and allows readers to move smoothly from one blog to the next by using the categories feature. Using the forums for this is less than ideal as the reader then has to read a chapter then parse through all the comments he may or may not want to read. About the only advantage I can think of for Shady Tree is that everything is in one localized place. So if a person wants to read a story, all of the stories are in one location and not scattered around blogs. It might be a good idea to have an admin-created "story" category, then users use their own categories to separate each chapter from there. The same could be said of Open Canvas. Admin Category of "Pictures".
lol, some day you guys will learn how to work with Eos.
I certainly hope so. He has reasons for pretty much everything he does / says.
JoeTang
2010-07-12, 08:42 AM
He has reasons for pretty much everything he does / says.
Everyone does.
I personally don't understand what everyone is so uptight about. I'm sick of looking through newly bumped threads and going to the last page to find it to be some sad excuse for English asking some variation of if "A" is released yet, how do you do "B", or is "C" better than "D" instead of useful conversation. If you actually have something meaningful to add, you can make another thread. If you can't be bothered to make another thread or ask to be exempt, then what you want to say obviously isn't important enough to waste anyone's time with.
GummyBear
2010-07-12, 09:40 AM
I used to play a game called Legend of the Green Dragon, and I had a pretty good account too. Too bad I went on holiday for a little while (3 weeks) and my account got deleted for "being inactive".
Do tread with care.
thats a lot of work just to make a thread.
It is, but everyone is also missing how very simple it is to just report the thread to a mod asking for a bump and detailing why.
Then it remains a judgment call on the mods behalf of whether or not your contribution is really worth breathing life back into the thread.
Entire forums don't necessarily need special exemptions for a single thread here and there, although some have been granted for good behavior.
Special cases are special cases and the "You can't reply" notice will be updated to include instructions on what to do if you have one.
Lyriall
2010-07-12, 10:09 AM
Is there no way to make an "Are you sure" page instead of a "You can't reply" page?
JoeTang
2010-07-12, 10:11 AM
Is there no way to make an "Are you sure" page instead of a "You can't reply" page?
It's already been stated that people would just skip that and post anyways. The point of this is to eliminate necroposting completely, not reduce it.
It's already been stated that people would just skip that and post anyways. The point of this is to eliminate necroposting completely, not reduce it.
No they skip popups. Making an actual extra step I believe they'd follow, but doing that hasn't played properly with the templating system and is more of a long term fix, while this is a here and now get it started and evolve it later fix.
TaliaNCo
2010-07-12, 12:23 PM
I certainly hope so. He has reasons for pretty much everything he does / says.
Eos works on logic, not emotion. If people would just give him the chance to show them what he can do for this site, I think they will be very pleased with the outcome. :)
Swerve
2010-07-12, 12:40 PM
After resolving a conflict, I like to give it some closure. In the Pits of Hell there have been times when I thought that things were going downhill and got depressed. In the end, I managed to resolve a lot of the issues I posted and I felt that other people would want to know in case they found themselves in a similar situation. I understand that writing the original rant in a blog would allow me to continually update the situation at hand. However, you can't always predict whether or not a problem is going to exclusively be a short-term or a long-term issue.
street
2010-07-12, 12:47 PM
Everyone does.
I personally don't understand what everyone is so uptight about. I'm sick of looking through newly bumped threads and going to the last page to find it to be some sad excuse for English asking some variation of if "A" is released yet, how do you do "B", or is "C" better than "D" instead of useful conversation. If you actually have something meaningful to add, you can make another thread. If you can't be bothered to make another thread or ask to be exempt, then what you want to say obviously isn't important enough to waste anyone's time with.
This is exactly how i feel. Also the maple discussion section is starting to have repetitive topics that are already being discussed in another area, example nexon announcements. Its starting to turn out to be basil general maple section. Every little thing goes their even thou it has proper sub sections for the topics.
Myles
2010-07-12, 12:55 PM
I certainly hope so. He has reasons for pretty much everything he does / says.
He's still narrow-minded and selfish with his actions, though.
"Hi, I made a change but if you don't like it I'm not gonna change it, sorry forum."
That's NOT what the forum owner should be about. They should accept criticism (which I've noticed Eos has never done) and if the majority seem another idea fit they should take that into consideration instead of brushing it aside.
This reminds me why I hardly ever visit these forums anymore.
holyforest
2010-07-12, 01:05 PM
Ok, I agree with Paul on this one because we had a talk about it a few weeks ago. For right now, instead of trying to get rid of necroposting all at once, just exempt forums with the lowest traffic...Expressive Arts, Rubik's Cube, Maple Cinema, Selling Boards, Training Center, Game Mechanics, all forums in Maplers helping Maplers.
dpeterlin
2010-07-12, 01:27 PM
It is, but everyone is also missing how very simple it is to just report the thread to a mod asking for a bump and detailing why.
Then it remains a judgment call on the mods behalf of whether or not your contribution is really worth breathing life back into the thread.
Depending on how much of the necroposting is justified this may turn into just as big of a time sink for the mods as handing out infractions.
Overall I think it's a good change. Having options open and infracting those who abuse them is preferred to having no options and no infractions but as long as the mods are available to bump the topic if it's justified I don't think it's a major concern.
KaidaTan
2010-07-12, 01:53 PM
He's still narrow-minded and selfish with his actions, though.
"Hi, I made a change but if you don't like it I'm not gonna change it, sorry forum."
That is exactly NOT what's happening. He didn't make this thread to flaunt the new rule and laugh at anyone who doesn't like it -- he's clearly open to and taking suggestions.
Myles
2010-07-12, 04:43 PM
That is exactly NOT what's happening. He didn't make this thread to flaunt the new rule and laugh at anyone who doesn't like it -- he's clearly open to and taking suggestions.
Except he denied most of the requests about removing it even though the majority view it as a bad idea & wont budge.
Hellloooo neo-Adura.
Except he denied most of the requests about removing it even though the majority view it as a bad idea & wont budge.
And what majority would that be?
The one person who had a thread impacted that was easily resolved?
holyforest
2010-07-12, 04:52 PM
Except he denied most of the requests about removing it even though the majority view it as a bad idea & wont budge.
Hellloooo neo-Adura.
What are you even talking about? He made this thread because he wants to get rid of necroposting because it's easily avoidable. He wanted suggestions as for what to do. I have no idea where you got the denied part or majority view from. And he's nothing like Adura.
street
2010-07-12, 05:25 PM
Except he denied most of the requests about removing it even though the majority view it as a bad idea & wont budge.
Hellloooo neo-Adura.
Fiel has done the same thing in the past if i recall.For example i think it was the "no pron" rule in the fun house? Everyone was against it and fiel hold his ground. Stop being so bitter over eos
Swerve
2010-07-12, 05:31 PM
A tribute to Ben, may he rest in peace:
Eos works on logic, not emotion. If people would just give him the chance to show them what he can do for this site, I think they will be very pleased with the outcome. :)
Talian, there are many lines of logic. The only reason you subscribe to Eos is because whatever little logic you had in that brain of yours has shriveled up by playing Maple Story profusely. Whereas Eosian lost his social aptitude through the many days of grinding, you appear to have lost the ability to read and think for yourself as an independent being. Again, this could be because you hung around a lot with Eos who most likely ate your brain when you weren't looking. Talian you know what is logical? Having an art thread in the art section. Tallian you know what is illogical? Arguing that a blog is better place for an art thread, rather than placing it in the art section.
