KMS ruined Elin Forest PQ... [Archive]

IsaacGS

2008-07-21, 09:32 PM

I hadn't had a chance to check out Elin Forest's Party Quest since it came out about a week ago until yesterday. Before the last KMS patch (1.2.60 was a bug fix) the Elin Forest PQ data in the Quest log indicated what we learned from KMST: That is, that the party quest was from 50-200. Additionally from what we know about it, it required one person from all 5 jobs (Pirate, Thief, Magician, Warrior, Archer.) to enter.

Now, however, the truth is revealed: They nerfed it down to 45-55. I can't possibly think of a worse range for this. It's overlapping FIVE different other PQs. As if that weren't frustrating enough, they changed it so that instead of needing all classes, you now can bring anyone of any class along. This is horrible news; instead of requiring everyone to work together and make use of all classes strengths, it's been reduced to every other party quest where we bring 5 assassins along. >_>

Thoughts? personally, this greatly angered me. Not only did they change what should have been a fun exploration for everyone of every level, but they also eliminated the need of every class, putting the same old people in the limelight and throwing the rest of us to the sidelines. They picked what was likely the worst possible level range to add it to as well, because with Monster Carnival, Ludi PQ, Ludi Maze PQ (Which admittedly is not available in KMS), Orbis PQ, and Pirate PQ, it's by far adequately covered. I'm thoroughly discouraged and disappointed, especially given the fact that at the moment, there are NO quests in Elin Forest at all. Yet another unique and innovative idea ruined at the hands of Nexon Korea... They've done very poorly this month.

Jirai

2008-07-21, 09:35 PM

XD KMS is horribly nerfing their OWN content for once <_<
But what about the boss? Isn't it like level 80?

IsaacGS

2008-07-21, 09:37 PM

XD KMS is horribly nerfing their OWN content for once <_<
But what about the boss? Isn't it like level 80?
That's what I was wondering, but I can't seem to find any nerfing yet. it's got 3 forms, which are 65, 75, and 85. I find it hard to believe that 55's could take it out, much less people lower than that. I'm still checking though.\\

Oh, and in addition to nerfing Elin PQ, they also nerfed the Boss PQ (Which formerly gave you Amazing EXP every stage that was completed, now gives none.) and the event quests (Formerly gave 10k EXP, was easily repeatable, now gives 8.5k EXP, quest items are slightly more rare.)

Tamekii

2008-07-21, 09:39 PM

Congratz kMS on nerfing and ruining another content <33333!!!!!!

Loose

2008-07-21, 09:41 PM

Err... let's hope that Nexon of America doesn't know about this and keeps the PQ like it was in KMST.

I thought the idea of requiring every class to start it was good and innovative, didn't know about the level requirement was. No maximum level sounds awesome, because you can do it with your lower or higher level friends.

I wonder if we'll get a no max level PQ in the Masteria Patch...

Beserker101

2008-07-21, 09:48 PM

chances are Nexon NA will nerf it in their own special way and make it even worst. I don't hate Nexon, I just don't like some of the things they do (or lack there of).

Kranzorbaken

2008-07-21, 09:49 PM

All i can say is that i think they took it out cause they probably though finding one of every class would be hard...
Nexon i hate to say this cause i feel like a ignorant fuck bag ass hat but you fail.

Tamekii

2008-07-21, 09:50 PM

chances are Nexon NA will nerf it in their own special way and make it even worst. I don't hate Nexon, I just don't like some of the things they do (or lack there of).

NEXON AMERICA isnt too 'GOOD' at nerfing

What was the last thing they nerfed btw? o.o'

Eldin

2008-07-21, 10:00 PM

I think the last thing they nerfed was the Armory map in Showa, by taking out the weapons and platforms.

Tamekii

2008-07-21, 10:05 PM

I think the last thing they nerfed was the Armory map in Showa, by taking out the weapons and platforms.

