Are Gunners bossing classes?

[Crovis]

So ive been hearing that their no good at bosses. But ive seen awesome damage with rapid shot (like 10k each hit), plus their really fast, so with an apple their damage would be amazing.

Still i keep hearing that their no good? Whys that?

[Blankout]

Maybe it's because of their low HP. I'm not so sure.

[Chompy]

Ya I was thinking ... ARCHER-esque in damage and time?:glitter:
So they won't be TERRIBLE.. but probably not good enough to beat out NL's

[Blankout]

Ya I was thinking ... ARCHER-esque in damage and time?:glitter:
So they won't be TERRIBLE.. but probably not good enough to beat out NL's

Yep, but they won't have Sharp Eyes for boss solos.

[ItzTaylor]

At Bosses,

People would rather take a ranged character that actually helps the party, more then someone who can't contribute anything.

Sure Gunslingers have nice damage, but so do BowMasters, except they have Sharp Eyes.

Gunslingers will still be able to get into a Boss Run, people still want their damage, just like they take the Night Lords, besides the fact they have haste.

If they make Advanced Homing a Party Skill again, they might be wanted alot.

They ARE good at bosses, especially if they are able to solo. Good EXP gain at Anego right there.

But they have no Party Skills.

They won't be as useless as F/P Mages and not be able to get in any boss runs.
But they won't be able to contribute to the party, Buff-wise. :redface:

[Afrobean]

I would say that they're in the same vein of Mages. Can be extremely useful when used correctly to maximize potential, but I doubt the fine folks at gMS will allow for that to happen. Best guess I can figure is that they'll say the rapid fire attack will lag everyone and make everyone DC.

Or maybe just not allow summons or mind controls or homing. Because they'll make everyone lag out or something.

It's a shame the punchers got all the great buffs though. They really should have given either the booster or cooldown-kill buff to the gunners. Truly a similar fate as the Mage, I suppose, but then again, also like the dagger thieves in that regard.


but probably not good enough to beat out NL's
Few are capable of this feat and those that are have special requirements that must be met.

[Chompy]

I would say that they're in the same vein of Mages. Can be extremely useful when used correctly to maximize potential, but I doubt the fine folks at gMS will allow for that to happen. Best guess I can figure is that they'll say the rapid fire attack will lag everyone and make everyone DC.

Or maybe just not allow summons or mind controls or homing. Because they'll make everyone lag out or something.

It's a shame the punchers got all the great buffs though. They really should have given either the booster or cooldown-kill buff to the gunners. Truly a similar fate as the Mage, I suppose, but then again, also like the dagger thieves in that regard.




Ya I was ERKed by the no party skills.
Party skills are really THE main part of most MMORPG classes having success or UNGODLY damage.
Infighters have GOOD damage AWESOME 4th job Party buffs ONLY at the cost of high pots.
VS.
Gunslingers- We shoot you up quickly bitches. With small pellets.
...

(Ir)Regardless- I am making a Gunslinger.

[Beaner]

everything a slinger can do,a BM can do faster,better,sexier.

sucks but its true

[Hypermug]

I would say that they're in the same vein of Mages. Can be extremely useful when used correctly to maximize potential, but I doubt the fine folks at gMS will allow for that to happen. Best guess I can figure is that they'll say the rapid fire attack will lag everyone and make everyone DC.

Or maybe just not allow summons or mind controls or homing. Because they'll make everyone lag out or something.

It's a shame the punchers got all the great buffs though. They really should have given either the booster or cooldown-kill buff to the gunners. Truly a similar fate as the Mage, I suppose, but then again, also like the dagger thieves in that regard.


Few are capable of this feat and those that are have special requirements that must be met.
Meh, atleast Shadowers get Smoke Shell :(
Not the best party skill but better than nothing.

[Baklava]

I still don't get why Infighters, the slower of the pirates, get wind booster, the skill that makes people go faster, instead of Gunslingers, the class that's all about going faster.


