Ask a Bowman Thread.

[Jason]

Welcome to the "Ask a Bowman Thread!"
http://i41.photobucket.com/albums/e291/ssj3yip/Bowmancopy.png


What is the "Ask a Bowman Thread?"

It is a thread (hopefully sticked!) that will allow you to ask as many questions you can ask to the Bowmen of Maple. They will try their best to answer your question/concern.

All you have to do post your question/concern. It would be very helpful if the question was to the point, specific, and preferably readable! It's just so that the Bowmen can understand you. :D

Example questions:


What is the difference between a Crossbow and a Bow?
What should I add my first SP among my 1st Job Advancement?
Should I scroll my Heckler/V2k?
Should I HP wash?
What are the pros/cons of being a Bowman?

Basic information:


Before making your 1st Job Advancement, make sure to have 25 AP into Dex.
Primary stat for a Bowman is Dex, secondary is Strength.
(Cross)Bow equipping:

Crossbow- Strength=Your Level. (ex: Level 38, Str=38.)
Bow- Strenght=Your Level+5. (ex: Level 40, Str=45.)




Frequently asked questions:
1. What is Final Attack? And should I get it?

Final Attack is a 2nd job skill that takes 30 points to max. It shoots an extra strong when using Arrow Blow, Double Shot, or Arrow Bomb/Iron Arrow at a 60% rate when maxed. Most Bowmen recommend not getting it because it does not activate with Strafe in 3rd job. However the choice of getting FA depends on the person playing the character.

2. What is that super fast skill that fires like a machine gun?

That skill is a Bowmaster exclusive skill. It’s called Hurricane.

3. What is the difference between a Crossbowman/Sniper/Marksman and a Hunter/Ranger/Bowmaster?

Crossbowmen/Sniper/Marksman:-Uses Crossbows (duh).
-Generally stronger of the two.
-Generally a slower attacking speed compared to a Bow.
-Iron Arrow (2nd), Ice Shot, Arrow Eruption (3rd), Pierce, Blind, Snipe, Frostprey (4th).

Hunter/Ranger/Bowmaster
-Uses Bows.
-Generally weaker of the two.
-Generally a faster attacking speed compared to a Crossbow.
-Arrow Bomb (2nd), Inferno, Arrow Rain (3rd), Hurricane, Concentrate, Hamstring, Pheonix (4th).

Those are the basic differences. Most agree that Snipers have the better 3rd job because they are able to freeze. Also with Strafe, the speed pertaining to them before is pretty much gone, but Snipers are doing more because of their damage formula. Bowmasters and Marksmen are pretty even.

4. I heard there are these so called "hell levels". What are they exactly?

Hell levels are basically a certain level arch when training is damn hard. Most archers agree they are the Mid 4x-50 and 6x-mid 7x. These are the parts you'll be either stuck at training spots with a weapon that sucks so you can't move on, or you'll be stuck because of underdeveloped 3rd job skills.

5. Why do most Archers stick with the Red Viper/Heckler at 3x-50?

Because of the fast attack speed. It's the last fast attack speed bow you'll ever hold, unless you can find yourself a decent Blue Metus (Ranger).

6. Does Soul Arrow stack with arrows?

It has been proven countless times that Soul Arrow does not stack with arrows. It may show on your stat screen, but it will never achieve that damage.

7. Where do I train as an archer?

Refer to Retalion’s guide.

Guides:
Where to level guide by Retalion: http://www.southperry.net/forums/showthread.php?t=31

[Trinity]

my question is...

Did you think of this thread yourself?
(geekly checks sw)

hmm jason, if thats your real ign.
are you really a bowman
(scratches beard)

[Anyoneisgod]

I look forward to helping people here and urge any bowman to ask what you need to know here.There is no such thing ask Noob questions.

[Trinity]

Can bow booster give "faster" bows even faster speed?

is there even another rate aboce faster?

[Jason]

my question is...

Did you think of this thread yourself?
(geekly checks sw)

hmm jason, if thats your real ign.
are you really a bowman
(scratches beard)

1. Your question doesn't involve Bowmen >_>". But yes, this is pretty much a copy of Sleepy. But isn't this "Bowman Training Section" similar to Sleepy?

2. Jason is not my real IGN. It's my real life name. And what would my User Name have to do with my IGN in Maple? Just some FYI, I've actually quit Maple. And my main is not a Bowman. Have I played one? Yes.

[Retalion]

Seriously, what effort is "copying and pasting" everything and then changing the word "Warrior" into Bowman? The guidelines you're giving isnt to an "Ask the archers" thread, its to a "What to buy" thread. Show some effort into maintaining a thread before copy and pasting and asking for it to be stickied (as after contributing basically nothing into the thread, it doesnt deserve a spot in the stickies).

I'd say leave threads like this for the moderators to make. That being said, if questions are asked in here, I will answer them with whatever knowledge I havea available.

As for ideas on how to make a real "Ask the Archers" thread:

-Do an FAQ. Commonly asked archer questions such as "Should I get FA", "Do attack arrows stack with Soul arrow", "Do I get Focus", etc.
-Have some guidelines of what you can and cannot ask (as some things are overlapping. For example, Where to train questions wont be posted here. It'd be posted in my thread, etc).

A thread like this isnt going to work if the thread starter isnt willing to put some effort into maintaining this thread and answering the questions. That being said, even if you dont maintain it, people like Colum and I would do your job for you >_> I suppose good luck getting it stickied?

I shall now go and copy and paste this thread into the other "Ask the _____" threads because the same concept applies. Just kidding.

[Anyoneisgod]

You should ask Fiel or some other mod to Rename this Thread if possible, This is a what to buy thread.

[Jason]

Chill guys. It's just to start up to get this forum going. I'm fixing it up as we speak. No need to go crazy on me. >_>" Way to bring a guy down. ~_~ Every great thread comes in good time. If I didn't care, wouldn't I have just copied everything from Sleepywood itself?

Seriously give me a few days to spice it up, they if you still feel that it sucks, then I'll simply close this thread for you to remake. No sweat right? I don't have like all the free time in the world. Just give me time before you start criticizing. I don't mean to be disrespectful, but shit, you make it seem as if I was just gonna leave this thread the way it is. The thing is, I'm not.

Lastly, I don't have all the answers, that's why the community of the class will help answer.

[Anyoneisgod]

we did not mean to being you down dude, just a little constructive Critt eh? sorry if it felt like i was beating up on you.

[Retalion]

Chill guys. It's just to start up to get this forum going. I'm fixing it up as we speak. No need to go crazy on me. >_>" Way to bring a guy down. ~_~ Every great thread comes in good time. If I didn't care, wouldn't I have just copied everything from Sleepywood itself?

Seriously give me a few days to spice it up, they if you still feel that it sucks, then I'll simply close this thread for you to remake. No sweat right? I don't have like all the free time in the world. Just give me time before you start criticizing. I don't mean to be disrespectful, but shit, you make it seem as if I was just gonna leave this thread the way it is. The thing is, I'm not.

Lastly, I don't have all the answers, that's why the community of the class will help answer.


Im not going crazy. Im just saying. Hell, I even threw in suggestions. If I was intent on just flaming you to hell, I would've done so without offering ideas for improvement. If you say so, then I'll take your word for it and wait a few days to see the new look on the thread ^^

[Wind]

*Has the neccesary experience with Archers so will make some nice Q&A table*

Question: Final Attack. Yes or no?
Answer: Definately no, it will trigger with 2nd job skills and 2nd job skills only (con #1), which means it'll also trigger with AB or IA, which will mess up your mobbing (con #2).
Also, at bosses, you -could- be 1HKO food, if FA triggers, you get to enjoy the sound of a falling gravestone (con #3).

Question: HOLY SHIT HURRICANE BRB BM.
Answer: Have fun getting to late 14x-15x, because THEN it'll be worth it being a Bowmaster for the reason you made it for.

Question: Ranger, Sniper. What's the difference?
Answer: Rangers use bows, Snipers use crossbows. Snipers can freeze, Rangers can't.
In my opinion, they'll only be significantly different during 4th job.

Question: I heard there are the so called "hell levels". What levels exactly and why?
Answer: Mid 4x-50 and 6x-mid 7x. These are the parts you'll be either stuck at training spots with a weapon that sucks so you can't move on, or you'll be stuck because of underdevelopped 3rd job skills.

Question: Why do most Archers stick with the Red Viper/Heckler at 3x-50?
Answer: Because of the fast attack speed. It's the last fast attack speed bow you'll ever hold, unless you're a snobrich Ranger that can afford a Blue Metus.

Question: LOL MARKSMEN SUCK IN 4TH JOB BRB QUITTING.
Answer: If it were the case that BMs and MMs had about the same range with about the same equipment, I would agree. (Give it up guys. Hurricane > Pierce.)
HOWEVER, this is not the case. Crossbows are WAY cheaper than bows, so scrolling an epic crossbow is easier than scrolling an epic bow. And they can freeze.
I'd say they're about equal. BMs WILL win at stationary DPS most of the times though (Zakum, Horntail).

Question: Will you get ANY party skills at all during pre-4th job?
Answer: No. DURING 4th job however, you'll be loved for SE.

Question: Will you give me mesos please? :3
Answer: No.

Question: Where do I train as an archer?
Answer: In a nutshell: Snails -> Slimes -> Ellinia mushrooms trees -> Wild Boars -> Ludi teddies -> Straw Target Dummies -> Voodoos/Zombies -> First squid map -> Second squid map -> Gobies -> Jr.Newties (-> Skelegons). Et voila level 200.

Question: What do you think what's so good about Archers?
Answer: Their diversity, they have a nice arsenal of actively used skills.

Question: What do you think what's so bad about Archers?
Answer: Their lack of HP. >_>

Question: Any closing statements?
Answer: Make sure you play an Archer for fun, not for bandwagoning. (Most of you will quit around 4x anyways and go back to your Bishops. D: )

[Derimed]

Question: Ranger, Sniper. What's the difference?
Answer: Rangers use bows, Snipers use crossbows. Snipers can freeze, Rangers can't.
In my opinion, they'll only be significantly different during 4th job.


There is a significant speed difference. If you watch a Ranger spamming Rain, and a Sniper spamming Eruption, you'll see it. (Strafe is now equal for both, I think.) Also, the power of clean crossbows tends to be greater than that of bows, and their damage calculation is greater than of bows.

If you plan to make an archer god, I'd suggest going with bow because a lot of people think it's better in 4th. That, and I'd say the lesser power of the bow can be compensated with godly equips, (I've had people remark that I can outdamage a hermit of my lvl, but let's not get into that.) However, xbow also has very nice skills, and ultimately it's also enjoyable.

[Kevvl]

There is a significant speed difference. If you watch a Ranger spamming Rain, and a Sniper spamming Eruption, you'll see it. (Strafe is now equal for both, I think.) Also, the power of clean crossbows tends to be greater than that of bows, and their damage calculation is greater than of bows.

If you plan to make an archer god, I'd suggest going with bow because a lot of people think it's better in 4th. That, and I'd say the lesser power of the bow can be compensated with godly equips, (I've had people remark that I can outdamage a hermit of my lvl, but let's not get into that.) However, xbow also has very nice skills, and ultimately it's also enjoyable.

Strafe looks faster, but in reality it isn't.
If the power of a bow can be compensated with godly equips, couldn't you also make an equally godly Xbowman?

The only real difference is the freezing vs. Inferno. DoT for both is about the same, so the speed isn't that important.


Although I disagree with what you say about FA+AB. It increases DoT on single monsters, and although it does lower your DoT on mobs, the way FA dsitributes damage makes it fairly helpful for hunters.

[Retalion]

*Has the neccesary experience with Archers so will make some nice Q&A table*

Question: Final Attack. Yes or no?
Answer: Definately no, it will trigger with 2nd job skills and 2nd job skills only (con #1), which means it'll also trigger with AB or IA, which will mess up your mobbing (con #2).
Also, at bosses, you -could- be 1HKO food, if FA triggers, you get to enjoy the sound of a falling gravestone (con #3).

Question: HOLY SHIT HURRICANE BRB BM.
Answer: Have fun getting to late 14x-15x, because THEN it'll be worth it being a Bowmaster for the reason you made it for.

Question: Ranger, Sniper. What's the difference?
Answer: Rangers use bows, Snipers use crossbows. Snipers can freeze, Rangers can't.
In my opinion, they'll only be significantly different during 4th job.

Question: I heard there are the so called "hell levels". What levels exactly and why?
Answer: Mid 4x-50 and 6x-mid 7x. These are the parts you'll be either stuck at training spots with a weapon that sucks so you can't move on, or you'll be stuck because of underdevelopped 3rd job skills.

Question: Why do most Archers stick with the Red Viper/Heckler at 3x-50?
Answer: Because of the fast attack speed. It's the last fast attack speed bow you'll ever hold, unless you're a snobrich Ranger that can afford a Blue Metus.

Question: LOL MARKSMEN SUCK IN 4TH JOB BRB QUITTING.
Answer: If it were the case that BMs and MMs had about the same range with about the same equipment, I would agree. (Give it up guys. Hurricane > Pierce.)
HOWEVER, this is not the case. Crossbows are WAY cheaper than bows, so scrolling an epic crossbow is easier than scrolling an epic bow. And they can freeze.
I'd say they're about equal. BMs WILL win at stationary DPS most of the times though (Zakum, Horntail).

Question: Will you get ANY party skills at all during pre-4th job?
Answer: No. DURING 4th job however, you'll be loved for SE.

Question: Will you give me mesos please? :3
Answer: No.

Question: Where do I train as an archer?
Answer: In a nutshell: Snails -> Slimes -> Ellinia mushrooms trees -> Wild Boars -> Ludi teddies -> Straw Target Dummies -> Voodoos/Zombies -> First squid map -> Second squid map -> Gobies -> Jr.Newties (-> Skelegons). Et voila level 200.

Question: What do you think what's so good about Archers?
Answer: Their diversity, they have a nice arsenal of actively used skills.