Talian, it's great that you can regurgitate 1960 remakes of Eos statements. I can do it as well, "I Am Eos/ I am logical, chronological, and even half robotical/Don't call me maniacal, cause I'll use words like histrionical and ask you to stop throwing hissy fits." Talian, I'm not questioning your particular preference for Eosian's balls. I am simply stating that there are other balls out there for you to take a look at and you shouldn't limit your sycophantic pleasures to only one man. There are a lot of blue balls that need you Talian.
That is exactly NOT what's happening. He didn't make this thread to flaunt the new rule and laugh at anyone who doesn't like it -- he's clearly open to and taking suggestions.
Yes Kaida. Eosian has his arms wide open, ready to hug you and tell you that you're awesome. Kaida, maybe if you actually tried to put yourself in someone else's shoes, you would realize how difficult Eos is being when Throes actually tried to posit an opinion, "Your previous request was... not particularly moving. It's good to see other people waking up and actually participating now but it'd [be] nice to see people focusing on how to make things work best, rather than just complaining about what they don't want." Right Kaida, Eos is being so welcoming. The only thing that is missing from this picture is Eos having a strap-on AK-47 and me being bound and gagged with a blindfold covering my eyes. Eos should just be naked and have his balls flop out and say, "Here Swerve! Come here and suck it!"
The irony with this message is that I'm trying to tell you to look outside of your own pacifistic ego-centrism, "Oh Eos isn't being mean to me! Everything must be dandy!" When the centrism of this message which I purposely excluded, "... exempt the entire forum just for my one thread," is about Eos denying Throes's opinion based on the fact he perceives it to be egotistical and selfish in nature. Kaida, I don't know if you've contributed anything useful to this forum board, but usually posting up art for other people is a service to the community. It would be selfish if Throes kept her art to herself and never shared it with any of us. Or even went to her original art thread and deleted off all her pictures due to Eos being unreasonable. Throes's concern about not being able to concentrate all her updates in one thread is a sign that she cares for the community. Instead of having multiple threads, Throes wants all her art in one place so that it can be easily viewed. I don't know if you are growing up in a Talibanesque regime or if your parents had their genitals cut off and you had to eat them in front of your entire country, but Eos is definitely not "open and friendly" in convential terms.
I certainly hope so. He has reasons for pretty much everything he does / says.
Rick I have a reason for posting this. I hope that Ben reads this and knows that he isn't alone. He might not log in and read the blog that he posted, so I have to make sure that he gets the message. Not everyone on this forum wants to bend over backwards and when they voice their opinions, they need support. You may not understand this concept, but friends support each other regardless of the consequences. Ben was a great guy and his opinion isn't baseless. It can be distinctly seen through this thread. In addition, Throes got treated pretty poorly in this thread and all she ever wanted was to share her art in the most convenient form possible for the community. I may not have been in love with the guy, but I like Ben. The same thing went with Harrison. Even though both of these guys haven't contributed as much as they used to in the past, they have a distinct flavor that we remember and can recall. In addition, they tried to give something back to the community. In regards to Ben, this is seen through his writings in both blogs and the Shady Tree (yes your 'I just woke up from bed' pictures look cute as well). I stopped coming here because there was no longer a sense of cohesion. The fact that I completely missed the tonality of several previous comments indicates that this forum board is no longer #1 in my priorities list, but that still doesn't mean that I'm going to sit back and watch as the new fad becomes Southperry departures.
If you actually have something meaningful to add, you can make another thread. If you can't be bothered to make another thread or ask to be exempt, then what you want to say obviously isn't important enough to waste anyone's time with.
Whether or not something is "meaningful" doesn't apply to the fact of organization. If you have a single thread about "Bats" and you have an awesome fact about their wingspan, it doesn't make sense to write a completely new thread about "Bat wingspan" when this comment is better organized under the overall topic of "Bats." If someone was searching for the "Bat" thread, they might miss your thread due to the fact that it would be a small outlier. I have contemplated contributing my own reference posts on basic genetics as everyone can benefit from learning more about science. It doesn't make sense for someone to start a completely new thread on "single nucleotide polymorphisms" alone and many people would ignore it as it doesn't lie in context. The lack of quality in posts is a completely separate issue. Good posts shouldn't try to pull stand-alone acts. Good posts should still function within a thread and help generate better responses in the thread. Everything you post should be worth someone elses time and not just threads alone. If you don't have this mentality, then you are doing a disservice to the community.
TaliaNCo
2010-07-12, 05:54 PM
Swerve,
First and foremost, was there really a need for such a nasty response for my simple statement? Secondly, don't assume anything. All it does is make you look ignorant. Third, you don't know me, nor do you know anything about me. Take your psychobabble elsewhere. I was merely trying to make some reassuring statements amid all of the negativity. Nothing wrong with throwing a little positive energy out there. I never once bashed anyone's opinion. You can take your miserable attitude an probably your miserable life elsewhere. I'm sure it's not wanted or needed here. Reevaluate your own self before passing judgement on others.
holyforest
2010-07-12, 05:54 PM
For once could we please make this thread about the intended topic and not about Eos or bashing on Eos' moderation. And Swerve, it's Talia.
Chewy
2010-07-12, 06:00 PM
You've said that necroposting is the 4th most common infraction, but how much is 4th most? Is it 20% is it 0.0001%? Also, if it's 20% or something, how many infractions are handed out? A large amount or a small amount? 4th most isn't much when 4th most is just 0.0001%. And 20% isn't much when the 100% is just 10.
I rarely ever see necroposting and when it does happen, it's taken care of. As to you automation analogy, Eos, you CAN use the automation, but you also have the option to do the manual work yourself, should that be better suited to what you're doing.
The mods jobs are to moderate, and they should do that. It seems that you're doing a giant thing for such a small problem.
Swerve
2010-07-12, 06:05 PM
Swerve,
First and foremost, was there really a need for such a nasty response for my simple statement? Secondly, don't assume anything. All it does is make you look ignorant. Third, you don't know me, nor do you know anything about me. Take your psychobabble elsewhere. I was merely trying to make some reassuring statements amid all of the negativity. Nothing wrong with throwing a little positive energy out there. I never once bashed anyone's opinion. You can take your miserable attitude an probably your miserable life elsewhere. I'm sure it's not wanted or needed here. Reevaluate your own self before passing judgement on others.
Talia. Even though you criticize me for being nasty, you choose to retaliate by insulting me back. Talia you are right, I don't know anything about you because you don't post anything about yourself. For all I know, you could be the President of the United States, which would still make you an idiot. Even though I am a miserable despicable person, I am happy with who I am and my beliefs. I know that I'm a hypocrite, just like you.
If you really wanted to be civil about this, you would have commented on whether or not you believe Eos was being logical by choosing to prefer blogs over an art subsection for the placement of an art thread. You chose to completely ignore this issue and "get down to my level" by getting personal. You probably believe that your response to my post is filled with more integrity, but the truth is that you have ignored the logical criticism from which I centered my argument regarding Eos. Thus you have ignored the chance to provide a logical response and instead chose to fight me in a bullheaded fashion.
A contradiction arises when you state that you believe in Eos's ability as an administrator and then attempt to exact your own form of personal vengeance instead of trusting the moderators to take me down. It seems like my words and actions are more in line with my beliefs than you are in line with yours.
For once could we please make this thread about the intended topic and not about Eos or bashing on Eos' moderation. And Swerve, it's Talia.
Thanks for the correction.
Gengle
2010-07-12, 06:26 PM
HEY YOU GUIS! :B
Can we all for once try to get along when a decision is made? We all sound like a bunch of headless chickens running around trying to find our feathers. Now there are some places on this forum where the 21 day necroposting does become an issue. But if everyone would just calm down, drink some tea, and then say politely what you want to possibly be changed with the rule that Eos has put into place, maybe he'll listen and give his thoughts on the issue rather than everyone just sitting and throwing tantrums. Some of you are acting like Eos has taken charge and is banning people left and right. It also sounds like some people believe that Eos is destroying SP. Have you ever thought that maybe all of this arguing is destroying SP? So why don't we try to get along, weigh the options, and then be polite when we have something to say.