>_>

[Afrobean]

I still don't get why Infighters, the slower of the pirates, get wind booster, the skill that makes people go faster, instead of Gunslingers, the class that's all about going faster.


>_>
Look at their 4th job transformations and tell me which one is more about speed...

Anyway, you're sort of right, but think of it this way: who needs speed more, someone who is slow, or someone who is fast?

[Luigi_Sky]

I think it would depend if Adv Homing would be a party skill or not. I think it would be great for bossing. But if it doesn't, they can still solo. :shine:

[Crovis]

I think it would depend if Adv Homing would be a party skill or not. I think it would be great for bossing. But if it doesn't, they can still solo. :shine:

Wouldnt Advance homing as party skill totally make NL/BM overpowered?

[KaidaTan]

I would say that they're in the same vein of Mages. Can be extremely useful when used correctly to maximize potential, but I doubt the fine folks at gMS will allow for that to happen. Best guess I can figure is that they'll say the rapid fire attack will lag everyone and make everyone DC.

Or maybe just not allow summons or mind controls or homing. Because they'll make everyone lag out or something.

It's a shame the punchers got all the great buffs though. They really should have given either the booster or cooldown-kill buff to the gunners. Truly a similar fate as the Mage, I suppose, but then again, also like the dagger thieves in that regard.

Are other bossing groups really that bad? My group allows us to use summons and whatever we want. Best way I can see to use a mage at HT is to spam his/her ultimate and hit around 4-6 parts of HT at once. The problem with this is that the left arm may take too much damage and start seducing before the heads are dead. This is bad times. I can't think of any other ways to "maximize potential."

I tend to disagree with the buffs though. Wind Booster would literally not increase the attack speed of a Gunslinger at all due to the attacking speed limit (which is the same speed as a NL with booster). And how does it even make sense for them to have the cooldown-killing buff? None of their skills have a cooldown.


Wouldnt Advance homing as party skill totally make NL/BM overpowered?

As far as group-bossing is concerned, they already are overpowered. That wouldn't change any class relations. It would however make Gunslingers far more valuable at bossing. Why they changed it to a personal skill I'll never know. Also as a sidenote, they should fix Pirate Ship and make people actually benefit from putting more than one point in it. 10 defense per 30 seconds longer cooldown is just laughable.

[Baklava]

Look at their 4th job transformations and tell me which one is more about speed...

Anyway, you're sort of right, but think of it this way: who needs speed more, someone who is slow, or someone who is fast?

1st paragraph;
Fist is not all that fast, and 4th job transform's blind strike, while it's quite fast, has a cool down period of a few seconds.

2nd paragraph;
But that's kinda spoon-feeding the infighters, don'tcha think?

What nexon did is instead of splitting the party skills so both pirates are party friendly, they gave all to one and made the other sit in the shadows.

[IsaacGS]

I don't really think they will be... They have all the weaknesses of an archer (Low HP, defense, lots of multi-hit attacks which are drastically affected by defense,) and none of the perks (criticals, Party skill in 4th, etc.)

I doubt they will be a favorite for big bosses like HT and Zakum, and eventually Pink Bean.

[xDae]

I still don't get why Infighters, the slower of the pirates, get wind booster, the skill that makes people go faster, instead of Gunslingers, the class that's all about going faster.
>_>
You answered your own question. They get it because they are slower and need to go faster :P

[Bribery]

Like everyone said, they lack party skills and they have low HP. Another problem is they also don't have "Soul Bullet" so they're going to run out of bullets rather quickly spamming Rapid Fire at larger bosses like Horntail and Pink Bean.

[Baklava]

You answered your own question. They get it because they are slower and need to go faster :P


1st paragraph;
But that's kinda spoon-feeding the infighters, don'tcha think?

What nexon did is instead of splitting the party skills so both pirates are party friendly, they gave all to one and made the other sit in the shadows.