That wasnt made by Nexon America o.o'...
I think it was nerfed by ChinaMS Gamania o.o'

Raven

2008-07-21, 10:07 PM

Thats no fun, sorry. Especially considering it won't make sense to have 5 dark lords -- it was supposed to be very much story and quest based. Hopefully this picture will lighten the mood (disregard private server, its just a funny picture, me making a lame sexual joke with the other guy covering it up with his grab, delete the picture if you want mods but I think you might like it)

http://img155.imageshack.us/img155/7998/flatchest2ma6.jpg

IsaacGS

2008-07-21, 10:08 PM

That wasnt made by Nexon America o.o'...
I think it was nerfed by ChinaMS Gamania o.o'
It was changed by CMS, but I wouldn't even call it a nerf. A nerf is something that's done intentionally to make things that are good worse. The removal of the platform is an accidental consequence of a graphical change, not a nerf.

Tamekii

2008-07-21, 10:14 PM

It was changed by CMS, but I wouldn't even call it a nerf. A nerf is something that's done intentionally to make things that are good worse. The removal of the platform is an accidental consequence of a graphical change, not a nerf.

Hmm..anyways..i just quoted what he/she said :D~~

Btw...i dont see a reason to say that NEXON AMERICA 'nerfed' something... since everyone that says that..dont ever know what 'nexon' did it ._.'

Erich

2008-07-21, 10:17 PM

nexon fails ._. well, what an I say. oh and how'd they nerf boss pq?
has nexonKR took some of nexon america's employee's? or just on a braindead streak.

Milelke

2008-07-21, 10:21 PM

If we get Ellin Forest, it probably wont be nerfed.

Because all the Koreans will be ranting and complaining......

45-55 is a horrible range it overlapps with way to many other pqs.

Chameleonic

2008-07-21, 10:23 PM

Hmmm maybe I should be railing against Nexon Korea instead of Nexon America. lol

Erich

2008-07-21, 10:24 PM

aww and I just about got a KMS account :f4:

Tamekii

2008-07-21, 10:25 PM

I hope the PQ atleast gives good EXP ¬¬

devinmacd33

2008-07-21, 10:26 PM

Wow that sucks, maybe if enough people from kms complain to nexon they'll change it back?

EngelRod

2008-07-21, 10:26 PM

If the boss wasn't nerfed MAYBE it was a mistake made by Nexon, so the pq could change, Isaac in Tespia the PQ wasn't changed before it was released in the main server or not at all?

Beserker101

2008-07-21, 10:29 PM

NEXON AMERICA isnt too 'GOOD' at nerfing

What was the last thing they nerfed btw? o.o'

I took a look and compared, there is the problem of the Showa armor shop that was removed, although whether that was Nexon or CMS, I am not completely sure. A big one that POed a lot of people (albeit about a year ago now) was the NLC potion prices.

IsaacGS

2008-07-21, 10:32 PM

If the boss wasn't nerfed MAYBE it was a mistake made by Nexon, so the pq could change, Isaac in Tespia the PQ wasn't changed before it was released in the main server or not at all?
If it was nerfed in Tespia, there was no notification of it by insoya. They always catch things like this, so it's hard to imagine they'd let something this big pass by.

Last week, when I was visiting Elin, I talked to the PQ NPC and she told me 45-55. I was a little worried but there were two reassurances:
1. In the quest log, it said 50+.
2. It showed up for everyone, even people over 55.

In KMST, like GMST, it's not uncommon for them to remove PQ caps. However, they never change the PQ's lower limit. Why would they decrease the PQ from 50 to 45? Seemed silly.

Then, they did the bug fix patch, and ruined everyone's hopes of all jobs working together and of high levels getting to enjoy a PQ once in a while by doing this. Once again, there are ZERO ( 0 ) quests in Elin Forest. The NPCs wouldn't even talk to me (Even though I know for a fact they have things to say, because I read it in GMS). This PQ is the only storyline, and now everyone's been deprived of that.

Tamekii

2008-07-21, 10:33 PM

I took a look and compared, there is the problem of the Showa armor shop that was removed, although whether that was Nexon or CMS, I am not completely sure. A big one that POed a lot of people (albeit about a year ago now) was the NLC potion prices.