/rant.
As for the issue that this thread has been talking about, I support the 21 day necroposting. Granted, there are some forums where it could be changed, but with a few more tweeks I think it will be better for everyone.
TaliaNCo
2010-07-12, 06:29 PM
If I don't have an opinion on something, I won't state anything. People making valid arguments as to why one is better than the other is what this thread was created for. Then Eos will be able to make the best decision possible. Me adding in some positive notes to try and be supportive is not wrong. Yes, I insulted you in return and will take my punishments for that. I have no problem owning up to my responsibilities. With change, not everyone will be happy. Doing what is best for the site overall, is the main objective here no matter which way it goes.
Well, what bugs me is that Animus seems to be gangbanging here.
On topic: I don't mind this, since I tend to check dates when posting, but yeah, Throes' gallery, Felix stories, and some other areas of the forum need to get rid of this. Clearly at first sight the General Maplestory and the Nexon Announcements should be under this rule.
I support the 21 day necroposting.
I, again, would like to point out also that the 21 is not set in stone. It was a specifically low number that's higher than the current necropost threshold but lower than ideal (which was guessed at 45 days), to try to find where the appropriate average threshold should be and if this is in fact too low.
On topic: I don't mind this, since I tend to check dates when posting, but yeah, Throes' gallery, Felix stories, and some other areas of the forum need to get rid of this. Clearly at first sight the General Maplestory and the Nexon Announcements should be under this rule.
You're arguing a dead point there, I've already stated which forums were exempted from this during our discussions (http://www.southperry.net/showthread.php?t=28999&p=486621&viewfull=1#post486621) and unless you're adding new suggestions to that list you're just asking for what you already have.
Well, what bugs me is that Animus seems to be gangbanging here.
As a random side note, the Animooses have known me far longer than any of you, know me personally and in much greater detail bordering on family, so rather than accusing them of spinelessly backing me up, you should consider that they perhaps have a better perspective into me than the rest of you, and are actually judging my tone and intent in a more realistic fashion than those of you who just assume how to interpret me. If there's been one thing any of you should know by now is I don't respect spineless toadying in the slightest nor people who can't think for themselves, so before you try to bring the guild angle into it as a bias you should consider it from all perspectives.
holyforest
2010-07-12, 07:00 PM
HEY YOU GUIS! :B
Can we all for once try to get along when a decision is made? We all sound like a bunch of headless chickens running around trying to find our feathers. Now there are some places on this forum where the 21 day necroposting does become an issue. But if everyone would just calm down, drink some tea, and then say politely what you want to possibly be changed with the rule that Eos has put into place, maybe he'll listen and give his thoughts on the issue rather than everyone just sitting and throwing tantrums. Some of you are acting like Eos has taken charge and is banning people left and right. It also sounds like some people believe that Eos is destroying SP. Have you ever thought that maybe all of this arguing is destroying SP? So why don't we try to get along, weigh the options, and then be polite when we have something to say.
/rant.
As for the issue that this thread has been talking about, I support the 21 day necroposting. Granted, there are some forums where it could be changed, but with a few more tweeks I think it will be better for everyone.
Yes for crying out loud. I'm seeing people having hysterical hissy-fits over Eos doing this and Eos doing that. It's really getting slightly ridiculous.
ImagineAll
2010-07-12, 07:08 PM
Yes for crying out loud. I'm seeing people having hysterical hissy-fits over Eos doing this and Eos doing that. It's really getting slightly ridiculous.I've agreed with all of his other adjustments up to this point. What I don't agree with is his vetoing any other opinion for the simple fact that he can. At least Paul knew that he had that "power" but didn't [always] go around parading it as if it were his end all say all for anything he disagreed with. My problem with this rule was the areas being affected. He's made the changes (to an extent) so I've nothing more to say on the matter.
P.S. I like how Swerve got an infraction and your friend got a warning. Showing favoritism much?
holyforest
2010-07-12, 07:11 PM
I've agreed with all of his other adjustments up to this point. What I don't agree with is his vetoing any other opinion for the simple fact that he can. At least Paul knew that he had that "power" but didn't [always] go around parading it as if it were his end all say all for anything he disagreed with. My problem with this rule was the areas being affected. He's made the changes (to an extent) so I've nothing more to say on the matter.
P.S. I like how Swerve got an infraction and your friend got a warning. Showing favoritism much?
When did he do that?
KaidaTan
2010-07-12, 07:24 PM
Yes Kaida. Eosian has his arms wide open, ready to hug you and tell you that you're awesome. Kaida, maybe if you actually tried to put yourself in someone else's shoes, you would realize how difficult Eos is being when Throes actually tried to posit an opinion, "Your previous request was... not particularly moving. It's good to see other people waking up and actually participating now but it'd [be] nice to see people focusing on how to make things work best, rather than just complaining about what they don't want." Right Kaida, Eos is being so welcoming. The only thing that is missing from this picture is Eos having a strap-on AK-47 and me being bound and gagged with a blindfold covering my eyes. Eos should just be naked and have his balls flop out and say, "Here Swerve! Come here and suck it!"
The irony with this message is that I'm trying to tell you to look outside of your own pacifistic ego-centrism, "Oh Eos isn't being mean to me! Everything must be dandy!" When the centrism of this message which I purposely excluded, "... exempt the entire forum just for my one thread," is about Eos denying Throes's opinion based on the fact he perceives it to be egotistical and selfish in nature. Kaida, I don't know if you've contributed anything useful to this forum board, but usually posting up art for other people is a service to the community. It would be selfish if Throes kept her art to herself and never shared it with any of us. Or even went to her original art thread and deleted off all her pictures due to Eos being unreasonable. Throes's concern about not being able to concentrate all her updates in one thread is a sign that she cares for the community. Instead of having multiple threads, Throes wants all her art in one place so that it can be easily viewed. I don't know if you are growing up in a Talibanesque regime or if your parents had their genitals cut off and you had to eat them in front of your entire country, but Eos is definitely not "open and friendly" in convential terms.
Eos already said the Open Canvas is exempt from this before you posted, so this entire rant was unnecessary. In fact, it further proves my point that he's open to suggestion.
Your point is very hard to respect or even extract when it's drowned in so many ad hominems. Remember to argue against the point, not the person.
P.S. I like how Swerve got an infraction and your friend got a warning. Showing favoritism much?
Swerve has three active warnings already whereas this is Talia's first offense, ever. Everyone is treated equally and judged by same standards.
Marston
2010-07-12, 07:49 PM
Gee, if it's really this hard to come to an agreement when discussing something as harmless as necroposting, maybe you should drop the idea altogether and go back to what's been working fine for the past two years.
Necroposting may be annoying but it's nowhere near annoying enough to whip other people just to ensure that necroposting doesn't happen. I really disliked the way you handled Throes, Eos. Your reply to her looked like a giant "F(uck you, I don't care" from where I'm sitting, and was pretty unsettling overall. I really can't wrap my head around why this is even an issue. Necroposting is the most noticeable thing ever, and when it happens it usually doesn't even require a report to gain attention and eventually result in an infraction.
I really disliked the way you handled Throes, Eos. Your reply to her looked like a giant "F(uck you, I don't care" from where I'm sitting, and was pretty unsettling overall.