Warriors are also slow but they don't get any extra speed boosters
Hermits have low HP and survivability but they don't have HP+ skills
Bowmen aren't very mobile but they don't have their own movement booster.
(Thrust does not count, no one gets it)

What I'm trying to say is that instead of feeding the complementary skill to the one who needs it, give the complementary skill to an opposite class so they can work together in a party instead of going LOL U HAV NO PARTY SKIL I HAV IT AL SO LOL@U.

Also, when you're in battleship, you don't take any damage, your battleship does. I'm not sure exactly how much HP the battleship has.

[Luigi_Sky]

Wouldnt Advance homing as party skill totally make NL/BM overpowered?

Probably.
580% increase is a big percentage.
Meh, it makes bossing easier which is a good thing.

[Stereo]

Like everyone said, they lack party skills and they have low HP. Another problem is they also don't have "Soul Bullet" so they're going to run out of bullets rather quickly spamming Rapid Fire at larger bosses like Horntail and Pink Bean.
At least bullets have much higher quantities per slot, I believe it goes up past 2k per slot on the high level ones. Not sure how fast Rapid Fire consumes though, TT is about 10 stars per second.

[Rampage]

I still don't get why Infighters, the slower of the pirates, get wind booster, the skill that makes people go faster, instead of Gunslingers, the class that's all about going faster.


>_>

Yeah, I definitely think 'slingers should have booster. I mean, give infighters both of the class buffs? Giving gunslingers wind booster would make both of the pirate classes have even advantage with bossing/training parties.

[Dusk]

everything a slinger can do,a BM can do faster,better,sexier.

sucks but its true

I'd have to disagree. At least until we get an Ultimate and the ability to freeze. I might make a Captain, but yeah, they don't seem like a bossing class.

[ahoboandahal]

At least bullets have much higher quantities per slot, I believe it goes up past 2k per slot on the high level ones. Not sure how fast Rapid Fire consumes though, TT is about 10 stars per second.

TT+SP does 9 stars/second, rapid fire does 10 bullets/second.

[Stereo]

If TT fires at the same speed as L7 then it's doing exactly 600 stars per minute, which is 10 per second. I don't see any reason why TT would be slower than L7..

[Dusk]

If TT fires at the same speed as L7 then it's doing exactly 600 stars per minute, which is 10 per second. I don't see any reason why TT would be slower than L7..

That's correct. 36/60 seconds per TT (fast (4) or faster (3) claw with booster).

[ahoboandahal]

If TT fires at the same speed as L7 then it's doing exactly 600 stars per minute, which is 10 per second. I don't see any reason why TT would be slower than L7..

TT isnt slower than l7, but l7 is not that fast. A claw attacks 1.5 times a second, and with TT+SP, that is 9 stars a second.

[Dusk]

TT isnt slower than l7, but l7 is not that fast. A claw attacks 1.5 times a second, and with TT+SP, that is 9 stars a second.

It IS that fast; claws attack 1.6 repeating times per second with booster.

[ahoboandahal]

It IS that fast; claws attack 1.6 repeating times per second with booster.

Oh, that was my mistake. Forgot to take in account booster. So with booster, they fire at exactly the same rate. If only rapid fire was affected by booster and wind booster :f7:

[HiiEN]

Warriors are also slow but they don't get any extra speed boosters
Hermits have low HP and survivability but they don't have HP+ skills
Bowmen aren't very mobile but they don't have their own movement booster.
(Thrust does not count, no one gets it)

What I'm trying to say is that instead of feeding the complementary skill to the one who needs it, give the complementary skill to an opposite class so they can work together in a party instead of going LOL U HAV NO PARTY SKIL I HAV IT AL SO LOL@U.

Also, when you're in battleship, you don't take any damage, your battleship does. I'm not sure exactly how much HP the battleship has.
But then that would kind of involve sacrificing a party slot for the gunslinger, when the spot could be given to an NL, BM, bishop, Drk, etc. which is very crucial for bossing.