Question: What do you think what's so bad about Archers?
Answer: Their lack of HP. >_>

Question: Any closing statements?
Answer: Make sure you play an Archer for fun, not for bandwagoning. (Most of you will quit around 4x anyways and go back to your Bishops. D: )

I was going to make a list like that today but you beat me to it xP I'll just comment on some of your points and go from there I suppose.

Final Attack: Its not a definite no. Ive had 2 rangers over 120, 1 with FA, the other without and I'd say that both were fine. I had no hinderances with using either. You just mentioned the cons of FA but there are a few pros to it (such as leveling faster through 2nd job and whatnot). The general consensus is that FA-less is the way to go but I would say its not the end of the world if you did get FA and if you have FA, you shouldnt be discriminated against.

As for hell levels, I'd say they're a myth because of the training spots that we have now. You can get from 4x to 5x easily now as a hunter with zombie lupins or as an xbowman with STDs. Back in beta and early GMS when the only 4x places were lupins, pixies, fire boars and copper drakes, yeah those are hell levels. Now not so much though. Its highly possible to fly through the 4x-5x levels in a day now.

Fast bows: That's not entirely true anymore. Red Vipers/Hecklers have been replaced by maple bows and xbows, which are then replaced by soul searchers and maple crows which are then replaced by kandivas and nishadas. Kandivas and Nishadas are now the last "fast" bow that you use and some people will use them for the rest of their archer careers. That being said, at 120, for rangers/bow masters, the speed wont matter as SoA isnt affected by shooting speed. The Red Viper/Heckler thing was only true back in the day when the only 35 bow was the RV and the only 40 bow was the V2k.

Training: Refer to my training thread. While the little outline you had is somewhat accurate, some of those places are outdated (Ie. Wild boars).

Archer HP thing worthy of mention: If you have the money you can hp wash, almost completely eliminating the "lack of hp" weakness. However, its really expensive, both in terms of nx and mesos (INT equips cost A LOT).

Additional questions?

Focus vs. Blessing: Most archers choose focus for the extra avoidability. Blessing can stack with other skills/pots but for the most part and focus will get overbuffed by Bless, acc pills, etc. That being said, archers dont need the extra acc. They have enough to hit anything in game as it is.

Double Shot vs. Arrow Blow: Because Critical adds 100% dmg and doesnt double, Double shot is stronger in terms of max damage and average damage.

Do attack arrows stack with soul arrow? Nope, proven many times already

Str-less vs. Normal Strength-Strless will be stronger till the high bow master levels and their damage will be the same as normal strength with gear that is significantly less impressive (my glove added 6 more attack than my strless friend, my overall had 15 more dex, my cape 1 atk 2 dex more and we had the same dmg range). However, you also gain fewer advantages from various boss items. You only use 15 stats from the z-helm (normal str use 30: 15 str and 15 dex) and only 22 from a HT pendant (22 str vs 22 str + 22 dex). As well, most overalls have 2-4 str on them anyways so you lose out another few points there.

What is the dex: attack ratio? The ratio constantly changes. The more dex you have, the higher the dex: attack ratio is. I remember at 50 its roughly 3:1 as my 2/9 PAC and my 3/6 PAC had the EXACT same dmg range (like literally exact, rofl).

That's all I can think of for now, lols.

[Cardboardsnail]

4X-50 isn't what I would call "hell levels"

It's actually pretty smooth

[Impassive]

Level 66
White Polyfeather Hat: +2 Str, +4 Dex
Cecelia's Earrings: Clean
Orange Tai: +5 Str +12 Dex
Red Gore Boots: +3 Str +2 Dex
Spielgelmann Necklace: +1 All
Blue Napoleon: +8 Dex
Work Gloves: 8 Weapon Attack
Asianic Bow: 89 Weapon Attack

53 Million Mesos
What upgrades should I do next for level 70?

Thank you~

[Wind]

4X-50 isn't what I would call "hell levels"

It's actually pretty smooth
Used to be in my time (lol I'm old :( ). But that was two years ago. Maybe three?

[Retalion]

Level 66
White Polyfeather Hat: +2 Str, +4 Dex
Cecelia's Earrings: Clean
Orange Tai: +5 Str +12 Dex
Red Gore Boots: +3 Str +2 Dex
Spielgelmann Necklace: +1 All
Blue Napoleon: +8 Dex
Work Gloves: 8 Weapon Attack
Asianic Bow: 89 Weapon Attack

53 Million Mesos
What upgrades should I do next for level 70?

Thank you~

*continues doing what I do on SW*

At 70, with 53 mill you can probably get a 98-100 atk hinkel so that'd be your best bet. That being said, you also have enough for a z-helm so I'd say get a z-helm now and hope to have enough money for a decent-good hinkel (95-100 atk). Getting a z-helm now means you dont need to put more points into strength to use a hinkel so that's always a plus.

[Luscent]

I'm a Sniper going early AE build, and I've been having a bit of a dilemma with the potion usage, as in it's ridiculous. I still end up making a profit, but is it normal to use 850 Barb Elixirs in 4 hours of training? At level 76 872~1561 is my damage range without a warrior elixir, but that's soon changing as of today with me acquiring my zhelm and 2/5 Facestompers. Will my potion usage start to go down a bit with higher damage? or can I expect to see myself downing 800 potions per 4 hours still?

[Apollo]

I'm a Sniper going early AE build, and I've been having a bit of a dilemma with the potion usage, as in it's ridiculous. I still end up making a profit, but is it normal to use 850 Barb Elixirs in 4 hours of training? At level 76 872~1561 is my damage range without a warrior elixir, but that's soon changing as of today with me acquiring my zhelm and 2/5 Facestompers. Will my potion usage start to go down a bit with higher damage? or can I expect to see myself downing 800 potions per 4 hours still?

It would help if you told us where you're training. But anyways, from my experience, I usually use around 850-1000 Barbs at newties.

I doubt your new equips will make a significant difference in your pot usage because pot consumption is also relying on how well you can use your archer. But like I said, it's difficult to tell without knowing what you're training on.

[Retalion]

It would help if you told us where you're training. But anyways, from my experience, I usually use around 850-1000 Barbs at newties.

I doubt your new equips will make a significant difference in your pot usage because pot consumption is also relying on how well you can use your archer. But like I said, it's difficult to tell without knowing what you're training on.

Im pretty sure he's refering to pirates (as AE first builds cant go newties).

If it helps, when I was 83, I used 200 pizzas and 20-30 barbs in 1 hour, meaning in 4 hours, I'd use 800 pizzas and roughly 100 barbs.

800 x 900 = 72,000
100 x 1500 = 150,000

150,000 + 72,000 = 222,000 hp healed(I think...someone check my math D:)

You're using 850 barbs, which would be

850 x 1500 = 1,275,000 hp healed.

If anything, your pot costs wont go down because you kill faster with better equips, your pot costs will go down because of the 150 wep def from the z-helm. Imagine taking 100 less damage each time you run into or get hit by the physical attack of the pirates. I would further cut down on the damage by using grilled cheese (+20 wep def? or was it 30?). I took A LOT less damage per hit than you so perhaps that would be the reason for the lower pot consumption.

Another factor might be jump AE/ARing. Can you do it? I was often able to avoid many of the pirate's attacks by jump ARinig away from it, so I'd still be hitting monsters, but Im not taking damage. That'll probably help cut down pot costs as well.

Hope that helps.

Off topci: Hi Apollo. I ran into you in game on Kevin's bow master earlier xD

[Luscent]

Yeah I'm training at pirates, sorry for not including that. I can jump shot 100% of the time, but I'm not sure how I should be doing it on this map. Should I be constantly jump shotting? or should I limit it to when they're about to attack me? I can afford the potion costs, and I still make a small profit, but it's pretty ridiculous. Maybe it's just because I'm not used to the training here yet.

[Anyoneisgod]

for pirates here is the Skinny,http://www.southperry.net/forums/showpost.php?p=1292&postcount=1


Lemme know if you find it helpfull?

[Retalion]

Yeah I'm training at pirates, sorry for not including that. I can jump shot 100% of the time, but I'm not sure how I should be doing it on this map. Should I be constantly jump shotting? or should I limit it to when they're about to attack me? I can afford the potion costs, and I still make a small profit, but it's pretty ridiculous. Maybe it's just because I'm not used to the training here yet.

Well, it depends what you mean by jump shotting. If you're stationary jump shotting (just jumping up and down while AEing cause it looks cool) then that's kinda useless. Not only are you lowering your DPS, but you arent avoiding anything or hitting any extra monsters.

What I mean by jump shooting is jumping in various directions left and right. I find that that way, it allows me to not only avoid attacks, but hit more pirates (as Im in a bigger range now).

Yes, you'll be running into them A LOT at pirates. That's normal there. If you want to cut down on pot costs, then there's always the slightly slower "lure and snipe" method where you go across the map AE/ARing and then go onto the sail on the left and just IA the top platform to death, then AE/AR the bottom ones (Rangers can use rain but you're a Sniper so... =/). If you have puppet, you can puppet <<<< and then walk up beside them and AR both ledged (I havent been there in ages and cant remember but I think that's possible?)

psst Colum, you still have to fix up that chart on the rain first graph ;O

[Luscent]

for pirates here is the Skinny,http://www.southperry.net/forums/showpost.php?p=1292&postcount=1


Lemme know if you find it helpfull?

This is the guide I've been using, and I train exactly like it says under the FAQ's at the bottom. I kill them plenty fast, it just seems like I get hit way too often, and luring them to the sail and sniping them cuts the exp gain down way too much.

Like I said, I can afford the training, it just doesn't seem like I'm doing it effectively. So the guide is obviously effective, but AE'ing then grouping six, I end up getting hit too often. How should I effectively jump shot to minimize my damage taken?

[Anyoneisgod]

i never got to use this method. i spent 70-90 with a FP mage in squids/Sharks.Ask Retalion

[Luscent]

i never got to use this method. i spent 70-90 with a FP mage in squids/Sharks.Ask Retalion


Hmm thanks any way. Maybe I'm just complaining too much for no reason, but after seeing the numbers Ret posted, it worries me that I'm just blowing through potions entirely too fast.

[Retalion]

Hmm thanks any way. Maybe I'm just complaining too much for no reason, but after seeing the numbers Ret posted, it worries me that I'm just blowing through potions entirely too fast.

As I said, just jump away from them when they attack you. Touch damage < attack damage. Then again, at 83 with 21 rain, you do do alot more damage than at 76 with what? 11 rain? Being an old school archer who trained my late 7x-early 8x days at zombies and death teddies, the pot cost here was a welcome sight.

And Colum, I'd level that way from 70-90 too if my fire mages didnt keep dying when they were leeching me. It was like 5 minutes of misting at sharks--> brb--> 5 more minutes of misting at sharks--> graveyard-->3 minutes of sharks--> graveyard--> I give up, rofl.

yeah, B> pro fire mages for SE hunting plox

[Apollo]

And Colum, I'd level that way from 70-90 too if my fire mages didnt keep dying when they were leeching me. It was like 5 minutes of misting at sharks--> brb--> 5 more minutes of misting at sharks--> graveyard-->3 minutes of sharks--> graveyard--> I give up, rofl.

yeah, B> pro fire mages for SE hunting plox

lolol I'd go with hunting Pianus if I were you. Get some guildies to go with you.. or find some really nice randoms. That's how I got my SE 20 when they were 100 mil a piece. A random party partied me for my SE 10 and they said I could have the SE 20 that dropped ^_^. I can even go if you find some :D

Off topic: You saw me earlier today? Under what IGN? Might not have been me that you met ;o

[Anyoneisgod]

got my SE 20 from Pianus, took me 4 30 books though

[Retalion]

lolol I'd go with hunting Pianus if I were you. Get some guildies to go with you.. or find some really nice randoms. That's how I got my SE 20 when they were 100 mil a piece. A random party partied me for my SE 10 and they said I could have the SE 20 that dropped ^_^. I can even go if you find some :D

Off topic: You saw me earlier today? Under what IGN? Might not have been me that you met ;o

oh, other people go on your account? ;O I was on DualWings, lol. (I used to be Retalion so I think Ive run into you/partied with you at vikings a looong time ago too).

Im guildless so I cant get guildies to go with me and really, Scania's pianus situation is a bit sticky... I dont want to kill my brain cells over some certain guilds ksing and looting SE 20 off a pianus Im killing or whatnot >_>

[Kevo]

oh, other people go on your account? ;O I was on DualWings, lol. (I used to be Retalion so I think Ive run into you/partied with you at vikings a looong time ago too).

Im guildless so I cant get guildies to go with me and really, Scania's pianus situation is a bit sticky... I dont want to kill my brain cells over some certain guilds ksing and looting SE 20 off a pianus Im killing or whatnot >_>

*omg Jack what evils have you committed on my bm f5*

Pianus is hella hard on a Bowman, and my archer had 4.2k HP at it's prime and I never killed it/witnessed its death. On the other hand, my priest at 9X had no problem at it besides needing 7 dispels to get rid of seal zzzzz. The people in my party laughed themselves into a fit =( ~

[Retalion]

*omg Jack what evils have you committed on my bm f5*

Pianus is hella hard on a Bowman, and my archer had 4.2k HP at it's prime and I never killed it/witnessed its death. On the other hand, my priest at 9X had no problem at it besides needing 7 dispels to get rid of seal zzzzz. The people in my party laughed themselves into a fit =( ~

I swear I didnt do anything! The Apollo guy said hi and I said it wasnt Kevin and that it was his friend Jackk!

And yeah, low level'd priests at fish/clock is hilarious. Spamming dispel... and by the time you dispel, you're sealed again!

As for archers at pianus, Ive never had good experiences there. I remember going from 45% to 0 once when I was 106 on Retalion xD

[Jason]

Added Frequently Asked Questions, and a picture. Not much, but it's getting there.

[Apollo]

I swear I didnt do anything! The Apollo guy said hi and I said it wasnt Kevin and that it was his friend Jackk!

And yeah, low level'd priests at fish/clock is hilarious. Spamming dispel... and by the time you dispel, you're sealed again!