Throes issue was absolutely irrelevant if the entire forum were to be scrapped in favor of blogs, an idea even Fiel admitted considering. There would've been no point in "fixing" it under that circumstance just to delete it. Asking for justification under that circumstances is perfectly reasonable, especially when the issue was approached as 'exempt this entire forum just for my one thread' with no substantiating reasoning.
Marston
2010-07-12, 08:04 PM
OK WELL WHAT ABOUT THE REST OF MY POST EOs
I replied to the part that was answerable. Your opinion on the rest was not news and I've already stated my stance repeatedly. It has not changed.
Marston
2010-07-12, 08:31 PM
All you've really said was that it can be easily prevented automatically and that "moderators shouldn't have to worry about it", which is retarded seeing how it only takes one minute to view, delete, and infract a necropost. I still don't understand why this is an issue. Saying that it's the 4th most prevalent infraction isn't saying much at all. Spamming can be subjective and trolling is entirely subjective, but necroposting is flat-out and requires no thought at all when distributing infractions for it.
Then why shouldn't it be automated?
Why is fair to punish users for things they shouldn't have been allowed to do?
You keep focusing on the mods and completely ignoring that this an improvement in the user experience, not arbitrarily punishing them for things they should've known better than to do but still do anyway because they don't pay attention.
TaliaNCo
2010-07-12, 08:37 PM
Eos, I wasn't sure if I should post that fact or not so I'm glad you clarified that. Thank you! We are supportive of our friend, yet we will also speak personally outside of here to tell him if we think he's in the wrong. We are hoping to help everyone here who either has, or had, a love for MS. We still have an interest that is genuine. I hope in the future I can contribute more than I have in the past. :)
I should make clear, because it seems it wasn't, that I wasn't complaining about Animus at all, I just found it funny that 4 posts in a row defending Eos' ideas where made by Animus members, lol.
I should make clear, because it seems it wasn't, that I wasn't complaining about Animus at all, I just found it funny that 4 posts in a row defending Eos' ideas where made by Animus members, lol.
Like most organized groups we tend to move as a herd.
Marston
2010-07-12, 08:54 PM
Then why shouldn't it be automated?
Why is fair to punish users for things they shouldn't have been allowed to do?
This isn't about punishing people that necropost; it's more about punishing those that just want to post regularly, like Throes. Seriously, open up another tab and take a walk around Southperry. Look at all of the subforums that have some pretty hot topics on the first page. There's quite a few that are more than a month old. Where I come from, necroposting is bumping an older thread and not contributing to it at all, or just asking some kind of retarded question that was already answered two dozen times in the same thread. Take the Thief subforum, for example. I'm making a Dual Blader and would like to ask a couple of unanswered questions before making a build of my own. Why the fuck should I make a new thread when there's a perfect one sitting right there? Oh, right, because it's been 21 days so that thread is officially dead now. It's stupid. Southperry isn't Sleepywood where we have the same topics being brought up constantly. I would even go as far as saying Southperry's overall activity has lessened quite a bit in the past couple of months. Nearly every subforum has month-old threads on the first page; some even going further, and I just think it's stupid to have anything on the first page be automatically locked for "being too old". Still new enough to be halfway down page 1.
The only forum I could see this automated poopy working well in is General Maple and that's it. Open up your little statistics notebook and I'll bet that most necroposts occur there anyway. Anywhere else just doesn't make enough sense.
Anywhere else just doesn't make enough sense.
The places where it did not make sense have been exempted already.
Anything else would require proof that it doesn't make sense, beyond your factless insistence.
Posting once every 45 days is not 'regularly' btw. It's sporadically at best. If the 21 days is the actual issue, I for the fourth time point out that's a trial number and am open to a more realistic one.
IllegallySane
2010-07-12, 09:27 PM
The only forum I could see this automated poopy working well in is General Maple and that's it. Open up your little statistics notebook and I'll bet that most necroposts occur there anyway. Anywhere else just doesn't make enough sense.
I do agree heavily on this. When I saw the statistics that the Maple and Social section made up ~78% of the necroposts, it would indeed make sense for these sections to be subject-able to the Necropost restriction save for the incredibly low traffic sections of the Maple section: these discussions rarely last long and rarely have repeat topics/questions that can easily happen months later, unlike say the Training Center. Besides, while it's not 100% only having to deal with ~22% of the original number of necroposts is still a vast improvement than how it is now. Mods only having to deal with ~1/5 of the Necropost reports compared to before, to me, would be a fantastic improvement to the site. Obviously going for 100% is touchy because the other sections can easily receive a new post weeks later only to find out they have to make a new thread because of the rule.
If anything, A&E, MHM, Extractions, and everything from the Training Center to World Forums/Marketplace should be exempt because it's nowhere near as active as the other parts of the forum, especially when compared to General Maplestory and the Social Section (Funhouse included, especially the Funhouse). That way an overwhelming majority of necroposts will be stopped, and people won't be complaining about the less active sections getting previously large/useful/good threads locked and having to nag a Mod to reopen it.
Things under Main should probably be subjected to the Necropost restriction because these parts are almost always talking about current news/discussion that would be old in a few days or confusing/useless to a person who hasn't been keeping up with Nexon/Southperry news all the time. Okay then, that's now about ~82% of all Necroposts that will be killed in opposition to ~78% leaving only 18% of Necroposts as before to take care of. Even better!
Or how about this, create a poll listing all the sections that can be subjected to the 21 day lock, see which sections get the highest votes, and base judgment/action from there.
I think we all agree IllegallySane's viewpoint is by far the standard here. I'd add 30 days as the deadline though.
Props on making the most rational and practil post here man. This was starting to piss me off.
I would even go as far as saying Southperry's overall activity has lessened quite a bit in the past couple of months.
r u serious.
Southperry's number of unique IPs viewing the site doubled since Big Bang.
If anything, A&E, MHM, Extractions, and everything from the Training Center to World Forums/Marketplace should be exempt
Strongly disagree for Extractions. The Extractions board should have this implemented for the following reasons:
- Patch data is an extremely transient type of information. This data usually doesn't last more than three weeks before it's outdated.
- The Extraction board is implemented differently. The threads there are ordered in the order that they were posted, not in the order that the last comment happened. Anything that anyone said in a previous thread would be quickly covered up by someone posting in a new thread anyway with whatever comment or question they posted likely never answered.
For the rare thread that does last more than three weeks (KOR adventurer skill tables - or any skill tables for that matter), it should be put into a different area anyway as a point of reference so people don't have to dig through outdated extraction threads.
TøbiasBlack
2010-07-12, 09:41 PM
Throes issue was absolutely irrelevant if the entire forum were to be scrapped in favor of blogs, an idea even Fiel admitted considering. There would've been no point in "fixing" it under that circumstance just to delete it. Asking for justification under that circumstances is perfectly reasonable, especially when the issue was approached as 'exempt this entire forum just for my one thread' with no substantiating reasoning.
Eos, if i may ask, where is this consideration? i cant recall him making a public statement about this issue; though to not deviate, ill just pm you what i'd have put here else. the boards that people've been making a fuss over have been fixed, and this pointless banter back and forth about how you carry yourself is just further ruining SP's image. can we not even have a single thread you make that doesnt turn into a question/critique/analyze/criticize-everything-you-do? What good does this image portray of the site as a whole? not a damned thing. wasnt it someone who once said that if you have something to discuss that doesnt pertain to the forum discussion at hand, take it else where?
though to that end of trying to keep this thread on track: what motivation other than "i dont want to deal with necro-posting infractions anymore if they can be avoided" is there behind this move? im saying that because of the thought of a forum where you cannot necro-post seems a bit out of place. go across the internet, and most every forum you could find would have something about necro-posting, even if its just a slap on the wrist, "dont do that again" thing. i wont even say that this idea is inhibiting on ones ability to post, because all it does is force someone to clutter up a forum with a question that might already have been answered (on the same page). it'd be an annoyance on the user, sure, but it wouldn't prevent the person from posting at all. but other than that, is there really any motivation behind it?
r u serious.