[Standup]

Probably.
580% increase is a big percentage.
Meh, it makes bossing easier which is a good thing.

You got it all wrong. Advanced homing increases the damage of other attacks by 20%... 580% damage is the hit damage (one hit) applied when you use the skill... theres an egg throwing animation for it im pretty sure

[JoeTang]

Is there a reason why everyone is saying "Rapid Fire" instead of "Battle Ship Cannon"?

[Loose]

The Battleship might break?

But I think it Cannon does more damage over time than Rapid Fire. If it's not healable, then attack all you can with the Battleship and when you sense the boss is above to strike, then disable to avoid the cooldown if it breaks.

[Silver_ice]

gunners seem to have ok skills. i dont think any of their attacks are as horrible as mages at bosses. i bet they could do 2x or even 3x as much dmg at a boss then a mage for sure. thats counting 35k chain light per second vs maybe 50-70k with rapid shot.

gunners could use a party skill though, thats for sure. vipers are kinda overpowered like that.

[ItzTaylor]

Is there a reason why everyone is saying "Rapid Fire" instead of "Battle Ship Cannon"?

Because of Battleship's cooldown.

Seeing that most people will leave it at lvl 1 till later levels if they are smart, I don't see the cooldown as a problem.

The cool down is 90 seconds for level 1 Battle Ship

Battle Ship Cannon deals way more damage then Rapid Fire.

The problem is if Battle Ship Cannon breaks, you will be left with Triple Fire, if you went the Battle Ship Cannon build.

Of course if you are higher level, it won't be a problem debating what you use, since you have both.

But I still think the Battle Ship build first is the most effective.

Of course no one knows this for sure, since we don't have pirates yet.

But that is my best guess.

[Luigi_Sky]

You got it all wrong. Advanced homing increases the damage of other attacks by 20%... 580% damage is the hit damage (one hit) applied when you use the skill... theres an egg throwing animation for it im pretty sure

Oh
>_>
20% is still good

[Baklava]

Well, if we can find out exactly how much HP the battleship has, you could effectively make a swap technique. In a CMS video, a guy's battleship took over 30k damage(8~10k hits) at pianus without breaking

Take as much damage from the boss as possible while in battleship, without the battleship being broken. Then get off the battleship and re-board it to reset it.

Gunslingers won't be wanted in parties for buffs, but they will be wanted for their damage.
Using homing + battleship cannon on a boss, you'll be doing 400% x4 every shot (more if you have sharp eyes), and those shots are pretty fast.

[Standup]

that was the video i posted... pretty sure its a private server because gunslingers wouldnt even have 10k health =)... btw from that same guy heres another video of a lvl 200gunslinger and 180infighter
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8mKnw2pbV2c

[Blankout]

that was the video i posted... pretty sure its a private server because gunslingers wouldnt even have 10k health =)... btw from that same guy heres another video of a lvl 200gunslinger and 180infighter
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8mKnw2pbV2c

There are a whole bunch of equips dropping too.

[Rezzy64]

Like everyone said, they lack party skills and they have low HP. Another problem is they also don't have "Soul Bullet" so they're going to run out of bullets rather quickly spamming Rapid Fire at larger bosses like Horntail and Pink Bean.

Yeah... but then again Assassins do not have "Soul Star".

[Blankout]

Yeah... but then again Assassins do not have "Soul Star".

Sins don't...but NL's do.

[xDae]

Yeah... but then again Assassins do not have "Soul Star".
So then whats Shadow Claw o_0

[Rezzy64]

So then whats Shadow Claw o_0

Yeah but only NL's have that, everything below 4th job for sins is just the same as a gunslinger, and also is anybody forgetting pirate ship? Pirate ship has two main and powerful attacks and both are based on the idea of not using bullets for their damage. So honestly NL's with shadow claw are closely the same as a Captain with pirate ship.