As for archers at pianus, Ive never had good experiences there. I remember going from 45% to 0 once when I was 106 on Retalion xD

I went from 80% to 0 before and that was before SE/4th job came out. I just wanted to kill it since I didn't care about leveling at the time xD

But after 4th job was released, I lost 40% cause I had failure hp

[Retalion]

Just a bit of a comment but the Q&A/FAQ is a bit hard to read. I would suggest perhaps italicizing (sp?) the questions or answers or having a way to differentiate between which one is a question and which is an answer... make the wall of text easier to skim through xD

[Jason]

Just a bit of a comment but the Q&A/FAQ is a bit hard to read. I would suggest perhaps italicizing (sp?) the questions or answers or having a way to differentiate between which one is a question and which is an answer... make the wall of text easier to skim through xD

Oh yeah, definitely, I just did it on Microsoft Word, copied and pasted and such. XD Gonna add color and other things soon enough. :P

[arrowhead]

can someone strip nude (0 wdef) and see how much nest golems do to them? i want to ensure my survival down there. i have 281 wdef and 2812 hp.

[Apollo]

can someone strip nude (0 wdef) and see how much nest golems do to them? i want to ensure my survival down there. i have 281 wdef and 2812 hp.

I have 288 wdef and it does a max damage of 2.6~2.8k magic damage to me. Touch is ~2k. So.. I highly recommend you level a few more times before you take them on.

[Cats]

Mostly because I'm too lazy to research this wherever it's posted someplace:

Whats the minumum MP forumla or bowmen? I'm washing the crap out of my bowmaster and I think I might be nearing my limit and not wanting to waste my new SP on it if I can't yet.

[Apollo]

The min. MP formula is 148+Level*14 base MP

[Retalion]

For Nest Gollems dmg, I'll refer to a post on SW on my "where to train guide":


I'd like to add something to the JrNewtie post:

I have 2.8kHP, and cannot do the bottom yet of Newties without Hyperbody. Newties do ~2.7k damage with a Zakum helmet, but I've seen over 2.9k without. I'm wearing the Maple Helmet, but those using regular archer helms will experience more damage.

Of course, this archer (Hiyochan) has other equips on, which will lead me to assume that the dmg with no def is a bit over 3k max. If I were in Leafre, I'd go check myself but Im in aqua so... yeah =X

[Luscent]

For skills I currently have 21 AE, 5 MB, and 2 Strafe at level 79. When would it be wise for me to move from Pirates to Gobi's? Also, would it be wise to put 6 into Puppet now? or wait until I have 11 Strafe and 1 Blizzard?

[Beaner]

For skills I currently have 21 AE, 5 MB, and 2 Strafe at level 79. When would it be wise for me to move from Pirates to Gobi's? Also, would it be wise to put 6 into Puppet now? or wait until I have 11 Strafe and 1 Blizzard?

id say stick to pirates till your strafe is lv 15 or more. since you are going straight to gobis you dont need puppet yet. 1 Blizzard is enough to hold them in place. i would recomend getting that 6 puppet when you have 20 strafe though since it will make life easier when gobis go and fly away.

anyways id recomend

4 more levels of pirates so you have 21 ae, 5mb, 16 strafe, 1 Blizzard.

go to gobis and keep pumping strafe to 21. by 86 you would have 21 strafe 1 puppet.

87- 2 more in puppet,1 ae
88- 3 puppet.
89-91 max ae, 1 strafe
92-94 max strafe, 1 point.

from hereon id recomend working on Blizzard over puppet or eagle. perhaps a lv 9 puppet if 6 isnt cutting it for you. personally i had lv9 puppet till i had everything else maxed including MB, eagle and lv 21 Blizzard.

[Luscent]

Excellent information, thank you very much. I figured that was the build I should use, but people kept telling me 6 in Puppet was important, even though I feel more damage from Strafe right away would benefit me more. Thank you very much!

[Worthyness]

I wonder... does Sharp Eyes drop from any type of sharks? I want to get a headstart in hunting, despite it being extremely futile because of the extremely low droprate.

Also any tips for speeding up Purple squid training? I can't seem to get any faster than ~8%/hour at level 97... My damage range is 10xx-18xx if that helps any.

Thanks in advance =)

[TugboatWilly]

se 20 drops from cold sharks (the light blue ones).

[Retalion]

I wonder... does Sharp Eyes drop from any type of sharks? I want to get a headstart in hunting, despite it being extremely futile because of the extremely low droprate.

Also any tips for speeding up Purple squid training? I can't seem to get any faster than ~8%/hour at level 97... My damage range is 10xx-18xx if that helps any.

Thanks in advance =)

I always found the black squids faster mainly because I dont spend half the time trying to avoid magic attacks (as they do so little dmg... that being said they add up).

I've always found squids slow for training and would recommend going gobies instead.

As for Sharks, I've heard both reports: Some say it drops from the light blue ones, others from both. Im not sure what I believe but I dont think it matters much. Its not like you wont kill the dark blue sharks if they dont drop SE 20 (afterall, you have to keep up the spawn and whatnot).

[Worthyness]

I always found the black squids faster mainly because I dont spend half the time trying to avoid magic attacks (as they do so little dmg... that being said they add up).

I've always found squids slow for training and would recommend going gobies instead.

As for Sharks, I've heard both reports: Some say it drops from the light blue ones, others from both. Im not sure what I believe but I dont think it matters much. Its not like you wont kill the dark blue sharks if they dont drop SE 20 (afterall, you have to keep up the spawn and whatnot).

Thank you very much sir for your input. The only reason i train at the purple squids is because, i learned to kill them from my cousin (the sniping spots at least) and I don't have any knowledge of how to train at other maps efficiently :excellent:

If anyone has any guides they can refer me please do. I appreciate all the help. Thanks again!

[TugboatWilly]

i've been wondering. how much faster will wind booster make a marksman's strafe?

[Anyoneisgod]

i think it will be 6 APS but im not sure, ill get alex to math that out.

[Worthyness]

Out of curiosity (sorry if this has been asked before and/or is an old question)

What would the 1st 3 points of 4th job go into (assuming you have all the skills)?

And can anyone comment on this skill allocation that i plan on doing:

1 Dragon pluse, 1 expertness, 1 hurricane

no level 1 SE only because i don't like recasting (i believe it has 10 sec active-ness)

Thanks in advance =)

[pruny]

Out of curiosity (sorry if this has been asked before and/or is an old question)

What would the 1st 3 points of 4th job go into (assuming you have all the skills)?

And can anyone comment on this skill allocation that i plan on doing:

1 Dragon pluse, 1 expertness, 1 hurricane

no level 1 SE only because i don't like recasting (i believe it has 10 sec active-ness)

Thanks in advance =)

Doing 1 Dragon Pulse, 1 Bow Expert, and 1 Hurricane might not be a bad idea.
As useful as Sharp Eyes is, it won't get any better until your BE is at a semi-high level.
But by all means, please do get Sharp Eyes ASAP.
The way I went at level 120 is as followed:
2 Sharp Eyes
1 Hurricane

Keep Dragon Pulse at 1 and gradually start raising Bow Expert, Hurricane, and Sharp Eyes.

[Apollo]

Doing 1 Dragon Pulse, 1 Bow Expert, and 1 Hurricane might not be a bad idea.
As useful as Sharp Eyes is, it won't get any better until your BE is at a semi-high level.
But by all means, please do get Sharp Eyes ASAP.
The way I went at level 120 is as followed:
2 Sharp Eyes
1 Hurricane

Keep Dragon Pulse at 1 and gradually start raising Bow Expert, Hurricane, and Sharp Eyes.

Instead of putting 1 to Bow Expert, Sharp eyes is to go. Even level 1 SE gives a huge bonus. 1 to Bow Expert however, not so much.

[Retalion]

Out of curiosity (sorry if this has been asked before and/or is an old question)

What would the 1st 3 points of 4th job go into (assuming you have all the skills)?

And can anyone comment on this skill allocation that i plan on doing:

1 Dragon pluse, 1 expertness, 1 hurricane

no level 1 SE only because i don't like recasting (i believe it has 10 sec active-ness)

Thanks in advance =)


Off topic: Welcome Oruny (another SW archer!) to SouthPerry

On topic: What I acutally did was not advance at 120 (cause I had 1 day of 2x exp left), trained to 90% of 120 and then advanced, so I really had 6 points to start off.

That being said, I did 1 BE (cmon, 5% mastery for 1 point... who can pass on taht?), 1 Hurricane and 1 SE (that I didnt use till I got it to 4 the next level... then again, I trained with a fellow bowmaster who had 9 SE so meh). WHen I leveled, I put 3 points into SE.

DB is a good option but there is something to consider: Can you find a warrior to NPQ with you? I know a lot of bow masters in Scania (the most plentiful, crowded server) that dont have DB because they dont have warrior friends to get them into Nath PQ. I got lucky and had a 120 Pali friend do it with me before she immigrated to Bellocan the next day.

[pruny]

Off topic: Welcome Oruny (another SW archer!) to SouthPerry

On topic: What I acutally did was not advance at 120 (cause I had 1 day of 2x exp left), trained to 90% of 120 and then advanced, so I really had 6 points to start off.

That being said, I did 1 BE (cmon, 5% mastery for 1 point... who can pass on taht?), 1 Hurricane and 1 SoA (that I didnt use till I got it to 4 the next level... then again, I trained with a fellow bowmaster who had 9 SE so meh). WHen I leveled, I put 3 points into SE.

DB is a good option but there is something to consider: Can you find a warrior to NPQ with you? I know a lot of bow masters in Scania (the most plentiful, crowded server) that dont have DB because they dont have warrior friends to get them into Nath PQ. I got lucky and had a 120 Pali friend do it with me before she immigrated to Bellocan the next day.

When you said 1 Hurricane and 1 SoA, did you mean 1 SE? xfd

[Worthyness]

well, i was just planning for the future, but i won't be reaching there anytime soon. I hope i have contacts somewhere in m BL to get me DP xD

My plan was to get the Hurricane, bow expert, and Dp first, then level to get 3 into SE and get to 10 ish (for timer's sake), i doubt i will be able to afford SE 20... so i guess levling faster would be the way for me to go =P

Meh.. i'm a really slow leveler in general, so no 120 in the near future (by next year perhaps xD).

The only thing that really bugs me is the timer for SE, by 121 i will have 3 points into it i can tell you that much =P

[Retalion]

When you said 1 Hurricane and 1 SoA, did you mean 1 SE? xfd

Yes I did xP Thanks for pointing it out. Fix'd xD

[Beaner]

14 dex dark wing boots, any ideas on prices for those, server non important, its useful as an aproximate

[Derimed]

14 dex dark wing boots, any ideas on prices for those, server non important, its useful as an aproximate

Are you buying or selling?

If buying, you may be better off looking for Facestompers. If I understand correctly 2 att = roughly 14 Dex, and you might squeeze more Dex out of them with Jump 60s.

Sorry if I misunderstood you.

[Beaner]

selling them

[Luscent]

Can anyone offer any Gobi killing advice for an 8x Sniper? Should I be Blizzing them as they spawn? What is the most efficient method to killing them?

[Anyoneisgod]

Can anyone offer any Gobi killing advice for an 8x Sniper? Should I be Blizzing them as they spawn? What is the most efficient method to killing them?

i would, i used bom to grab em and that has the downside of stunning. Freeze is so much better there its not even funny but still i would blizz rain rain rain and so on.

[JoeTang]

Puppet them immediately after they spawn and then Blizzard and Arrow Eruption them before they fall too low. When they unfreeze, back off as they approach your Puppet and re-freeze. It'd be helpful to have a longer Blizzard though since 1 second is a very short time and you have to reshoot often. Depending on how much HP they have left and how much damage you do, you can not freeze them and just Arrow Eruption them until they die, or freeze them less.

[Trinity]

How great would an 8 att wg affect a bowmen

(im looking for a priority awnser)

[KaidaTan]

How great would an 8 att wg affect a bowmen

(im looking for a priority awnser)

It depends on what you have, honestly. If you have a 5 attack or less WG, an 8 attack WG would be a massive priority. Considering you don't seem to be terribly rich, I'd skip on Pink Adventurer Capes for now and get a simple 5-8 dex Icarus (2) or something. You're almost 50, so when you get there, be sure to get an overall and 100% it for dex. Wear the highest level shoes you can and don't bother scrolling them for anything except speed (if you can spare the money). Don't worry about earrings at all.

The things you should concentrate on are your Helm and weapon. There's no need to spend a ton of money on a level 50 bow, but buying a somewhat decent pre-scrolled one or buying an above average clean one and scrolling it for 100%'s should be the first thing you do every 10 levels until around 80. At your level, probably the most beneficial thing you could buy is a Zakum Helm. I don't know how much they cost on Bellocan, but I would suggest getting that now if you can afford it. You can work on getting good gloves after getting a zhelm.

At your level, 30 stats should help your damage by as much, if not more than 8 attack gloves. Also, the extra 150 defense will actually save you quite a bit in pot costs at that level. But if you don't have any attack gloves at all, perhaps you should buy 5 attacks or something to tide you over while you wait.

[Luscent]

Puppet them immediately after they spawn and then Blizzard and Arrow Eruption them before they fall too low. When they unfreeze, back off as they approach your Puppet and re-freeze. It'd be helpful to have a longer Blizzard though since 1 second is a very short time and you have to reshoot often. Depending on how much HP they have left and how much damage you do, you can not freeze them and just Arrow Eruption them until they die, or freeze them less.

After getting the hang out of it, I feel Puppet is grossly unnecessary. As soon as the house dies I now just walk forward, blizzard, then AE. Once they get too far away I just blizzard again, but generally I only need to do that once. Thank you though.

[JoeTang]

Puppet does eventually become unnecessary, but I assumed you were just getting started with Gobies.

[Retalion]

Puppet does eventually become unnecessary, but I assumed you were just getting started with Gobies.

Puppet can be considered "uneccessary" but it helps in many cases, especially for bowmasters, with their high flinching abilities with SoA.

At bosses, puppet can be used to "neutralize" boss attacks by having puppet at one end of the map and using SoA to push the boss to the other. The ones Im immeadiately thinking about is pap, manon and griffey and Ive seen someone use it at right pianus (when they didnt have enough hp) too.