Southperry's number of unique IPs viewing the site doubled since Big Bang.
Yes, but regarding posting and community it feels a lot emptier.
Eos, if i may ask, where is this consideration?
Right here in this very thread?
http://www.southperry.net/showthread.php?t=28999&p=486653&viewfull=1#post486653
holyforest
2010-07-12, 10:04 PM
Yes, but regarding posting and community it feels a lot emptier.
Yes, I've felt this as well.
Swerve
2010-07-12, 10:10 PM
Has been discussed. (http://www.southperry.net/showthread.php?t=27443&page=2)
WizMystery
2010-07-21, 06:47 PM
I vote that the expressive arts forum gets an exemption from the rule, there's usually one post every five days there.
Why would it need an exemption if it's getting activity that frequently?
Locked
2010-07-21, 07:33 PM
Why would it need an exemption if it's getting activity that frequently?
Not everyone updates their artwork daily or weekly. Some might do it once a month, which is over the 21 day period.
Open Canvas & Shady Tree (http://www.southperry.net/showthread.php?t=28999&p=486621&viewfull=1#post486621) are already exempt though, what's left in expressive arts that actually gets traffic to justify an exemption?
WizMystery
2010-07-21, 08:42 PM
Open Canvas & Shady Tree (http://www.southperry.net/showthread.php?t=28999&p=486621&viewfull=1#post486621) are already exempt though, what's left in expressive arts that actually gets traffic to justify an exemption?
Wait, are you saying it shouldn't get an exemption because nobody posts there often enough?
There shouldn't be a necroposting block on a forum that's devoted to sharing art, especially when some people make single threads to post all of their works. Once the 21 days has gone by, the person has to make yet another thread, which is essentially the same as bringing up the old one, only you now go out of your way for no good reason.
The OP has the ability to reopen their thread at any time just by editing the original post. (http://www.southperry.net/showthread.php?t=29389&p=493734&viewfull=1#post493734)
If the OP isn't active and the threads been dead for 21 days there's not much left to say or any reason to say it in that thread, is there?
That aside, once again, Open Canvas & Shady Tree aren't even effected by the rule, so what is your point/issue?
WizMystery
2010-07-22, 06:41 PM
The OP has the ability to reopen their thread at any time just by editing the original post. (http://www.southperry.net/showthread.php?t=29389&p=493734&viewfull=1#post493734)
If the OP isn't active and the threads been dead for 21 days there's not much left to say or any reason to say it in that thread, is there?
That aside, once again, Open Canvas & Shady Tree aren't even effected by the rule, so what is your point/issue?
What about the other subforums and the forum itself?
People come back. The real question here is whether or not there should have been a lock on that forum in the first place. There is no logical reason for it.
That's not what is said when people get infracted for necroposting. People asked for it, they got it.
WizMystery
2010-07-22, 10:12 PM
That's not what is said when people get infracted for necroposting. People asked for it, they got it.
People got infracted for necroposting in the popular forums, not the unpopular ones, and if they did maybe they shouldn't have been handed the infraction. The only time this is really needed is when a thread is pulled up in front of more recent and relevent ones, however in the forum I am speaking of threads take a year to reach the second page, hell I don't even know if there is a second page (haven't checked the "from the beginning" choice in the Expressive Arts). In 21 days, one thread moved down three places or so. That's it. There's no harm in bringing it up again.
EDIT: I was correct on that one, there is no second page. There are only six threads, two of them being mine on the same exact topic (you'll notice the title of them quickly)
Swerve
2010-07-22, 11:13 PM
If you have nothing new to contribute, then you can edit your original post every so often in order to keep it unlocked. If your thread ends up getting locked, then create a new thread with the important elements from the old ones. If the thread is important then you should be able to at least keep track of it every twenty days. Is it a nuisance? Sure. Does it suck for you individually? Yes. If you wanted you could possibly stick your thread in the Open Canvas as music could arguably fit the description of a type of art. I'm sure that no one is going to call you out as far more irrelevant topics get misplaced all over the forum board and people just let it slide. Especially in the case that you will be revisiting your own thread, I'm sure that it should fine with a lot of people. The rule isn't fundamentally horrible. It can be a little impractical but there are many methods of working with it if you choose to truly be serious regarding your own threads that you find to be of utmost significance. There are ways of getting what you want without needing to directly change or challenge the rules.
WizMystery
2010-07-23, 06:58 PM
If you have nothing new to contribute, then you can edit your original post every so often in order to keep it unlocked. If your thread ends up getting locked, then create a new thread with the important elements from the old ones. If the thread is important then you should be able to at least keep track of it every twenty days. Is it a nuisance? Sure. Does it suck for you individually? Yes. If you wanted you could possibly stick your thread in the Open Canvas as music could arguably fit the description of a type of art. I'm sure that no one is going to call you out as far more irrelevant topics get misplaced all over the forum board and people just let it slide. Especially in the case that you will be revisiting your own thread, I'm sure that it should fine with a lot of people. The rule isn't fundamentally horrible. It can be a little impractical but there are many methods of working with it if you choose to truly be serious regarding your own threads that you find to be of utmost significance. There are ways of getting what you want without needing to directly change or challenge the rules.
From what I understand about vB it shouldn't take more than a few seconds to lift this on a single forum. I understand there are ways of getting around it, but why force people out of their way to do it?
I don't see the reasoning behind NOT getting rid of it on the Expressive Arts, that is all. People are being so protective of the rule as if it has to be, and it just doesn't have to be. If someone would give me a valid argument as to why, maybe I would accept it to be how it is. It's not because I'm lazy, it's not because I can't figure it out, it's because the rule just has no value in this area.
Swerve
2010-07-23, 08:03 PM
From what I understand about vB it shouldn't take more than a few seconds to lift this on a single forum. I understand there are ways of getting around it, but why force people out of their way to do it? I don't see the reasoning behind NOT getting rid of it on the Expressive Arts, that is all. People are being so protective of the rule as if it has to be, and it just doesn't have to be. If someone would give me a valid argument as to why, maybe I would accept it to be how it is. It's not because I'm lazy, it's not because I can't figure it out, it's because the rule just has no value in this area.
From what I understand about posting a new thread, it shouldn't take more than a few seconds to put it up on a single forum. I understand that it takes time to write it, so why don't you just place it in the Open Canvas and give yourself a break? I don't see the reasoning behind OBJECTING from placing it in a section where you can update as you please, that is all. People are being so argumentative of the rule as if it has to be a big deal, and it just doesn't have to be a big deal. If you would give me a valid argument as to why, maybe I would accept why the status quo must change. It's not because I'm a psychophant authortitarian worshiper, it's not because you are arguing over a section that only has SIX threads where 1/3 of the threads won't ever be updated, 1/3 has been inactive, & 1/3 is solely composed of your own contributions, it's because there is no fucking practical reason why you can't just post in the Open Canvas and preserve your project until the day your dick shrivels up in your grave.
I don't see the reasoning behind NOT getting rid of it on the Expressive Arts, that is all.
You're requesting an exception.
Exceptions to the rules require justifications, not the rules themselves which have already justified their existence in some way.
You've yet to provide a reason why this is exception is necessary in any way with the options currently available.
WizMystery
2010-07-23, 09:53 PM
You're requesting an exception.
Exceptions to the rules require justifications, not the rules themselves which have already justified their existence in some way.
You've yet to provide a reason why this is exception is necessary in any way with the options currently available.