[Baklava]

Yeah... but then again Assassins do not have "Soul Star".

They do in 4th job, but it's short duration period and the fact that it uses 200 stars when it's used makes it far less effective.


And bullets hold far more than stars. The steely can carry the most stars @ 1200 when maxed.
The Lv70 bullet can hold up to 2400 with maxed mastery, and the Lv90 can hold up to 3200.
I'm assuming the Lv110 will hold up to 4000 bullets per slot.

[randompeep]

Yeah but only NL's have that, everything below 4th job for sins is just the same as a gunslinger, and also is anybody forgetting pirate ship? Pirate ship has two main and powerful attacks and both are based on the idea of not using bullets for their damage. So honestly NL's with shadow claw are closely the same as a Captain with pirate ship.

Not any more. Shadow Claw has been changed.

The Night Lord skill "Shadow Claw" is renamed to "Shadow Stars" and its skill description is changed.

Old: Allows the Night Lord to throw stars without using stars.
New: Attacks a monster using 200 stars out of the currently equipped star. Allows an infinite number of stars to be thrown for a short period of time.


Please note that arrow was assigned a random post.

[xDae]

Yeah but only NL's have that, everything below 4th job for sins is just the same as a gunslinger, and also is anybody forgetting pirate ship? Pirate ship has two main and powerful attacks and both are based on the idea of not using bullets for their damage. So honestly NL's with shadow claw are closely the same as a Captain with pirate ship.
People in KMS and even Fiel have confirmed that the Battleship uses bullets....

[Holypie]

every gunslinger skill except CE and FB use bullets, and those use capsules, so what's the difference?

[xDae]

every gunslinger skill except CE and FB use bullets, and those use capsules, so what's the difference?
If you have capsules, it still uses bullets. Or it may be that if yo have no capsules, you use bullets. One of the two

[Holypie]

second one, but the strength of the attack drastically lowers when using bullets

[Rezzy64]

People in KMS and even Fiel have confirmed that the Battleship uses bullets....

I'm sorry that is my mistake but just as other people have said, "Shadow Stars" uses 200 stars for an infinite amount of stars for a short period of time. With that down side it seems you would run out of stars before a gunslinger would run out of bullets, just as Baklava said the max a sin can carry is 1200 where as max for a gunslinger can be up to 4000 plus with the help of "Rapid Fire" would allow more damage to be dealt out faster using less bullets.
Also considering that we are talking about Gunslingers being a Great Bossing class. You also have to look at the Awesome help of "Advanced Homing" which will allow you to not only make all bullets hit the boss monster but also you deal extra damage to the target.

[xDae]

I'm sorry that is my mistake but just as other people have said, "Shadow Stars" uses 200 stars for an infinite amount of stars for a short period of time. With that down side it seems you would run out of stars before a gunslinger would run out of bullets, just as Baklava said the max a sin can carry is 1200 where as max for a gunslinger can be up to 4000 plus with the help of "Rapid Fire" would allow more damage to be dealt out faster using less bullets.
Also considering that we are talking about Gunslingers being a Great Bossing class. You also have to look at the Awesome help of "Advanced Homing" which will allow you to not only make all bullets hit the boss monster but also you deal extra damage to the target.
For the gunslinger, not the party. Advanced Homing int a party skill anymore (unfortunately) So yea, they are good at bossing, but will they be invited to bossing parties? Over a BM/MM or NL? I doubt it

Also, bullets are much MUCH more common than Stars

[Rezzy64]

Also, bullets are much MUCH more common than Stars

What does how common bullets are compared to stars have anything to do with it?