In terms of regular training, its not used often, but there are many other skills that arent used often too so I guess its a pick and choose thing.

Edit: To elaborate, this is coming from a person who got an archer with 5 puppet on Tespia and found bosses like manon and griffey immensely annoying.

[Luscent]

Puppet does eventually become unnecessary, but I assumed you were just getting started with Gobies.

I've been to Gobi's before on my old Ranger, but I was wondering if using Blizzard was more beneficial to training now that I had it. Just wondering if things changed a bit for a Sniper I suppose.

[Anyoneisgod]

I for one love puppet,i use it all the time at peak.

[Apollo]

I've only got puppet to work on pianus on my first casting. After that, it doesn't seem to work anymore despite putting it on the most-opposite side of the map. Anyone know why?

[SoulQuincy]

how can i figure out how many times i can wash?
is there a formula of some sort?

ive been wearing +50 int(5 mp) clothes since lvl 98~105
at lvl 100 i took a ss so i didnt wear the int clothes and at lvl 103 i forgot :f3:

[Anyoneisgod]

The min. MP formula is 148+Level*14 base MP

Thar you go.

[B0WJOB]

I for one love puppet,i use it all the time at peak.

Hurricane + Hawk + Puppet + SE @ Newties

I love Bowmaster.



I've only got puppet to work on pianus on my first casting. After that, it doesn't seem to work anymore despite putting it on the most-opposite side of the map. Anyone know why?

wereyou soloing Pianus?

Puppet: you aggro monsters, cast a puppet and they shift attention to it.

IF you were in a party, your other party members' attack would cancel your aggro which made your puppet not working.


If you were soloing, then I have no idea. I hate that obese fish.

[Kranzorbaken]

I put 20 points into mastery by accident it really doent matter right all it means is one less point in to focus near the end right?

[Beaner]

you need the 20 mastery for 4th job mastery. and you still get to max focus with maxed mastery if you are fa less


I put 20 points into mastery by accident it really doent matter right all it means is one less point in to focus near the end right?

[Luscent]

I put 20 points into mastery by accident it really doent matter right all it means is one less point in to focus near the end right?

You should be able to max Focus at the end of your second job regardless, you are fine by putting that last point in Mastery as it is necessary.

[Kranzorbaken]

Oh ok cool awesomeness and yeah im fa~less.
tyvm~~

[Luscent]

So after looking at my skills for a while I couldn't help but wonder what I should be putting my points into after maxing AE, Strafe, MB, and getting Blizzard to 21. I've heard level 1 Frostprey removes the use of Eagle, is this true? If so should I just be getting Eagle to level 15 and pumping Thrust and Puppet? Basically what should my final third job skill build look like?

[Valarius]

I've been to Gobi's before on my old Ranger, but I was wondering if using Blizzard was more beneficial to training now that I had it. Just wondering if things changed a bit for a Sniper I suppose.

I find blizzard makes puppet completely useless. Just me though.

[Luscent]

I find blizzard makes puppet completely useless. Just me though.

Now that I got the hang of Blizzard I don't see the point of Puppet for myself really. I think I'm foregoing putting 6 points in it and just getting an early 21 Blizzard to be honest.

[Valarius]

Now that I got the hang of Blizzard I don't see the point of Puppet for myself really. I think I'm foregoing putting 6 points in it and just getting an early 21 Blizzard to be honest.

I've been considering 21 blizzard early, as I use blizzard constantly .. almost as much as strafe.

[Beaner]

Now that I got the hang of Blizzard I don't see the point of Puppet for myself really. I think I'm foregoing putting 6 points in it and just getting an early 21 Blizzard to be honest.

puppet has its uses. i really think lv 6 is good and should get it before putting points into blizzard. more than 1 that is. but it ll depends on how you play. still if you ever mess up with blizzard at gobys, it helps get them off your face and kil them easy. your choice though

[Katie]

Ok. A couple of questions....

1) Last year I quit my lvl 82 Ranger to make a Priest, I have screwed up stats (the bowman was my first char almost 2 years ago and had NO clue what I was doing) like 12 INT and 8 LUK, and on target with my dex and str. So I guess is it worth continuing? I don't want to buy resets for it because I don't know if I'm going to continue to play it really. My SP are screwed up as well because with me not knowing anything about bowman, I just kinda added points where ever. And when I started I didn't know anyone, and when I asked, people were complete douche bags

2) It has a shitty red arund and no equips, what would be some good equips to buy?

[Retalion]

Ok. A couple of questions....

1) Last year I quit my lvl 82 Ranger to make a Priest, I have screwed up stats (the bowman was my first char almost 2 years ago and had NO clue what I was doing) like 12 INT and 8 LUK, and on target with my dex and str. So I guess is it worth continuing? I don't want to buy resets for it because I don't know if I'm going to continue to play it really. My SP are screwed up as well because with me not knowing anything about bowman, I just kinda added points where ever. And when I started I didn't know anyone, and when I asked, people were complete douche bags

2) It has a shitty red arund and no equips, what would be some good equips to buy?

Is it worth continuing? THat's your call. However, consider this: Your archer will be 2.5 levels weaker (due to 12 less AP into dex) than archers with the same equip. If you're one of those nx people with tonnes of 2x cards, I'd say 8x is easily reachable in weeks (especially if you have a high level'd char to help train it). Then again, if you like training at a slow, languid pace, there's nothing wrong with continuing it.

As for what to buy, you can find out from my Where to buy thread that's a link or two below this (Just look in the "2nd list" which has items at reasonable prices. That should be good enough at least for now unless you're uber funded).

Hope this helps.

[Worthyness]

Anyone have a guide they can recommend to me so i can try to gobi? =P

-is a failure at training efficiently and quickly, but still enjoys grinding for some reason-

[Retalion]

Anyone have a guide they can recommend to me so i can try to gobi? =P

-is a failure at training efficiently and quickly, but still enjoys grinding for some reason-

http://sleepywood.net/forum/showthread.php?t=1058362

Only thing I remember from the guide that's inaccurate is that bone fish do 1.8k dmg, not 2.8k.

[Katie]

Does anyone have a bowman guide for where to put all points? Not just 3rd job ones?

[Worthyness]

Do we have an approximation on average prices of 4th job mastery books?

out of curiosity...

to above...
http://www.basilmarket.com/forum/438031/0//Archer_Skill_Build_Guide.html#

[Beaner]

Do we have an approximation on average prices of 4th job mastery books?

out of curiosity...

to above...
http://www.basilmarket.com/forum/438031/0//Archer_Skill_Build_Guide.html#

book prices depend heavily on your server.

i could give you windia prices but, but they prob are no where close to scanias

[Retalion]

book prices depend heavily on your server.

i could give you windia prices but, but they prob are no where close to scanias

Yeah, our SE 20 is 150 mill and our SE 30 is close to 100 mill. I bet its probably half that in Windia xD

[KaidaTan]

Actually, it's pretty much the same. There's some jackass buying and monopolizing them all.

[Retalion]

Actually, it's pretty much the same. There's some jackass buying and monopolizing them all.

Oh really? cause I remember hearing on buddy that the SE 30's in Bera or some server were REALLY cheap and that someone in Scania could immigrate over, buy em out and move back and make tonnes of profit.

[Kevvl]

In Bera it's like 5 mil, but some people have been selling them as high as 20.

[Cybuster]

Is the commonly used Ranger build to max everything but Inferno now?

Or is it worth putting extra points into Inferno now?

[Retalion]

Is the commonly used Ranger build to max everything but Inferno now?

Or is it worth putting extra points into Inferno now?

I'd say the 21/22 inferno is standard? (Not sure). I'd say thrust isnt worth getting so there's nothing else but inferno.

That's the general build I see out there. The other one is 21 hawk and max inferno.

[Cybuster]

Inferno doesn't have much real use in training, apart from being a non-stunning mob attack though, right?

Archers don't really train on anything fire weak, do they? Unless there is something in Leafre that I haven't researched or something.

[Worthyness]

any of you have tips for a high 9x ranger to survive ergoth of the guild quest?

Also anyone have a guide for the Guild quest.. I have a feeling i will be doing more soon and i would like to learn how to do this...

[Kevvl]

If you have HyperBody, you should be fine. Ergoth is cake (Me and 2 other Guildies Triod it when we were all level 9x. Only took 20 minutes :f3:)

As for a guide? I think Hidden Street has an OK one. All guilds tend to do stage 1 different though.

Also, I'd say 21 Inferno is standard, but 1 Inferno is pretty close as far as popularity.
Personally, I'd sooner get 11 Blizzard than get less then 21 Inferno. It may be weaker than AR, but it's a Ranger's final distance mob skill, and it outdamages Hurricane on 5+ monsters (When Both are Maxed, with any level of SE)

[Retalion]

Inferno doesn't have much real use in training, apart from being a non-stunning mob attack though, right?

Archers don't really train on anything fire weak, do they? Unless there is something in Leafre that I haven't researched or something.

I would say a more accurate statement is that Inferno doesnt have much real use in training Right now. With the NLC expansion just beyond the horizon and the constant mention of thiinking outside the box, I wouldnt be surprised if more elemental mobs worthy of training on are released, making the skill more useful. THen again, I could be wrong and we'd be back to talking about how much it sucks. You cant lose by "playing safe" and getting the skill. THat's just my look on it.

[Kevvl]

You could always do what I plan to on my soon to be Ranger, and not-max-Strafe.

Or, use SP resets and dump Strafe into Inferno when such maps arrive.

[Kranzorbaken]

Okay so tody i got an 8 str cape and i was wondering if i had my end-game bow as an arund which needs 85 str right? im trying to figure out if ideally i should keep my str cape to help me cap my str earlier or will i switch to a dex cape. Or does it make a difference.
Like say i have my 1 str pendant 8 str cape and 15str zhelm
thats 24 str
so 85-24 is 61 str. now that seems a bit low to me but then again im thinking it seems right cause if down the line i do switch to a dex cape yes i will need 8 more str.
So if so where would i get that 8 more str.

Any help would be greatly appreciiated if you indeed get what im asking lol.

[Kevvl]

A lower base Str is almost always better. If your current cape is a PAC, then stick to it. Otherwise, buy a Str PAC, or add Dex to get one. Alternatively, you can use a Dex Cape, and get Str Overalls. (Not scrolled for str, but just ones with high Base Str)

[Retalion]

Okay so tody i got an 8 str cape and i was wondering if i had my end-game bow as an arund which needs 85 str right? im trying to figure out if ideally i should keep my str cape to help me cap my str earlier or will i switch to a dex cape. Or does it make a difference.
Like say i have my 1 str pendant 8 str cape and 15str zhelm
thats 24 str
so 85-24 is 61 str. now that seems a bit low to me but then again im thinking it seems right cause if down the line i do switch to a dex cape yes i will need 8 more str.
So if so where would i get that 8 more str.

Any help would be greatly appreciiated if you indeed get what im asking lol.

Im in a dilema (somewhat) with my strength atm. Let me just say that I set my strength before many of the current equips were out so I had left myself at 65 base str (4 from shoes, 14 from helm, 2 from overall), leaving me exactly at 85. However, now there's MW, pendants (even spiegelman adds 2) and other things out there that get me over my strength, but not enough to get to 95 to use a metus but not enough to trade my str shoes for face stompers. A str cape is a good way to cap your strength for later equips in my opinion though you could use it forever too. It'll probably save you AP resets down the road.

[Kranzorbaken]

Sadly its only a raggedy cape but its 8 str nonetheless. But i have no doubt that i will be able to get a 8+ str pac down the line. I might even cap at 60 cause 2 str speiglemanns arent hard to find.

[Worthyness]

I kinda have high strength and i'm too poor to use ap resets =0

I have 95 ish WITHOUT equips...I have around 12x with all my equips on (7 str overall, 2 str necklace, 15 str helmet, 2 str shoes, 6 or 7 str cape)...

I guess i could always use the 120 bow if they ever come out xD

I don't know... I guess i'm fine the ways my equips go...

One question tho... My necklace i tried scrolling got 30 hp/mp only and i have no more slots... would it be worth trying to get another necklace with 2 strength and rescroll (I have a CPQ mule) or keep this one until i massively cpq on my pirate?

[Kevvl]

Well, I prefer as much HP as I can get, but that's up to you whether you want the extra HP or not =P


If you buy a 2/1/1/1, (or even 2/2) and scroll it, it could turn out better =P

[SoulQuincy]

at lvl 120 on average how many times can u wash?

is it true u have to be lvl 170 to survive horntail?

and how many people have done the "blood build" made by truemark

i ask alot about hp because i wanna horntail as soon as possible
around 140~150 if i can

[Beaner]

at lvl 120 on average how many times can u wash?

is it true u have to be lvl 170 to survive horntail?

and how many people have done the "blood build" made by truemark

i ask alot about hp because i wanna horntail as soon as possible
around 140~150 if i can

lv doesnt matter, hp does. you need 4850 total hp to ht safely.

the first 3mm in windia wiht pendant and a few bowmasters did it to some extent, including myself. it is very useful if you cant afford to wash or start too late and dont want to wait till 170 to ht.

if you hp wash and use int gear from lv50ish or so you could have enough hp as low as 12x, just requires a lot of mesos and real money.

[Kevvl]

If you wanna HT that early, you might wanna be a Xbloodmaster. Personally I'm adding a total of 50 points from 100~105 (So I can Bottom at Newties) and 115~120 (So I can solo Manon and Griffey)

You need to be level 170 to survive HT without HP washing. Even then you wouldn't be able to survive the legs (Which Truemark does with a few HP equips at level 14x)

[Worthyness]

I'm still debating on blood builds. I wanna see how dedicated i am to this game before deciding that xD

Any ways... at what level would Inferno beat out arrow bomb on mobs of 4-6? Not including the stun factor, just raw damage.

And also, for end of 3rd job builds would 29 hawk, and 22 inferno be good to end with?

Maxed everything else, except thrust.