I already gave my justification, the forum is not prone to problems that arise from necroposting. How is that not a valid argument?
If you were to view this as multiple copies of the same rule on each individual forum, it wouldn't just be an exception, it would be a request to remove one of those copies.
I'm still wondering why it seems so important to everyone to keep that rule on that forum.
From what I understand about posting a new thread, it shouldn't take more than a few seconds to put it up on a single forum. I understand that it takes time to write it, so why don't you just place it in the Open Canvas and give yourself a break? I don't see the reasoning behind OBJECTING from placing it in a section where you can update as you please, that is all. People are being so argumentative of the rule as if it has to be a big deal, and it just doesn't have to be a big deal. If you would give me a valid argument as to why, maybe I would accept why the status quo must change. It's not because I'm a psychophant authortitarian worshiper, it's not because you are arguing over a section that only has SIX threads where 1/3 of the threads won't ever be updated, 1/3 has been inactive, & 1/3 is solely composed of your own contributions, it's because there is no pineappleing practical reason why you can't just post in the Open Canvas and preserve your project until the day your dick shrivels up in your grave.
So the moral is to just... do everything you're told and don't question it?
I'm still wondering why it seems to important to everyone to keep that rule on that forum.
And we're still wondering why it's important for you to remove it when it's never caused a problem yet.
The "not prone to problems" works both ways. You're wanting to exempt an entire forum on the off chance at some point in the next decade it needs it, not based on it actually doing so at any point since the policy went into effect.
WizMystery
2010-07-23, 10:06 PM
And we're still wondering why it's important for you to remove it when it's never caused a problem yet.
The "not prone to problems" works both ways. You're wanting to exempt an entire forum on the off chance at some point in the next decade it needs it, not based on it actually doing so at any point since the policy went into effect.
You realize I'm not doing this because it's that big of a problem (it's still a minor inconvienience), it's just me trying to make the site better. I'm not even the one who had the idea of coming here to request an exception, someone else agrees with me. It doesn't matter whether or not it has caused a problem (it has, no matter how minor that problem is), you're trying to fix something that isn't broken.
you're trying to fix something that isn't broken.
Yes, you are, by your own admission.
WizMystery
2010-07-23, 10:25 PM
Yes, you are, by your own admission.
But you are too, agreed?
Swerve
2010-07-23, 10:31 PM
You realize I'm not doing this because it's that big of a problem (it's still a minor inconvienience), it's just me trying to make the site better. I'm not even the one who had the idea of coming here to request an exception, someone else agrees with me. It doesn't matter whether or not it has caused a problem (it has, no matter how minor that problem is), you're trying to fix something that isn't broken.
The measure is to make it easier for moderators to do their jobs. Out of all the duties they have to perform, necroposting will no longer have to be considered as they thumb through posts. I'd like to think that instead of giving us the smoking gun for us to shoot, Eosian has simply removed it from even being abused. Instead of raising the possibility of getting banned, a measure was induced to try to stop that possibility altogether. If you really are interested in responding to an old thread, then you can try posting up a new thread and cross-reference the old post. If Eosian wants to fix things that aren't broken, then why is it a problem if he works on things that are a non-issue. I don't understand what the big deal is about the necroposting restrictions, especially after certain areas have gotten exclusion privileges. The site isn't going to be better off due to bumping old posts that were written a long time ago. The site will improve when people begin to contribute new and original threads that haven't been sourced off of an image board or you-tube. The fact is that there are many methods available to you in order to update your thread. If necroposting was never a big issue, then why is it a big issue when Eos implements some methods to make it more manageable?
But you are too, agreed?
No, because as Rick explained, it was a problem, and a solution was requested. I fixed what was broken.
That solution happened to be global, because the problem itself occurs all over the forum. Places that it made sense to exempt were exempted.
You're trying to gain a new exemption for an area you yourself have just admitted doesn't really need one.
WizMystery
2010-07-23, 10:53 PM
The measure is to make it easier for moderators to do their jobs. Out of all the duties they have to perform, necroposting will no longer have to be considered as they thumb through posts. I'd like to think that instead of giving us the smoking gun for us to shoot, Eosian has simply removed it from even being abused. Instead of raising the possibility of getting banned, a measure was induced to try to stop that possibility altogether. If you really are interested in responding to an old thread, then you can try posting up a new thread and cross-reference the old post. If Eosian wants to fix things that aren't broken, then why is it a problem if he works on things that are a non-issue. I don't understand what the big deal is about the necroposting restrictions, especially after certain areas have gotten exclusion privileges. The site isn't going to be better off due to bumping old posts that were written a long time ago. The site will improve when people begin to contribute new and original threads that haven't been sourced off of an image board or you-tube. The fact is that there are many methods available to you in order to update your thread. If necroposting was never a big issue, then why is it a big issue when Eos implements some methods to make it more manageable?
I am happy with this feature being used on the rest of the site, where it is needed. However, it is not needed here. That's the issue.
Actually, you know what? This isn't the issue. Instead of going around in circles I might as well pull out the semi-ad hominem arguement I've been trying to avoid.
The real issue here is the way that this place is being run. I, as a member of your forum, come here requesting a small, small change, only to be denied because of some logic that barely applies. Was I correct that this only takes a few seconds to change? The fact that statement was ignored, along with several other statements I've made, leaves me to believe so. If necroposting was to become a problem in this forum sometime in the near future, couldn't it just be changed again?
If you can't tell, I'm getting a little ticked off here. I started this just as a small request. May I remind you what this site is? This is a forum, basically a social networking site. This is a place where people are supposed to interact with each other on a personal level. However, I feel as if this personal relation is nonexistant. Why? If it was there, this rule would have been quickly taken off the forum, knowing no harm would come from it. Instead, I am faced with the actions that would most likely be handed off to an employee at some company. It seems like the rules are more important to everyone instead of the satisfaction of the members of this site. This is not some business.
Eos, while I have nothing against you, I feel like you are just exerting your power over me for the hell of it.
Again, I've been trying to avoid saying this, but I felt I must.
However, it is not needed here. That's the issue.
Based on what?
The section you're talking about doesn't even get acknowledged as a postable section 90% of the time, the majority of users think it's just a heading like "MapleStory" and "Main".
Claiming it's a barrier to socializing is absolute crap and you know it, because if that were remotely true that area would've been more active before the policy went into effect.
Your opinion that it's not necessary there is not going to change policy. Facts will. Prove there is a reason to change it to how you want it and it will be considered. Anything less and it goes into the pile along with all the other random opinions, regardless of who you are.
Not bending over to every half-assed idea that gets thrown out is not "exerting my power" over anyone; I've already demonstrated willingness to make changes that can be rationalized. It's refusing to waste time on things people can't be bothered to justify, and yes, that is my management style, this is not news. You're welcome to whatever opinion you choose to form on the subject as long as you don't violate the R&R.
WizMystery
2010-07-23, 11:17 PM
Based on what?
The section you're talking about doesn't even get acknowledged as a postable section 90% of the time, the majority of users think it's just a heading like "MapleStory" and "Main".
Claiming it's a barrier to socializing is absolute crap and you know it, because if that were remotely true that area would've been more active before the policy went into effect.
Your opinion that it's not necessary there is not going to change policy. Facts will. Prove there is a reason to change it to how you want it and it will be considered. Anything less and it goes into the pile along with all the other random opinions, regardless of who you are.
Not bending over to every half-assed idea that gets thrown out is not "exerting my power" over anyone; I've already demonstrated willingness to make changes that can be rationalized. It's refusing to waste time on things people can't be bothered to justify, and yes, that is my management style, this is not news. You're welcome to whatever opinion you choose to form on the subject as long as you don't violate the R&R.