[Holypie]

how many bullet sets a GS can buy with 10m answer:too many to count

[xDae]

What does how common bullets are compared to stars have anything to do with it?
Well its the simple fact that they are so common that the level 50 bullet costs about 100k TOPS in kMS (last I heard) So obviously not having a "Soul Bullet" doesnt affect a Gunslinger because you can buy tons of sets for very cheap

[Rezzy64]

Yeah but isn't that a good thing, rather than being rejected from party's because you have shitty stars because you can't find any, or having to deal with the ridiculous FM prices on stars just so you can have slightly better damage. I think it's better that way.

[xDae]

Yeah but isn't that a good thing, rather than being rejected from party's because you have shitty stars because you can't find any, or having to deal with the ridiculous FM prices on stars just so you can have slightly better damage. I think it's better that way.
Im not saying its a bad thing. I swear to god talking to you is like talking to a wall

What Im saying is the fact that they can buy so many bullets for such a little price, then they can carry more and thus not really need soul bullet

[Holypie]

Im not saying its a bad thing. I swear to god talking to you is like talking to a wall

What Im saying is the fact that they can buy so many bullets for such a little price, then they can carry more and thus not really need soul bullet
walls are easier. they don't reply, but they listen

[Rezzy64]

walls are easier. they don't reply, but they listen

Screw you smart ass. I'm sorry I don't understand every last thing you guy's are trying to explain. Plus I understand that point yes pirates don't need a soul bullet because of how much they carry (I wasn't understanding the way you were saying it. :f3:), but also you can almost just as easily say the same about bowman, think about how now you can buy arrows in stores now plus how cheap they are and as a bonus they are extremely common dropped by monsters. So Bowman don't exactly need "Soul Arrow" either.

[Holypie]

can you recarge arrows? no plus, diamond arrows and red arrows cost 20 mesos each and are UNcommon drops

[Rezzy64]

Okay wow, I did not bring up the bonuses of other types of arrows. Also if you were to buy those uncommon arrows in stores that sell them, it would still generally be cheaper than having to deal with stars. Also almost every shop in the game sells regular arrows that cost 1 meso per arrow, which I'm sure a lot of bowman can deal with.

[Itachi54647]

They are probably cheap because pirates fire really fast.

[blitzkrieg]

Well its the simple fact that they are so common that the level 50 bullet costs about 100k TOPS in kMS (last I heard) So obviously not having a "Soul Bullet" doesnt affect a Gunslinger because you can buy tons of sets for very cheap

That price is on one of the least populated servers on kMS, though. Also, level 90 bullets are sold for about 4m-5m each. The only reason level 50 bullets are so cheap is because they drop a lot at one of the most used training spots in Magatia.

[Beaner]

Okay wow, I did not bring up the bonuses of other types of arrows. Also if you were to buy those uncommon arrows in stores that sell them, it would still generally be cheaper than having to deal with stars. Also almost every shop in the game sells regular arrows that cost 1 meso per arrow, which I'm sure a lot of bowman can deal with.

regular arrows give 0 attack, making them useless.:f7:

[Silver_ice]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8mKnw2pbV2c

take a look at the video. both the gunslinger and the viper can pull off insane damage. are they good for bosses? why not :P

[Takebacker]

Okay wow, I did not bring up the bonuses of other types of arrows. Also if you were to buy those uncommon arrows in stores that sell them, it would still generally be cheaper than having to deal with stars. Also almost every shop in the game sells regular arrows that cost 1 meso per arrow, which I'm sure a lot of bowman can deal with.

A BM constantly uses hurricane, a gunslinger switches from rapid fire to battleship.

A gunslinger can hold 3k-4k+ per slot, a BM can hold 1k per slot.

BMs would run out of arrows MUCH faster then a gunslinger would run out of bullets.

[odin]

They may have potential (if advanced homing becomes a party skill) because without party skills someone rather pick a NL for damage or a Bowmaster for damage+SE

But in my opinion of the 2 pirate classes the vipers will be the one picked for bossings due to time leap and windbooster which i think theyre going to be a must have like HB Haste SE and such.