[SoulQuincy]

If you wanna HT that early, you might wanna be a Xbloodmaster. Personally I'm adding a total of 50 points from 100~105 (So I can Bottom at Newties) and 115~120 (So I can solo Manon and Griffey)

You need to be level 170 to survive HT without HP washing. Even then you wouldn't be able to survive the legs (Which Truemark does with a few HP equips at level 14x)

does it matter wen u put 50 points into hp?
like does it effect how much hp u get?
or does it add th same amount?

[Beaner]

does it matter wen u put 50 points into hp?
like does it effect how much hp u get?
or does it add th same amount?

you will be 10 lvs weaker than someone with the sames equips and same lv as you. you get between 16-21 hp per point.

check my post on the prev page that answered your questions before it might help you a lil

[Kevvl]

I'm still debating on blood builds. I wanna see how dedicated i am to this game before deciding that xD

Any ways... at what level would Inferno beat out arrow bomb on mobs of 4-6? Not including the stun factor, just raw damage.

And also, for end of 3rd job builds would 29 hawk, and 22 inferno be good to end with?

Maxed everything else, except thrust.

Well, Inferno is the most useful for specific things at 3 main levels.
If you don't want it, leave it at level 1 (Clearly not the case for you)
If you want it as a luring tool, level 16 (Range increases at level 16)
If you want it for damage, ideal is 25+ (Or maxed), although 21/22 still seems the most common these days (Since it's the most convenient)

You could always get a tad less hawk (27 or 25 hawk and 24/27 Inferno), or leave it at 22. Depending on whatever Masteria has in store, and how the mobs are when GMS gets Time Temple, it won't make much of a difference.

[Worthyness]

Thanks person above me ^^

Now onto HP weakness... If i were to use Trumark's bloodmaster build, but spread those 50 points of Hp into seprate levels (i.e. +4 dex,+1 hp /level) starting now (98 at the moment), would that hinder my training from now until 120?

or would it be betteer to place points according to the guide +5 hp from 130-139?

The reason i ask is because My characters are not rich in general, mesos and nx wise, so that would mean I'd have to solo many bosses to get my 4th job skills.

Edit: And for the full usefulness of this blood build, what pots would you be using? 0_o

Or at what points are the NLC percentage pots worth using over barbarian elixers?

[Kevvl]

Well, if you do it like I am, which allows you to train at new places earlier, It'll actually HELP you.

At 103, I'll have enough HP to Bottom at Newts (102 if I wear my 90/90 Necklace, but I got a friend borrowing that for now)
By 120, I'll be able to Skele, as well as solo Griffey and Manon (Although I plan to take a break from Leafre and head to Gobies)

Although, adding into HP after 4th job, you'll notice the damage decrease less, and it won't affect your % per hour as much.

[Technolink]

Kev, how much HP for bottom?

Either way right now I can bottom effectively completely relying on bliz, eventually I'll be able to keep most of the burden on eagle as well.

Its better exp then middle and i've only died 2 times getting used to it. But I still can't party due to level.

[Kevvl]

Without a Helm, I take 2.85k max, although I'll be going down there when I have 2.9 at the very least, which I should have in 2-3 levels of HP washing (Currently 2650 with that Necklace, assuming about 18 HP per AP, 3 levels at the max)

*edit* I got a Pig Headband if my HP is still too low at level 102 =P

[Worthyness]

Would it be more beneficial to start the blood build earlier when it's easier to level?

Or would that severely hinder my damage?

Just curious, cause I'm quickly approaching the 100's now... I hope to get as much info as needed in order to make my ranger a decent character that i can explore the maple world with =P

[Retalion]

Would it be more beneficial to start the blood build earlier when it's easier to level?

Or would that severely hinder my damage?

Just curious, cause I'm quickly approaching the 100's now... I hope to get as much info as needed in order to make my ranger a decent character that i can explore the maple world with =P

There's nowhere you train that needs you to have more hp at these "lower levels" up till transformed newties and skeles, which you wont be training on till 10x/11x so washing earlier would be somewhat wasted (as that's your goal for washing: those two training spots).

The later you wash, the less damage you lose out on as the higher you get, the more dex it takes to make up 1 weap atk, meaning essentially you're losing less wep atk per point you put into hp.

[Calvinist]

Can Markmen kill a monster with snipe with defence up active? Like when bonefish use that skill that makes all physical attacks only 1 damage, can a markman's snipe still kill it in one hit?

[Truemark]

Can Markmen kill a monster with snipe with defence up active? Like when bonefish use that skill that makes all physical attacks only 1 damage, can a markman's snipe still kill it in one hit?

Yes. Same with defensed up goby houses.

Guess I need to rewrite the BloodMaster build post for here, especially now that I have put it to a lot of practical use.

[Technolink]

Without a Helm, I take 2.85k max, although I'll be going down there when I have 2.9 at the very least, which I should have in 2-3 levels of HP washing (Currently 2650 with that Necklace, assuming about 18 HP per AP, 3 levels at the max)

*edit* I got a Pig Headband if my HP is still too low at level 102 =P

Well I do have a helm, and I'm just starting my new pendent scrolling.

I bought a 2 dex before but failed first 2 slots, so i just bought a new 2 dex and first scroll should be coming later tomorrow.

[Russt]

Overall STR scrolls. When did they come out? I seem to have missed it.

30%'s seem to be around 3m now in Scania, making them already the cheapest overall scroll by quite a bit. I figure since warriors don't want them (DEX scrolls give extra Accuracy too), that only leaves archers and STR-dits, which is a fairly small population, %-wise. So the demand for them should be small.

Will they drop further, by how much, and will it be worth it? How does this affect the scrolling order? Will this create a new rush of "true" low-STR bowmen (other than the oddball top/bottom types)?

I'm in Khaini, btw, where these scrolls haven't quite found their way into commonplace-dom yet.

If they get cheap enough eventually, I'ma go grab myself a nice STR overall...

[Kranzorbaken]

Hehe i already am prepared for this "low str rush" a.k.a im working on mine...well maybe low str depends on what you consider low str.

[Kevvl]

30's 70's and 60's I've seen. All extremely cheap, even though they're new. Expect Low Str Archers to become as common as Low dex Sins (In comparsion to their reg-dex counterparts, of course, seeing as the population difference of the 2 is great)


Prices fluctuate, and they are still new/rare, but I've seen 70's for 4~8 mil, and 30's for 5~10 mil (Not seen any 60's myself). Expect it to drop massively...

...Until Pirates come, and everyone makes a low Str Pirate using the Sin mentality.

[Russt]

Hosht, pirates. Forgot about those.

R.I.P. scroll prices for STR/DEX

[Technolink]

*gets end-game overall, shoe, and cape*

Man, my end game stuff sucks, lol

[TugboatWilly]

b> some overall scrolling luck before pirates rape overall dex prices :f4:

[Kevvl]

Heh. I estimate it'll go like this:
1) Overall Str scrolls get more common
2) Prices begin to drop
3) Pirates are released
4) Prices begin to rise
5) Overall Str Scrolls become impossible to find





17) Pirates stop being bandwagoned
18) Prices begin to drop again

[Technolink]

More like 60)


If you look way back in MS history, you'll find that the true bandwagon trends (none of this 4th job stuff, cause none of the bandwagoners get there) last between 6 months and a year.

The first DK wave is a great example, when 3rd job came out DKs weren't all that loved, but for some reason they SPIKED in popularity almost up to intro of KFT.

Similiarly, Dexless sins are currently quite a large bandwagon, and that's been going on for at least 3 or 4 months now.

But releasing a whole nother job! That's gonna take at least a year to clear the air.

I think its going to take a LONG time for pirates to fall into the normal slew of classes. Of active characters they are going to be shot up to at least 35%, but I doubt they'd fall below 30 for quite awhile.

[Februrary]

Alrighty. Two questions. Does this seem impossible?

50-52- 1 Day
52-54- 1 Day
54-70 1 Level per day? Without 2xp?

Secondly.

To achieve this goal I need my exact training spots.

50-60: Mix of Zombies and STDS. When attempting STDS and their packed, Lanterns will be my back up.
60-65: Kappas/STD
65-70: Voodoo/Hoodoos and Fog. Mostly fog.

Somewhat funded Crossbowman. Working on IA right now.

Thanks in Advance~

[Kevvl]

You'd need to train hard, but it would be possible. How much do you plan to be able to play daily?

[Beaner]

how many hours of that day are dedicated for training? seems doable since i did 1 lv a day 50-60 back in the day of lusters and 1x

[Kevvl]

I managed about that with good old OPQ (Full OPQ)

[Februrary]

Hm. I'm able to play as long as I want after work.. So yeah. Anywhere from 3-9 hours?

Also, How do those training spots sound?

[Retalion]

Hm. I'm able to play as long as I want after work.. So yeah. Anywhere from 3-9 hours?

Also, How do those training spots sound?

definitely possible and the spots look good. I'd probably stay at STDs till 70 though. Then again, I dont know how your server works, but in mine, voodoo/hoodoos are always full and if you're 2nd job, you get ksed a lot here =X

[Kevvl]

He's bera, it's about the same =/

[Februrary]

definitely possible and the spots look good. I'd probably stay at STDs till 70 though. Then again, I dont know how your server works, but in mine, voodoo/hoodoos are always full and if you're 2nd job, you get ksed a lot here =X

You suggest STDS? That does seem like a possibility. I definitely want to try Kappas. I'm afraid of FoG and Voodoos. In bera its somewhat easy to obtain a STD map.

Doesn't STDS become awfully slow?

[KaidaTan]

You suggest STDS? That does seem like a possibility. I definitely want to try Kappas. I'm afraid of FoG and Voodoos. In bera its somewhat easy to obtain a STD map.

Doesn't STDS become awfully slow?

Definitely STDs until 70. Then you can follow Cactrot's AR build here (http://www.southperry.net/forums/showthread.php?t=108) or simply go Strafe first and stay at squids from 70-80. STDs doesn't get slow until somewhere in 7x, actually.

By the way, stop typing in bold. It's annoying.

[Februrary]

Definitely STDs until 70. Then you can follow Cactrot's AR build here (http://www.southperry.net/forums/showthread.php?t=108) or simply go Strafe first and stay at squids from 70-80. STDs doesn't get slow until somewhere in 7x, actually.

By the way, stop typing in bold. It's annoying.

Alright. I guess its going to be STDs. After reviewing Bowj0bs calculation thread. Also sorry about the bold, Its just a habit. I'll find something else to use soon.

[Retalion]

Alright. I guess its going to be STDs. After reviewing Bowj0bs calculation thread. Also sorry about the bold, Its just a habit. I'll find something else to use soon.


In my experience, Kappa exp is similar if not worse than STD exp (for me anyways) and also requires more pots as it has an unavoidable attack (not sure if its magic or weapon). I only went here when STDs were full (then again, other than a 104/3 hinkel, I had no decent equips so perhaps it'd be good exp if you can consistently 2hko?). That's just my take on it anyways.

[Valarius]

I don't suggest Kappas. My pot burn was high there.

STDs is a good choice.

[Kevvl]

Kappas remind me of Gryphons or WS's. Generally high pot burn, but really good drops. (No longer the case for Gryphs)

But there's ALOT of pot burn.

[Russt]

What do Kappas drop that are worth anything.?
I'd compare it instead to a lower level Himes, and that's interesting in a way since they're right next door to each other.
I prefer them over Dummies, mainly because the Dummies' slow moving speed ticks me off for some reason -_- you'd think it's a bit counter-intuitive, but I prefer monsters that can mob to me while knocking me back just enough to not get run over, rather than just stand there bouncing up and down.
But I like Lusters better than either of them o_O

[Retalion]

What do Kappas drop that are worth anything.?
I'd compare it instead to a lower level Himes, and that's interesting in a way since they're right next door to each other.
I prefer them over Dummies, mainly because the Dummies' slow moving speed ticks me off for some reason -_- you'd think it's a bit counter-intuitive, but I prefer monsters that can mob to me while knocking me back just enough to not get run over, rather than just stand there bouncing up and down.
But I like Lusters better than either of them o_O

The newly designed luster map is more trainable on though I dont think anyone trains there anymore. In terms of climbing/travelling, its still more work than the flat maps such as STDs and Kappas

I dont have kappas drops in front of me right now but I remember them dropping oriental helms, thorns, the lvl 60 2h axe (its geen.. .cant remember the name) and 60% bow scrolls. Nothing super godly but they have some decent npc value.

[Kevvl]

They also drop 30% Overall Luck, and 30% Overall Int.

[Worthyness]

What's a good time to start using hawk for training in general?

I don't care what places i can use it at, but i want to know what level it would be worth a summoning rock every time it disappears (to use a stun factor)

Thanks in advance =)

[Beaner]

What's a good time to start using hawk for training in general?

I don't care what places i can use it at, but i want to know what level it would be worth a summoning rock every time it disappears (to use a stun factor)

Thanks in advance =)

id say lv 15 to 21, whenever you feel its good enough for you. personally i never felt it was worth it till 21, but not everyone agrees

[Retalion]

What's a good time to start using hawk for training in general?

I don't care what places i can use it at, but i want to know what level it would be worth a summoning rock every time it disappears (to use a stun factor)

Thanks in advance =)

I dont know about everyone else but I'd say the 80% stun would be a pretty decent time to start using it (which would be level 11).

The matter of stunning isnt just about the first stun but about the stun AFTER that (if you cant kill it in the time between one stun and the next) as after it unstuns, the monster is aggro'd towards you leading it to attack (which is the purpose of hawk: to have it not attack you).

At level 1 (50% stun), sure you have a 1/2 chance of stunning something, but you also have a 1/2 chance of UNSTUNNING it the next time around.

80% might be a bit early for some but at level 16 with 90% stun, its DEFINITELY useable.

[Technolink]

90% is fine, that's 81% chance of a double, 73% chance of a triple. That's enough for 9 strafes, which should be enough to kill anything.

[sumtingverywong]

just wondering, i heard in tespia that mortal blow was pushed up to 90% activation. is this true because on the skill book it still says the original information.

[Beaner]

the skill info didnt change, but the skills changed. mb is 90%, snipe is 10 sec cooldown and berserk is 45% hp.