See? This is just it, you don't care about anyone personally, you just follow logic. If this is the way you continue to manage this site, then what purpose do I have here? I now have the sudden urge to leave this site completely, all due to that. If you think it's me, go ahead, I just don't agree with the policies being implimented here.
I am sorry for arguing like this, but I'm just going to leave.
Swerve
2010-07-23, 11:18 PM
See? This is just it, you don't care about anyone personally, you just follow logic. If this is the way you continue to manage this site, then what purpose do I have here? I now have the sudden urge to leave this site completely, all due to that. If you think it's me, go ahead, I just don't agree with the policies being implimented here.
I am sorry for arguing like this, but I'm just going to leave.
WizMystery...
You've created an emotional investment in being right about something you've admitted isn't even an issue.
If you feel having it your way is important enough to quit over, that's your choice, but if I gave in to everyone who threatened to quit over every decision I made this place would be anarchy and if people actually followed through we wouldn't be showing a 200% increase in traffic right now.
Threatening to leave is not a trump all get it your way card - It's the last resort of someone who didn't have a point and is taking their toys and going home.
We'll still be here when you change your mind later.
Swerve
2010-07-23, 11:30 PM
You've created an emotional investment in being right about something you've admitted isn't even an issue. If you feel having it your way is important enough to quit over, that's your choice, but if I gave in to everyone who threatened to quit over every decision I made this place would be anarchy and if people actually followed through we wouldn't be showing a 200% increase in traffic right now. Threatening to leave is not a trump all get it your way card - It's the last resort of someone who didn't have a point and is taking their toys and going home. We'll still be here when you change your mind later.
Eos-chan. That's unnecessary.
WizMystery if you're reading this, thank you for sharing your contributions with this forum board. I appreciate the fact that you turned to this site after you got sick of Sleepywood and hope that you return. Thank you for your patronage.
I'm sorry for the fact that we were in disagreement. I happen to agree with Eos-chan regarding this topic, so I'm sorry if it looks like we were ganging up on you with double-play. There have been many times that I've gotten angry with Eos and have had my number of fights where I called it quits and even told him that I would burn Southperry into the ground due to his insolence. At the time Eos refused to admit that I was a Super Saiyan and told me that I was being arrogant about my power level. In order to prove him wrong, we would continually fight across the many stars of Namek. Despite these battles, I realized that I enjoyed them and that there is a more to a community than just necroposts and an administrator. Not everyone likes Eos. But being angry over one user is hardly a reason to quit a forum board. If you don't decide to come back, then good luck with life and the afterlife and the life there-after.
WizMystery
2010-07-24, 09:37 AM
Eos-chan. That's unnecessary.
WizMystery if you're reading this, thank you for sharing your contributions with this forum board. I appreciate the fact that you turned to this site after you got sick of Sleepywood and hope that you return. Thank you for your patronage.
I'm sorry for the fact that we were in disagreement. I happen to agree with Eos-chan regarding this topic, so I'm sorry if it looks like we were ganging up on you with double-play. There have been many times that I've gotten angry with Eos and have had my number of fights where I called it quits and even told him that I would burn Southperry into the ground due to his insolence. At the time Eos refused to admit that I was a Super Saiyan and told me that I was being arrogant about my power level. In order to prove him wrong, we would continually fight across the many stars of Namek. Despite these battles, I realized that I enjoyed them and that there is a more to a community than just necroposts and an administrator. Not everyone likes Eos. But being angry over one user is hardly a reason to quit a forum board. If you don't decide to come back, then good luck with life and the afterlife and the life there-after.
What you don't realize is how many times I've felt like leaving in the past, yet stayed because I believed in this site. This isn't the only reason, I just have a feeling it would be better if I left.
Swerve
2010-07-24, 09:47 AM
What you don't realize is how many times I've felt like leaving in the past, yet stayed because I believed in this site. This isn't the only reason, I just have a feeling it would be better if I left.
Well if you end up being happier not visiting the url to this site, then do whatever makes you happy. If you become curious and want to log into this site, then you can do this as well. You shouldn't limit yourself by self-censoring something you might find to be interesting in the future. Trends change, people change, and a lot of things within the community change. I'm not going to feed you garbage by telling you that you can be a catalyst for positive change or that you can turn this forum board into something you desire if you work hard and put in the initiative. That's absolute bullshit. But if you ever want somewhere to post up your music files or want to see what has happened, then don't feel bad about stopping by again. The only reason we do what we do on this site is because it makes us happy, whether directly or indirectly. Just do whatever makes you happy. That's really all I can tell you.
Adramelech
2010-07-25, 03:22 AM
this reminds me of the twilight zone epsiode "the obsolete man" ..
Satellite
2010-07-27, 01:21 PM
I was about to post Mechanic videos to the resistance videos thread, but apparently thread is too old so I'm not allowed to post:
"Sorry Satellite, You are not allowed to reply to threads that are older than 21 days."
I guess someone has to make own thread for Mechanic videos then?
And about this update...
Let's say I had a drawing thread, I couldn't use it anymore if last post has been posted more than 21 days ago?
This update may be a cure for thread bumps, but there will now be more threads just for one screenshot or video.
And about this update...
Let's say I had a drawing thread, I couldn't use it anymore if last post has been posted more than 21 days ago?
Read the feature explanation - http://www.southperry.net/showthread.php?t=29567 and this entire thread that already existed discussing the feature.
Problem with all of this is that first of all, you're limiting your moderation team. Their job is to help moderate the forum. Secondly, closing threads after 21 days? Isn't that rather hasty? Why not close it off after every 3 weeks (28 days)? Or perhaps even a month? All you're doing, really, is making it less of a hassle for the team, while on the other hand, encouraging users to spam more threads. Assume that the "What anime have you been watching?" thread doesn't get a response in approximately 21 days straight because xyz users have been busy with their lives. But a new member joined and wanted to post, but oh no, it's locked. Yes, then sticky it. Oh, but then you'd have to sticky a ton of threads that people likes to post in ...actively. This creates a new problem.
By doing this, you've closed off older threads, but encouraged others to make the same threads after every 21 days under the assumption that a specific thread doesn't get a reply in 21 days.
Enjoy.
I'm sure Sarah and the others pretty much expected the same sh`it I did, so they all left. Surprised the rest of you haven't.
Problem with all of this is that first of all, you're limiting your moderation team. Their job is to help moderate the forum.
Their job is what I say it is. And I say they're not the timestamp police. End of story there.
Secondly, closing threads after 21 days? Isn't that rather hasty? Why not close it off after every 3 weeks (28 days)? Or perhaps even a month? All you're doing, really, is making it less of a hassle for the team, while on the other hand, encouraging users to spam more threads. Assume that the "What anime have you been watching?" thread doesn't get a response in approximately 21 days straight because xyz users have been busy with their lives. But a new member joined and wanted to post, but oh no, it's locked. Yes, then sticky it. Oh, but then you'd have to sticky a ton of threads that people likes to post in ...actively. This creates a new problem.
21 days is every three weeks. The current necroposting rule was 2 weeks, or 14 days. This change extended the time someone had to make a reply, making "hasty" a ridiculous counter argument. The only thing that will be stickied is items that warrant it because the OP has the ability to extend the life of their thread at any time without bumping it. If they don't exist 21 days later and no one has touched the thread, it's time for a new version of it anyhow.
New users can't even see threads that have passed the deadline unless they adjust their settings or specifically search for them, except in forums that are exempt from the rule in the first place, or in announcement type sections where they'd still have no reason to reply to something quite dead but should be allowed to see them.