[Luscent]

So I kind of hit a wall in my motivation today. Heres the deal, I love my class, I love being a Sniper, I love everything about us.

The problem? In Khaini it is currently impossible to find any clean Casa's or Ravens. Whenever one is put up it sells immediately. Along with this the price of scrolls has skyrocketed. They've gone up about 2 mil in less than a week.

I'm having trouble staying motivated because it's impossible for me to find the equips that I need. Not because I can't afford them, but because they just aren't in the market. It's almost making me want to start a Bandit.

Any advice?

[Kevvl]

Level 101 with a 106 Casa. You could always just do what I do and buy a cheap crappy weapon =)

Haven't had a weapon above +13 in my life, and actually been able to use it. (Got a 95 Gold Crow after I hit 80 though)

[Retalion]

So I kind of hit a wall in my motivation today. Heres the deal, I love my class, I love being a Sniper, I love everything about us.

The problem? In Khaini it is currently impossible to find any clean Casa's or Ravens. Whenever one is put up it sells immediately. Along with this the price of scrolls has skyrocketed. They've gone up about 2 mil in less than a week.

I'm having trouble staying motivated because it's impossible for me to find the equips that I need. Not because I can't afford them, but because they just aren't in the market. It's almost making me want to start a Bandit.

Any advice?

Well, there's not much you can do. Just be patient and hope you get lucky and see one before whoever is mass scrolling does =X Just think to yourself and level more, going "if I level more, when I find that good crossbow, I'll be even more stronger than if I got it now!"

[Beaner]

12x weps or bust thats what i say.

but really, just save scrolls and slowly collect weapons, when you have 10-15 bows at about 40-50 scrolls have fun. my first mass scrolling too k me about 3 months to collect all the items, they all failed, and then i saved up for 4 more months and finally scrolled a decent wep. (115 casa) that was from lvs 120-15x. just keep going and never give up

[Aeosyn]

Just another kick to bowmen that you can't buy/sell bows/xbows in the MTS :f3:

That would help people in your situation :(

I agree with XBish though, slowly collect and then mass scroll...don't give up and good luck :D

[Worthyness]

Would it be better for me to level hawk to 21 and then start on something else like puppet?
Or would it be better for me to get hawk to 29 and then work on others?

Off topic: Gratz to Dolob on first level 200 archer =P

[Retalion]

Would it be better for me to level hawk to 21 and then start on something else like puppet?
Or would it be better for me to get hawk to 29 and then work on others?

Off topic: Gratz to Dolob on first level 200 archer =P


Depends where you train. Doing middle of jnewties, you will NEVER need puppet. In that case, get hawk to 29. 21 hawk is good enough for most (95% stun) and working on puppet wont hurt. THat being said, if you're training in areas where puppet is of no use, you might as well get hawk first and then go back to puppet.

[Celsious]

:x Do we really live at newties till 200? F4

[Beaner]

:x Do we really live at newties till 200? F4

as soon as you can take a hit from skeles you can go there. since i was 150 when 4th came out i never really been to newtys other than sporadically, but i must say if you go all out at newtys the exp is close the skeles with a much higher pot cost.

you need about 3.5k hp for skeles btw.

[Celsious]

as soon as you can take a hit from skeles you can go there. since i was 150 when 4th came out i never really been to newtys other than sporadically, but i must say if you go all out at newtys the exp is close the skeles with a much higher pot cost.

you need about 3.5k hp for skeles btw.

I was thinking we could skele and all, it's just the pot input would be more + I've heard from a friend that he gets about .50% more per hour at Newts. He's about a16x BM.

[Itay]

but i must say if you go all out at newtys the exp is close the skeles with a much higher pot cost.

How exactly does newtie burn more pot than Skele? If I didnt read wrong that is.

Edit; Skele with bishop will not match to any exp in GMS. Not even close to newtie, Sadly.

[Beaner]

How exactly does newtie burn more pot than Skele? If I didnt read wrong that is.

Edit; Skele with bishop will not match to any exp in GMS. Not even close to newtie, Sadly.


newtys cost a lot more mesos if you actually go all out and kill the whole lane istea dof sniping 2-3 newtys. you would stand in the middle of the lane and kill >> and << while pretty much getting hit constantly. sniping is fine if you are 130 or lower but for higer levels you want to kill every newty for the best exp.

i am not sure what your second statement means, but i figure it means that the exp at skeles with a bishop is the best possible, that is true.

[Retalion]

newtys cost a lot more mesos if you actually go all out and kill the whole lane istea dof sniping 2-3 newtys. you would stand in the middle of the lane and kill >> and << while pretty much getting hit constantly. sniping is fine if you are 130 or lower but for higer levels you want to kill every newty for the best exp.

i am not sure what your second statement means, but i figure it means that the exp at skeles with a bishop is the best possible, that is true.

I personally find skeles burn fewer pots just because their attacks arent auto-target. I can dodge most skele attacks but I cant dodge the transformed newtie ones (least not very well). Also, I use a hb mule at skeles so that might be the difference in pot consumption and whatnot.

I think his 2nd statement is saying that despite the higher pot burn and slower exp rates, why do people train at newties over skeles.

[Beaner]

simple, they are followers. someone said ages ago that newtys was the best place for bowmen to SOLO and from there it grew to only place for bowmen to train. i am guessing its also that skeles is scary with their high damage and evil bishops ksing everyone.

i ve gone for an hour with 20 pots at skele, only way to do this at newtysis sniping the middle platform.

[Retalion]

simple, they are followers. someone said ages ago that newtys was the best place for bowmen to SOLO and from there it grew to only place for bowmen to train. i am guessing its also that skeles is scary with their high damage and evil bishops ksing everyone.

i ve gone for an hour with 20 pots at skele, only way to do this at newtysis sniping the middle platform.

Yeah, Ive noticed that too. Skeles are better exp, yet newtie maps are always full and skele maps are obtainable at some times that arent too peak (newties in Scania are filled 24/7 to what I remember). In Scania, you're more likely to be ksed out of your newtie map than you are your skele map though.

[Itay]

I seriously dont know what to do. I don't have nx and I'll never have nx, which means I'll never get to hp wash. I want to go with Truemarks idea and add hp from 130-140... but I'm afraid I'll regret it since it will stay there forever. With my calculations by 140 I'll have around 4.4k hp which is enough for horntail with hp equips. I'll be able to skele and solo pap as well. What to do? It will affect my damage... around 300 in range..

[B0WJOB]

I seriously dont know what to do. I don't have nx and I'll never have nx, which means I'll never get to hp wash. I want to go with Truemarks idea and add hp from 130-140... but I'm afraid I'll regret it since it will stay there forever. With my calculations by 140 I'll have around 4.4k hp which is enough for horntail with hp equips. I'll be able to skele and solo pap as well. What to do? It will affect my damage... around 300 in range..

on this private server i played, i had a 109 att Neschere while a friend of mine has a 118 att Neschere. we are both crossbowman here (want to try the other archer class).
turned out that i out leveld him and eventually is the #1 sniper in my server

300 range is a big no-no for stat......maniacs.
but to me, yes, 300 range can be made up by a little extra hard work.

i trained harder, i spent more time and such.

If I were you, I would ask myself "at what level do I want to horntail?"
i think the question is do you want to go horntail at lvl 140
or do you want to wait till you get higher level, so you will put less AP into HP?

just my quick thoughts.

[Retalion]

on this private server i played, i had a 109 att Neschere while a friend of mine has a 118 att Neschere. we are both crossbowman here (want to try the other archer class).
turned out that i out leveld him and eventually is the #1 sniper in my server

300 range is a big no-no for stat......maniacs.
but to me, yes, 300 range can be made up by a little extra hard work.

i trained harder, i spent more time and such.

If I were you, I would ask myself "at what level do I want to horntail?"
i think the question is do you want to go horntail at lvl 140
or do you want to wait till you get higher level, so you will put less AP into HP?

just my quick thoughts.

Josh, there's a difference though. Your FMS has like what? 30x exp? 50x? If it takes 90 hours to level, it would take you 3 in FMS, which is a drastic difference. I would say that leveling isnt that easy on GMS, especially since you dont have nx for 2x exp (and if you did, you'd probably rather use it on ap resets than 2x).

As for what to do, I really dont know. Its your call. I dont care about HT so I'd go with more dex but that's just me.

[Chameleonic]

lol Anyone give me some suggestions?

I still have 12 unused SP and cant decide what to put them in. I still cant decide if I want to put them in Snipe(5), FP(5), Pierce(21) or wait till I get MW(9) 20.

I really wish I was lv 175 or something so I didnt have to worry about it...

[Beaner]

lol Anyone give me some suggestions?

I still have 12 unused SP and cant decide what to put them in. I still cant decide if I want to put them in Snipe(5), FP(5), Pierce(21) or wait till I get MW(9) 20.

I really wish I was lv 175 or something so I didnt have to worry about it...

it depends on what you do in maple. you train at skeles? (you have the hp) then i would go for pierce, even more if i was at peak soloing or something most of the time. if you like to anego and boss, then snipe is a much better option than pierce. sure MW 20 is awesome, but you dont have the HP to HT and frankly for what i seen you post here and sleepy you dont seem like the kind of person that would dish out 200+mill for a book (No insult intended, i wouldnt do it either).

most deff though id say ignore FP, lv 1 was more than enough for me till lv 174, i barely started putting points in it and i dont regret it. 1 sec freeze is all i need.

also is your db 21 or 11 at least? if you decide to pump pierce remember to get at least lv 11 db for mobbing otherwise its useless.

personally, and this is all just what i like the most i would max pierce then work on snipe. i love pierce though and i use it all the time, it is a very nice skill and very useful now that the cap is relatively safe.

sidenote: i remember a year ago i looked at the posts in sw and ranks and i drooled over you and your insights. good to see old school MM still around (even if the slightly emo, but aint we all).

[Chameleonic]

I think I messed up by putting 5 SP each in FP and Snipe and DB. I dont feel like using 100k NX to reset some of them.:f7:

Most of the time I'm soloing Cornians looking for FP 20 and accumulating NX(I reckon I'll make 1000k NX there before I find FP 20:f5:). Lately I've been going to Anego with a couple of Guildies, the exp is surprisingly good(well after Cornians anyway! lol)

Yeah I got to Rank 5 Archer at one point...then came 4th Job Bishops and their godly leech exp, of which I get nil. Slightly Emo is the way of the Crossbow. lol...I'm not that bad anymore am I? I've tried not to be.:f3:

[Beaner]

i dont spend time at cornians except when doing the HT quest, so i really cant tell what would work better there. however for anego snipe is the way to go. you are in bera though so i doubt anegos are plenty and always there.

personally i would compromise, if you feel cornians is fine with lv 21 pierce, work on snipe. i left pierce at 21 until i maxed snipe. of course that was simple cause i couldnt even fully chage lv 21 pierce.

and i feel the bishop pain, if i get 1 party a month with a bishop i feel lucky. i am pretty much bound to spliting maps with lower lv NLs or bowmen that also get no bishop love. but hey its fun being the emo uderdog anyways i am also proud of getting to where i am with almost no bishop/priest help. sure it took 2ce as long as others, but its all about the ride, not the destination.

(B> fp 20 :f4:)

[Worthyness]

What is the approximate amount of hp to solo the following:

Pianus(left)
Pianus(Right)
Papu
all necessary exploding instruments from the above mentioned bosses

Thanks in advance =)

[Retalion]

What is the approximate amount of hp to solo the following:

Pianus(left)
Pianus(Right)
Papu
all necessary exploding instruments from the above mentioned bosses

Thanks in advance =)

Ive never solo'd any of them but I can provide numbers from what I've seen:

Left Pianus:Approx 3.5k hp. Note that it seals, dispels, etc. so you'll need all cures and an hb mule might not be very practical.
Right Pianus: 4.5k hp. Doesnt do any of the above so you just need pots. Basically, it does more dmg in exchange for not sealing/dispeling (however, it still does dispel if someone is in the body).
Papulatus: We have a thread about it below for people who dont have enough hp. You can look there. However, you need roughly 3.6-3.7k hp (depending on def) to take a bomb hit (body hit = 3.2ish). If the bomb powers up or blows up cause you did 5000-9999, then you're screwed either way. Most bowmasters that solo puppet >>> and then push pap with Hurricane <<< so that it doesnt attack (as puppet is too far away) and puppet is definitely needed for 2nd body.

[KaidaTan]

Er, Jack, are you using numbers with a HT pendant? Because when you only have a zhelm, you need 3.6k HP for left Pianus, 4.9k for right Pianus, and 4.05k for Pap bombs.

[Retalion]

Er, Jack, are you using numbers with a HT pendant? Because when you only have a zhelm, you need 3.6k HP for left Pianus, 4.9k for right Pianus, and 4.05k for Pap bombs.

I dont have an HT pendant and Ive never seen bombs hit more than 3.7k (everyone keeps telling me bombs do 4k but Ive never seen anything higher than 37xx). As well, I was always told I only need 3.5 for left and 4.5 for right... I dont fish much so perhaps the people telling me were wrong but Im positive bombs have never hit close to 4k on me (When I go in with hb, bless, etc.).

[KaidaTan]

Well I know for a fact I've been hit by 402x by a bomb before I got a pendant. I don't fish terribly often, but I do know the right side does at least 4.8, so I suggested 4.9. I'm not very sure on left side.

[Retalion]

Well I know for a fact I've been hit by 402x by a bomb before I got a pendant. I don't fish terribly often, but I do know the right side does at least 4.8, so I suggested 4.9. I'm not very sure on left side.

I dont want to argue with you as I know you definitely know more than I do and I'll probably lose xD. However, Im curious, did it hit 4k on you with hp equips on to survive a solo or was it just normal equips? I pap with normal equips, meaning I'd have more wep def than if I had used hp gear (which is mostly made up of low level'd gear). I dont fish much either so I cant really back my claims up but those are the numbers I see and am regurgitating (sp?).

Someone come sort us out, lol.

[KaidaTan]

I dont want to argue with you as I know you definitely know more than I do and I'll probably lose xD. However, Im curious, did it hit 4k on you with hp equips on to survive a solo or was it just normal equips? I pap with normal equips, meaning I'd have more wep def than if I had used hp gear (which is mostly made up of low level'd gear). I dont fish much either so I cant really back my claims up but those are the numbers I see and am regurgitating (sp?).

Someone come sort us out, lol.

I have never Papped (or Pianus'd) with any sort of HP gear. I'm absolutely sure that bombs can do slightly over 4k uncharged, too (without a pendant).

[FelixTM]

I think I was at around 80-90 successful Pap solos before I got my HT pendant. I never once saw a bomb do more than 3930-3950 to me. In fact, they usually did 3700-3800.

If you truly did get hit for 4k, I would have to say you are insanely unlucky or you really pissed that bomb off.

[Nikkey]

How long time takes it for Frostprey/Phoenix to attack? i.e. the time it takes for one attack, or the amount of attacks it makes per minute.

[Retalion]

How long time takes it for Frostprey/Phoenix to attack? i.e. the time it takes for one attack, or the amount of attacks it makes per minute.

I just went on and timed it and it hit roughly 16 times in 1 minute. That being said, upon the start of my timer, it didnt attack right away (took roughly 2-3 seconds before the first attack) so I suppose an estimate would be 3.5ish seconds/attack?

If it matters, I did my "experiment" at bone fish, where I waited for one to power up physically, cast puppet, then stood beside it, letting phoenix attack it (killed it on the like 14th attack cause its level 1 and bone fish seem strong to fire, etc).

PS. The quote in your siggy is by G4 right? xD

[Kevvl]

I believe 3.5 seconds per attack is right, I remember hearing that elsewhere.

Sounds like something from Xplay =P

[Nikkey]

I just went on and timed it and it hit roughly 16 times in 1 minute. That being said, upon the start of my timer, it didnt attack right away (took roughly 2-3 seconds before the first attack) so I suppose an estimate would be 3.5ish seconds/attack?

If it matters, I did my "experiment" at bone fish, where I waited for one to power up physically, cast puppet, then stood beside it, letting phoenix attack it (killed it on the like 14th attack cause its level 1 and bone fish seem strong to fire, etc).

PS. The quote in your siggy is by G4 right? xD

ah, thanks. ^_^

And yeah, that's correct. G4 is a winner in how to explain common actions happening in MapleStory, or issues itself. Pray for him. :f3:

[Kevin]

I'm level 98, and my skillbuild is the following:

30 Strafe
27 Arrow Rain
6 Puppet
5 Mortal Blow
16 Silver Hawk
1 Inferno

What should I work on next? I was thinking of either Hawk to 21 or puppet to something like 12 and back to Hawk. I think I have my mind set on leaving Inferno at 1, so I'll max everything else. Is MB or Thrust more useful earlier?

My clean speed is 103 and I train at Gobies/Himes in a party with no Priest most of the time.

[FelixTM]

I went for Thrust (got to level 10) before Mortal Blow (which I maxed). They were the last two skills I got, of course. I feel Mortal Blow is better to max last because it works better with Hurricane.

It depends on how much you use Puppet. If you find yourself using it frequently, I'd get it to 12 before working on Hawk. If you don't use it much, I'd focus on Hawk first.

[psychopat]

Having hit 105, I strapped on my 70hp pirate hat and decided to go test out newties.

The Juniors seem fine. I also tested 5 seperate Nest golem touches and lived each time. Nest golem magic 1hko'ed me on the first hit, doing 2905. How far up does their damage go? The "where to train" sticky says 2700, but that's obviously wrong, or at least it assumes a zhelm :f4:

With the hat, I'm up to 2805 hp... I'm wondering how much more hp eq I need if I don't want to wait a minimum of another 6 levels. Then again, I guess I could just do like at sharks and not get hit by the magic... :f3:

[Itay]

Having hit 105, I strapped on my 70hp pirate hat and decided to go test out newties.

The Juniors seem fine. I also tested 5 seperate Nest golem touches and lived each time. Nest golem magic 1hko'ed me on the first hit, doing 2905. How far up does their damage go? The "where to train" sticky says 2700, but that's obviously wrong, or at least it assumes a zhelm :f4:

With the hat, I'm up to 2805 hp... I'm wondering how much more hp eq I need if I don't want to wait a minimum of another 6 levels. Then again, I guess I could just do like at sharks and not get hit by the magic... :f3:

I'm level 123 with around 3.2k HP with a Zhelm and they do 2915 max to me.

[Retalion]

Having hit 105, I strapped on my 70hp pirate hat and decided to go test out newties.

The Juniors seem fine. I also tested 5 seperate Nest golem touches and lived each time. Nest golem magic 1hko'ed me on the first hit, doing 2905. How far up does their damage go? The "where to train" sticky says 2700, but that's obviously wrong, or at least it assumes a zhelm :f4:

With the hat, I'm up to 2805 hp... I'm wondering how much more hp eq I need if I don't want to wait a minimum of another 6 levels. Then again, I guess I could just do like at sharks and not get hit by the magic... :f3:

lol >_>, lemme go fix it. Im used to seeing 26xx-27xxish so I never knew it went that high on personal experience. Should I justt change the needed hp up to 3k?

[psychopat]

I don't have enough HP to go test it out to get you a decent number.

Itay's saying 2915 with a zhelm. Judging by how a zhelm reduces black squid ink from 150ish to 1, 3075 or 3100 is probably a safer bet? Also, the 2.7ish is what I saw from touch damage. It's the magic that hurt me more. Of course, my sample size was quite small and I obviously have better wdef than mdef. They do have 70 more matk than mdef.

... and I just realized how far away I am from training there :eek:

[Retalion]

I don't have enough HP to go test it out to get you a decent number.

Itay's saying 2915 with a zhelm. Judging by how a zhelm reduces black squid ink from 150ish to 1, 3075 or 3100 is probably a safer bet?

... and I just realized how far away I am from training there :eek:

See, those numbers seem really high. Leafre came out when I was 111 and I never had problems surviving it...You forgot to factor in that your hat has wep/mag def too so it probably wont be a 150 reduction.

*waits for other imput before changing it*

[psychopat]

I purposely ignored that factor because the squids hit me for that much when I had my regular archer hat... but I agree that it is a ballpark estimation.

Either way, it's definitely more than 2700 and worth looking into :f2: I can go on another suicide run when I get home if ya want, but the walk is long and tedious since I'll die every hit.

Are you sure you're not mixing up their touch & magic? The matk is 70 points more than their touch, according to Fiel's data. I'm not sure how much raw damage that translates into... We also naturally have way less mdef than wdef.

[Retalion]

I purposely ignored that factor because the squids hit me for that much when I had my regular archer hat... but I agree that it is a ballpark estimation.

Either way, it's definitely more than 2700 and worth looking into :f2: I can go on another suicide run when I get home if ya want, but the walk is long and tedious since I'll die every hit.

Are you sure you're not mixing up their touch & magic? The matk is 70 points more than their touch, according to Fiel's data. I'm not sure how much raw damage that translates into... We also naturally have way less mdef than wdef.

Nah, I'll go try later when I feel like getting on maple (and it gets too hot to practice piano).

[Kevvl]

With no armour on at all, I take hits up to 3050. With just my level 100 gear (I don't have a helm) I never take anything more than 3005.


<3 Being a XBloodmaster

[lonesoldier1]

I have 3.5 k hp w/o zhelm.

I can personally tell you that golem newties do around 2.8-3k dmg on me. Just helping out jack.

[psychopat]

Thanks for the answers, guys... Now I know that I'm over 200 hp short :f7:

I also retested it 3 times yesterday... 2948, 2918, 2895.

[Retalion]

I'll just stick it as 3k on the guide then. Hopefully no one gets killed by my "inaccurate info" =X

[psychopat]

If no one mentioned the 2700 before me, I doubt it'll be a problem :)

I personally didn't mind the deaths since I was at 0% and explicitly testing my survivability there.

[Retalion]

If no one mentioned the 2700 before me, I doubt it'll be a problem :)

I personally didn't mind the deaths since I was at 0% and explicitly testing my survivability there.

Well, someone mentioned that it was higher than 2.7k on SW and I was going to look into it but forgot to till you brought it up again =X

[Combattente]

I'd want to know if my attack range is normal for the equips I have and for my level.

I'm a level 70 Sniper, and I think I have a pretty low attack range, for the equips I have.


http://img403.imageshack.us/img403/2382/maple0668ef8.jpg
http://img120.imageshack.us/img120/3194/maple0669qy0.jpg
http://img295.imageshack.us/img295/6779/maple0670qg1.jpg
http://img169.imageshack.us/img169/8594/maple0671ab0.jpg
http://img151.imageshack.us/img151/1143/maple0672qs1.jpg
http://img206.imageshack.us/img206/7379/maple0673uh6.jpg
http://img407.imageshack.us/img407/217/maple0674eb6.jpg


Note: I have no PAC or Zhelm, so I don't know if it's normal.

Can anyone tell me if I screwed something up, like stats?

[Beaner]

you have 4 int and 4 luk, your str is kinda high but still decent. you are good, your equips arent omgwtfbbq but who cares.

[Aeosyn]

you have 4 int and 4 luk, your str is kinda high but still decent. you are good, your equips arent omgwtfbbq but who cares.

Wtf Carlos...my BM has 7x base str :f4:

I don't think his str is bad at all.

[Cyanne]

Could anyone give me a very rough comparison of the damage over time between a marksman and bowmaster, both with maxed sharp eyes, expert/boost, and storm/snipe and equally scrolled equipment?

[Retalion]

@ Combanette: http://www.southperry.net/forums/showthread.php?t=472 would've been the better place to post xD

As for your range, I think its decent. The Jaeger is averageish and most archers dont have pink capes till later on. I'd say leave your strength at 70 and then use a z-helm to boost it to 85 coupled with the other str you'll get from a 4 str ades to use a casa when you hit 90 (though that's looking really far ahead xD).

@ Cyanne: I really have no idea, sorry =X

[Beaner]

Could anyone give me a very rough comparison of the damage over time between a marksman and bowmaster, both with maxed sharp eyes, expert/boost, and storm/snipe and equally scrolled equipment?

there is a 10-15 lv gap. meaning a 16x BM can easily ks a 17x marksman. when it comes to dps on single targets MM suck testicles, no joke.

[Aeosyn]

there is a 10-15 lv gap. meaning a 16x BM can easily ks a 17x marksman. when it comes to dps on single targets MM suck testicles, no joke.

But you like it :excellent:

[Cyanne]

Oh sorry, I meant on stationary bosses. If it's bad, how bad compared to bowmasters (half their damage? 2/3?)?

[KaidaTan]

Could anyone give me a very rough comparison of the damage over time between a marksman and bowmaster, both with maxed sharp eyes, expert/boost, and storm/snipe and equally scrolled equipment?

Ah, I feel like my life culminated into answering this question.

I used my own Bowmaster with these equips. For the imaginary Marksman, I gave him a Neschere with 4 more attack than my Nisrock.
http://img513.imageshack.us/img513/9764/equipsze3.png
Both characters are at level 162 (my level). I optimized their base STR, though. I lowered mine so that I could just barely wear a Nisrock without MW, and I lowered the Marksman's by 5 more for the Neschere. Of course, I raised their dex accordingly. Otherwise, I gave them both the same stats/equips. I used 2000 defense (Anego's real defense) for both sets of DPS.

The DPS for Bowmasters is easy. I calculated using 500 arrows a minute. The DPS for Marksmen was a little trickier. I took the average Strafe damage of my imaginary Marksman and had him do that 78 times and then added 6 Snipes (1 every 10 seconds for a minute) that average at 97000 damage (which is a number I was given my Marksman friend) to total 84 shots in a minute.

Bowmaster general stats:
4441 Minimum
5441 Maximum
160 Total Attack
973 Total DEX
110 Total STR

Marksman general stats:
4823 Minimum
5915 Maximum
164 Total Attack
979 Total DEX
104 Total STR

Bowmaster DPS: 74442
Marksman DPS: 62792

[Cyanne]

Wow, thanks for the very detailed reply! I really thought marksman was an underrated class, and this helped me confirm that =] It looks like they're only about 1/7 behind bowmasters on bosses, and that's not including how much cheaper crossbow scrolls are compared to their bow counterparts.

[Combattente]

I used my own Bowmaster with these equips. For the imaginary Marksman, I gave him a Neschere with 4 more attack than my Nisrock.
http://img513.imageshack.us/img513/9764/equipsze3.png


:f6: :f6: :f6: :f6: :f6: :f6: :f6:


... Godly.

That's all I can say.

[Beaner]

Wow, thanks for the very detailed reply! I really thought marksman was an underrated class, and this helped me confirm that =] It looks like they're only about 1/7 behind bowmasters on bosses, and that's not including how much cheaper crossbow scrolls are compared to their bow counterparts.

apples increase the range between us. MM are not underrated we truly suck at bossing. i think pallys can do higher dps then we d o lol. also consider marksmen as the weakest of the ranged classes in maple, not counting magicians of course.

[Retalion]

Ah, I feel like my life culminated into answering this question.

I used my own Bowmaster with these equips. For the imaginary Marksman, I gave him a Neschere with 4 more attack than my Nisrock.
http://img513.imageshack.us/img513/9764/equipsze3.png
Both characters are at level 162 (my level). I optimized their base STR, though. I lowered mine so that I could just barely wear a Nisrock without MW, and I lowered the Marksman's by 5 more for the Neschere. Of course, I raised their dex accordingly. Otherwise, I gave them both the same stats/equips. I used 2000 defense (Anego's real defense) for both sets of DPS.

The DPS for Bowmasters is easy. I calculated using 500 arrows a minute. The DPS for Marksmen was a little trickier. I took the average Strafe damage of my imaginary Marksman and had him do that 78 times and then added 6 Snipes (1 every 10 seconds for a minute) that average at 97000 damage (which is a number I was given my Marksman friend) to total 84 shots in a minute.