By doing this, you've closed off older threads, but encouraged others to make the same threads after every 21 days under the assumption that a specific thread doesn't get a reply in 21 days.
You speak of creating a new thread like it's some unheard of monstrosity. It's the exact same resource drain on the server whether we have one thread with 5000 posts or 1000 threads with 50, and it's easier on everyone to only have to wade through the more current iterations, especially if there's nearly month long gaps in between each version, which their shouldn't be anyhow because if it's going past 14 days without posting most of it gets locked today the minute someone necros it, invalidating your argument and before the rule changes last month the necro ticker was seven days, meaning even less chances of older threads being available to post in.
I'm sure Sarah and the others pretty much expected the same sh`it I did, so they all left. Surprised the rest of you haven't.
Sarah would be quite happy to tell you why she left so please don't try to supply reasons on her behalf based on your own opinions. She can speak for herself, as can others, something you clearly lack the balls to do directly based on your lame attempt to hide this particular chunk of your message in white text. If you have an actual problem with how the site is being run you're welcome to bring it up, but I expect it to actually be factual and have points, preferably even original ones we haven't hashed over a half dozen times already, not be opinionated whining about the end of the world just because something changed and you don't like it just because I did it. Venting is for the angry dome or your blog and we explicitly forbid "I'm quitting" and "this is why I quit" threads because no one cares.
sinisterboy9
2010-07-27, 08:57 PM
Wow, definitely some new sides to people here. Anyways, I do agree that emotion and personal issues has become a role in the debate here. I definitely think that this is overblown. Many little things are being brought into play here, all for the sake of arguing more. Eos has already stated that the most important sections which should be exempted to this rule, are. The rest, which have very minor traffic, should not be much of a problem, and if one occurs, it can be dealt with individually. Also, for the argument "moderators will be limited', I don't understand how this could be a bad thing; they have lives too, and one less task for them, all the better. Also, trial & error, right? Of course what anyone suggests at this point will probably not be final, and will likely need tweaks here and there. Overall, I don't see what this big war is about (because I don't know anyone here personally), and although off-task may be too strong of a word, definitely overblown would describe the discussions on this topic.
Secondly, closing threads after 21 days? Isn't that rather hasty? Why not close it off after every 3 weeks (28 days)? Or perhaps even a month?]
Wow. Seriously? :f7:
Swerve
2010-07-27, 09:34 PM
Wow, definitely some new sides to people here. Anyways, I do agree that emotion and personal issues has become a role in the debate here. I definitely think that this is overblown. Many little things are being brought into play here, all for the sake of arguing more. Eos has already stated that the most important sections which should be exempted to this rule, are. The rest, which have very minor traffic, should not be much of a problem, and if one occurs, it can be dealt with individually. Also, for the argument "moderators will be limited', I don't understand how this could be a bad thing; they have lives too, and one less task for them, all the better. Also, trial & error, right? Of course what anyone suggests at this point will probably not be final, and will likely need tweaks here and there. Overall, I don't see what this big war is about (because I don't know anyone here personally), and although off-task may be too strong of a word, definitely overblown would describe the discussions on this topic.
Really enlightening comment. This site needs more people like you.
Chameleonic
2010-07-28, 12:24 AM
A necro post should be classified as something that is 3 years old, not 3 weeks. 3 weeks is hardly any time at all.
I'm in the " I absolutely detest the 3 week cutoff" limit for replying to threads.
Yet you were absolutely fine with the one week original limit and the subsequent two week limit?
How exactly does giving you more time, what you profess to desire, make it worse?
Chameleonic
2010-07-28, 01:57 AM
Yet you were absolutely fine with the one week original limit and the subsequent two week limit?
How exactly does giving you more time, what you profess to desire, make it worse?
Being unaware I was unable to do something does not mean I was "absolutely fine with it". It became an issue once I was denied when I tried to post in a thread and became aware of the extremely limiting timeframe to post in threads.
And which is worse, receiving an infraction for something you didn't know was wrong, or simply being unable to do it?
What thread were you trying to post to and what is so life alteringly vital that it needs to be said 21+ days later?
Chameleonic
2010-07-28, 07:52 AM
Dont make it an infractionable action then. :f3:
So you'd rather people make a whole new thread to clog up the board than post in an old thread? I'm fine with that if you are.
It's been an infractionable action since day 1, on this and almost every forum in existence. There are legitimate reasons why threads need to stay dead past a certain point.
Posting new threads isn't "clogging up" anything. That's what the built in cut off days filter is for - so the old threads don't clog up the forum for anyone who doesn't explicitly want to see them. There's no need to recycle the same thread over and over and over to add one retarded lolcat to it every six weeks, which is about what you're wanting. The simple truth is the majority of time if a thread hasn't been touched in a week it's dead and there's little to nothing that will ever be contributed to it again. I've tripled the time to make that assumption and we've got work-arounds and exemptions to cover the exceptions.
Bomber
2010-07-28, 09:58 PM
I'm fine with this as long as the guides are set to stay, seeing as they are.
Chameleonic
2010-07-29, 12:28 AM
It's been an infractionable action since day 1, on this and almost every forum in existence. There are legitimate reasons why threads need to stay dead past a certain point.
Posting new threads isn't "clogging up" anything. That's what the built in cut off days filter is for - so the old threads don't clog up the forum for anyone who doesn't explicitly want to see them. There's no need to recycle the same thread over and over and over to add one retarded lolcat to it every six weeks, which is about what you're wanting. The simple truth is the majority of time if a thread hasn't been touched in a week it's dead and there's little to nothing that will ever be contributed to it again. I've tripled the time to make that assumption and we've got work-arounds and exemptions to cover the exceptions.
The old threads still take up bandwidth/memory/space/whatever dont they? Why make someone make a new thread which just adds to this when one already exits?
I've never understood why it is "bad" to post in an "old" thread. If I was running a board I'd encourage people to post in old existing threads rather than start a new one.
If you are going to make them inaccessible to post in you may as well just have them deleted...
Because the average forumer, on any forum, is a tardbagel who isn't capable of reading 70+ pages of a post and adding coherent thoughts at the end and instead insists on replying to things still present in the first five pages that have been dead for days weeks or months, already hashed over and repeated ad infinitum and therefore are providing nothing but spam and/or reviving drama.
They remain readable for those few who actually want to see what happened, but closed so the same crappy two cents no one cares about doesn't get added to them yet again and bump the entire thread back into rehashing a subject that noone has cared about for the past three weeks but suddenly matters because someone pissed on the flames and brought it back from a well deserved death.
Bomber
2010-07-29, 12:43 AM
Because the average forumer, on any forum, is a tardbagel who isn't capable of reading 70+ pages of a post and adding coherent thoughts at the end and instead insists on replying to things still present in the first five pages that have been dead for days weeks or months, already hashed over and repeated ad infinitum and therefore are providing nothing but spam and/or reviving drama.
They remain readable for those few who actually want to see what happened, but closed so the same crappy two cents no one cares about doesn't get added to them yet again and bump the entire thread back into rehashing a subject that noone has cared about for the past three weeks but suddenly matters because someone pissed on the flames and brought it back from a well deserved death.
Yeah, I can't gather thoughts on a 70+ page thread unless I read it all already. And more often then not I don't have much to say by then unless it's still active, and most of the time a 70+ page thread is NOT active. So what's the point? It's a lot easier to post in new threads for the people who want to know something then have a huge cluster in one page. It's very exhausting.
Dragon
2010-07-29, 02:22 PM
We can't post in Monster Bookworms then:f4:. That thread should be stickied.:poast:
The thread was closed. That has nothing to do with this.
Dragon
2010-07-29, 09:37 PM
Oh, I thought you guys closed it because it was old.:f3:
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