Bowmaster general stats:
4441 Minimum
5441 Maximum
160 Total Attack
973 Total DEX
110 Total STR

Marksman general stats:
4823 Minimum
5915 Maximum
164 Total Attack
979 Total DEX
104 Total STR

Bowmaster DPS: 74442
Marksman DPS: 62792


Hmmm Alex, if you're going to factor in snipe for marksmen, shouldnt you put in concentrate for us compared with say ciders or warrior elixirs? (Then again, we have Hurricane compared to their Pierce, which is really... nonfactorable into this xD)

[Anyoneisgod]

Hmmm Alex, if you're going to factor in snipe for marksmen, shouldnt you put in concentrate for us compared with say ciders or warrior elixirs? (Then again, we have Hurricane compared to their Pierce, which is really... nonfactorable into this xD)

im sure he could but hers poofed for a few days,at his dads i think.

[Retalion]

im sure he could but hers poofed for a few days,at his dads i think.

What's with you Windian archers and computer/net problems.

Carlos at the opening on SouthPerry
Alex now
You at Tespia v3

[Anyoneisgod]

lol he just went to visit his dad (whom i don't believe has net access)


Carlo's internet and computer are made from coconuts and i was just unlucky.

[Technolink]

Hmmm Alex, if you're going to factor in snipe for marksmen, shouldnt you put in concentrate for us compared with say ciders or warrior elixirs? (Then again, we have Hurricane compared to their Pierce, which is really... nonfactorable into this xD)

KaidaTan prvoed the point, that's around what it would be. Concentrate would be active 1/3 of the time, thus averaging as 8.666 more attack, so figure the BM would be around 4% stronger after wdef.

Also, there was warrior elixirs, 118+2+4+14+10 = 148+12 = 160.

[KaidaTan]

KaidaTan prvoed the point, that's around what it would be. Concentrate would be active 1/3 of the time, thus averaging as 8.666 more attack, so figure the BM would be around 4% stronger after wdef.

Also, there was warrior elixirs, 118+2+4+14+10 = 148+12 = 160.

Concentrate is active half of the time, not one third. It lasts for 3 minutes and the cooldown is 6. Anyway I just didn't think of Concentrate when I did it. Although you could say that Snipe is the Marksmen's answer to Pierce, you could also say that the Bowmaster is not performing to his maximum performance.

I'm going to give the Bowmaster 7 more attack (Conc has 14 attack over Warrior pots, but is only active half the time). Since I'm at my Dad's house for now, I don't have my excel sheet on me so I'll take a second to give the revised DPS~

Got it:
Bowmaster DPS: 74442
Revised Bowmaster DPS: 78933
Marksman DPS: 62792

On a sidenote, I noticed that the Bowmaster actually had a higher attack range than the Marksman when he was using Concentrate. So I guess you can say, generally speaking, that 14 attack will bridge the gap between Bowmasters and Marksmen in terms of damage range.

[Beaner]

to even things out give the marksman chews or ciders then. or just do both appled and call it even?

[KaidaTan]

to even things out give the marksman chews or ciders then. or just do both appled and call it even?

Here, I added apples to the mix. Remember this is with 2000 Defense, which is what Anego's defense calculates at (even though it says 3000).

Bowmaster DPS: 74442
Bowmaster DPS (with Concentrate half the time): 78933
Bowmaster DPS (with Onyx Apple): 127549

Marksman DPS: 62792
Marksman DPS (with Onyx Apple): 96550

Wait, I forgot Snipe. Editing the Marksman DPS in a minute.
Fixed it. The Marksman's Snipe makes his appled range about 3k higher.

[Beaner]

except that is not MM dps with a 20 attack pot.

but the point stands apples make it even worse lol

[PJness]

Little question, what would be wise to do first, getting snipe to level 5 so I can try the 20 book or getting pierce to level 5 so I can try that level 20 book.

When I train (not that much atm, but I will train some more in a little while), I usually train at jr. newties, but I'm planning on going to skeles in a few levels from now, I usually only have gingers in my use list, and gingers don't heal enough yet after I get hit by a laser, so I'm staying at jr. newties for a few more levels. I also like to try to solo pap now I have enough HP for it, if I have spare apples that is. So yeah the question is what to get to level 5 first after maxing MM boost, snipe or pierce? I got both the 20 books now, so a little dilemma for me.

I would love to hear the opinion of higher leveled archers (marksmen) out there! (gogo reply Carlos! ;-)

Thanks in advance!

~Greetings PJ!

[Anyoneisgod]

I would go with Snipe pj,but im not a MM, Lets wait for Carlos or one of the other MM(Chemlonic or Technolink)

[Technolink]

Hehe, I'm not a MM =P

Thanks for the complement though. I try to know as much as I can. Judging from what I can tell, 5 points in either isn't really great. Are you just putting 5 point to see if the book passes, or do you plan on maxing these skills right now? I assume the later since you are 138, so you have what, nearly maxed SE and Expert?

I know Peirce isn't that useful until its higher levels (purely math), but snipe isn't that useful untill its REALLY high levels.

From what I've seen, skeles are easy to clump together with some DB action, so perhaps Peirce? I can't see snipe very useful untill its really close to max, unlike Peirce which I've heard is usable from 15+.

Again, pure logic here, A level 21 snipe is (I think) 60 seconds, I don't know the new tables, might even be 22 or 23. That's 1 extra kill a minute, 60 extra kills an hour, which amounts to a WHOOPING 285k more exp an hour (a mere .25% more). Meanwhile, an equal level of peirce could perhaps allow the speed-up of killing in general, as we all know mobbing 4 skeles together (even with charge time) is going to be faster then dealing with them separately. From this standpoint I'd say Peirce.

*waits for Carlos*

[PJness]

Thanks for the replies! But yeah I'm just asking what the next 20 book is best to try, I currently have max SE and at the moment I'm working on maxing MM boost, got really lucky with the SE and MM boost books, I have a 20 book of DB, snipe and pierce now (all those skills are at level 1 now) (edit: once I pass that book I will probably work on maxing that skill, if it fails I might go raise another skill to level 5 and try another book, I just got 1 of each and 2 in case of DB in my list, and I don't wanna buy skill books like Joost1987 did with SE, I will just quest/train for it untill I found another one unless it's really cheap in the FM), but since I don't level that much lately, I don't have that much points to put into my skills, so I'm just wondering what would be the most useful to do for me once my MM boost is maxed, considering I will leave jr newties in a few levels and go to skelegons for training and also solo pap as much as I can and zakum with Inspire every week.

Thanks in advance for the replies again!

~Greetings PJ!

edit: *waits for Carlos and Jon (Truemark)* ;-)

[Beaner]

the age old question. what to do first snipe or pierce?

both skills have their uses and their reason to exist. snipe is a small dmg increase on 1 vs 1 and a nice little killing boost for training. pierce is our main mob skill in 4th job and if used correctly it can increase killing speed. (ask kaida, ever since i been able to use it he cant complain about spawn at skeles anymore). before last week i woul dhave said go pierce, go to skeles and have fun. however recently i found that newtys with another person non bishop i better exp than skeles with a non bishop. pierce is completely useless at newtys, while snipe is pretty useful.

it all comes down to what each person likes. if you do mainly bossing, newtys, go for snipe. you like skeles, have a bishop friends and train a lot, do pierce to 21 first. also both skills are pretty lame on low levels, and only shine when they are 20+. in your case PJ since you dont level much and dont expect to max a skill soon id say go snipe for the following reasons. you like your zakum, its nice there, stick to newtys, stop sniping and get in there when you dont snipe it is awesome exp. also you can use lv 1-5-7-10-12 or whatever level snipe, it just keeps getting better every point you add, and if you get tired of leveling and its at 14 it doesnt matter it is still useful. on the meantime pierce MUST be lv 11 or 21 to get better, that is a lot of levels and if you get on pierce be ready to try and perhaps fail a few 30 books. for pierce its lv 21 or not at all. snipe at 20 is 60 seconds, not so bad id say.

in the end you decide, just remember the MM path is an ungrateful little bitch and takes a while to achive its full potential. pick one, stick to it and keep it up.

[PJness]

Thank you so much Carlos!! Your answer does help a lot, I will get snipe to level 5 first so I can try that book. Let's hope it's gonna work! I will go try it in 3 levels from now I think.

Cya soon!

~Greetings PJ!

[Truemark]

So I'm just wondering what would be the most useful to do for me once my MM boost is maxed, considering I will leave jr newties in a few levels and go to skelegons for training and also solo pap as much as I can and zakum with Inspire every week.


MW to 19 is always a great skill to have if you're not partying with someone that has it consistently.

After MW was maxed I moved to pierce and maxed it. Then I moved to snipe. When I got to level 15, I really felt like I was wasting my skill points, and the time it would take to max it could be spent on something more important to me, Dragon's Breath. Even when I get Dragon's Breath to 21, I'll probably still want Frost Prey to before I go back to snipe. The reason for that is Frostprey will actually be a greater increase in DPS than snipe ever will be, even on single targets (because you can continue to strafe, so count in 1 strafe + 3 FP attacks per 1 snipe).

I'd rather have MAX FP than Snipe.

[Worthyness]

Anyone have any advice to lower leveled, archers that wanna do the Crimson wood quests? it seems we need a god awful amount of HP to even try to get the pendant at the end...

I know archers should be able to take on the normal monsters, but what about the semi bosses like HH and Bigfoot?
It seems we need lots of HP to solo or even party one of these things...

[lonesoldier1]

SE 20 or Bow Expert 20?

Pick please as to whether will increase my dmg.
If i buy one, i cannot buy the other due to the price =/

[Worthyness]

IMO i think you should do SE asap, and a feww BE everynow and then...

SE to get into parties and BE for increased damage..

But don't listen to me, i'm only level 100

[Sybaris]

Im looking for the new skills tables for Arrow Blow and Iron Arrow (they got changed in patch 0.56).

If they were ever on sw.net, they got pulled, so perhaps they surfaced somewhere here?

[Beaner]

so where is dolob?

[Milelke]

1. I confused about secong job, Final Attack Seems Useful at the time but if I ever get to Ranger It wont even apply to strafe..... (making it pretty much useless)

2. Is power-knockback useful?

3. Where can an archer (20-30) Train Quickly in YELLONDE (where low levels spots are packed, making them usless)

[Mark]

1. I confused about secong job, Final Attack Seems Useful at the time but if I ever get to Ranger It wont even apply to strafe..... (making it pretty much useless)

2. Is power-knockback useful?

3. Where can an archer (20-30) Train Quickly in YELLONDE (where low levels spots are packed, making them usless)

1. Final Attack is shit in all aspects. I'll tell you why in a second.

2. PKB is extremely useful while making your way up to level 90 or so. Definitely skip out on FA to max PKB.

3. I was gonna say the Mask Monsters up by Perion but then I remembered it's Yellonde. :x I'd say your best bet is just Kerning PQ.

[Retalion]

1. Most people dont get FA.
2. PKB is decent but it is possible to skip it (though most dont). If you do skip it, it is advised you go rain first.
3. The jr. cactus spot could be decent too I guess? Also, a fish resting spot in aqua would be good too (usually REALLY empty)

[Technolink]

Im looking for the new skills tables for Arrow Blow and Iron Arrow (they got changed in patch 0.56).

If they were ever on sw.net, they got pulled, so perhaps they surfaced somewhere here?

I can't find them either. Perhaps ask Fiel to extract them?

[in watercolor]

Sniper: level 90.
1119~1985.
24 strafe, 21 arrow eruption, 6 puppet, 1 blizzard, 5 mortal blow, 1 eagle.

I'm currently 4x leeching at harps right now. I'm projecting level 93 by the end of today. Maybe 94 if I get lucky.

That leaves me with either 9 points or 12 points to spare. Where should I put them for goby/eventually newtie training? Should I max strafe or get blizzard to 11 or max strafe and start hawk or what?

[Beaner]

Sniper: level 90.
1119~1985.
24 strafe, 21 arrow eruption, 6 puppet, 1 blizzard, 5 mortal blow, 1 eagle.

I'm currently 4x leeching at harps right now. I'm projecting level 93 by the end of today. Maybe 94 if I get lucky.

That leaves me with either 9 points or 12 points to spare. Where should I put them for goby/eventually newtie training? Should I max strafe or get blizzard to 11 or max strafe and start hawk or what?

max strafe, then max eruption. after go do blizzard to 21.

edit: leeching is for pansies

[in watercolor]

max strafe, then max eruption. after go do blizzard to 21.

edit: leeching is for pansies

I've done these levels on a different character. I'm too lazy this time around and a meso farming friend asked if anyone wanted to leech for free.

[Derimed]

a meso farming friend asked if anyone wanted to leech for free.

*Headdesk*

I think you might want to stay out of his party if he's openly acknowledging he does that. Getting into Zak or HT might be hard in later lvls.

[in watercolor]

*Headdesk*

I think you might want to stay out of his party if he's openly acknowledging he does that. Getting into Zak or HT might be hard in later lvls.

Legit meso farming. As in: spamming an ultimate at harps on 2x drop to make profit. And I won't have a hard time getting a Zakum run as I've been on them before on my CB.

[Beaner]

getting to 104 is hardly doing the levels before. no one said leeching is illegal, its just lame.

the recomendation stands for when you train your character.

[Beaner]

could anyone help me find the formula for frostprey damage?

maxed is fine and for when it is strong to elements too if possible.

edit: i found this
Phoenix/Frostprey (credit to Sybaris):
MIN = (DEX * 2.5 + STR) * Skill %
MAX = (DEX * 2.5 * 0.7 + STR) * Skill %
Ignores defense

but it makes no sense and doesnt work. i guess i am doing it wrong or something >_>.

the max dmg ends up lower than the min and the dmg doesnt match what i really do.

[Technolink]

You have them reversed
Min: (DEX*2.5*.7+str)*skill%
Max = (dex*2.5+str)*skill%

The *.7 is in the min, just switch w/e you go.

[Kevvl]

lol, Damage range = 999~500.

[sumtingverywong]

i was wondering if dragon's breath has the ability to move bosses ie:pap,bf,headless horsemen. does anyone have any experience with this?