Oh..i remember...everyone got pissed...the prices wasnt highers..but it was too expensive comparing to the first one...then they edited it again :D

Hazzy

2008-07-21, 11:33 PM

I took a look and compared, there is the problem of the Showa armor shop that was removed, although whether that was Nexon or CMS, I am not completely sure. A big one that POed a lot of people (albeit about a year ago now) was the NLC potion prices.

Before the Tespia, it was normal, and just like most other versions. We have Private Servers to thank for this.

Nexon nerfed it because they removed the tank, and thus a great sniping spot. Had they replaced it with crates, it would be plain censorship. Mages and Snipers have difficulty training there now. :/

IsaacGS

2008-07-21, 11:45 PM

Before the Tespia, it was normal, and just like most other versions. We have Private Servers to thank for this.

Nexon nerfed it because they removed the tank, and thus a great sniping spot. Had they replaced it with crates, it would be plain censorship. Mages and Snipers have difficulty training there now. :/
That would imply that they changed it to make the area less useful. That isn't the case. They simply removed the Tank - without realizing what impact it would have on training.

Decrease the attack on a weapon: Nerf.
Lowering a skill's success rate: Nerf.
Removing a platform: NOT A NERF.

Anyway, back on the topic at hand rather than go over all this showa BS again, the Boss was nerfed. HOWEVER, they did not change the boss's levels. This really handicaps warriors and mages. As if changing the PQ requirements wasn't enough of a kick in the teeth.

I'll have the nerfed stats up shortly, and I highly suspect that they nerfed all other PQ monsters.

Jirai

2008-07-21, 11:58 PM

When you saw all other PQ monsters, you just mean Ellin Forest PQ mobs, right?

IsaacGS

2008-07-22, 12:13 AM

When you saw all other PQ monsters, you just mean Ellin Forest PQ mobs, right?
Yeah, all the other Elin PQ monsters.

Old stats
Poison Golem
Boss
Level: 65
HP: 720,000
MP: 300
Avoid: 0
KB: 1,500
EXP: -
Poison Golem Level 2
Boss
Level: 75
HP: 930,000
MP: 400
Avoid: 0
KB: 1,500
EXP: -

Poison Golem Level 3
Boss
Level 85
HP: 1,350,000
MP: 500
Avoid: 0
KB: 10,000
EXP: 44,950

New Stats
Poison Golem
Boss
Level: 65
HP: 63,000
MP: 300
Avoid: 18
KB: 1,500
EXP: -
Poison Golem Level 2
Boss
Level: 75
HP: 83,000
MP: 400
Avoid: 18
KB: 1,500
EXP: -

Poison Golem Level 3
Boss
Level: 85
HP: 113,500
MP: 500
Avoid: 18
KB: 10,000
EXP: 17,980

I'll just show the boss here since that's all most of you are interested in. The other monsters' stat changes can be seen here:
http://strategywiki.org/w/index.php?title=MapleStory%2FMonsters%2FLevel_61-70&diff=291793&oldid=284964

Retalion

2008-07-22, 12:19 AM

IsaacGS

2008-07-22, 12:40 AM

If the boss is level 85, wouldnt it be too easy if a group of say 150's went in to beat it? I dont know what to think. Should this make me worried for the PQ that "might" come out with Crimsonwood (cause they might make it something like this and have the majority of us unable to get in) or should we be happy (so we get a more unique pq)? Who knows, perhaps this would have no effect on us at all (till we get this PQ a year or two down the line anyways).
They did a lot of weird things here. Like, they randomly changed around all the ID numbers of the monsters (Which is something I've never seen them do before.) They left the monsters at their level. Level affects accuracy, correct? So a warrior is gonna have to hit this boss, that's 30 levels higher than it, and has 18 avoid? I'm just dumbfounded at these changes...

The boss had a total of nearly 3 million HP. Now, it has 259.5k. Before, it would have at least been a moderate challenge... at least as much as Geist. Even now I feel it's a little tough for 45-55. At any rate, the main point is that it was originally intended for much higher level players, but was then knocked down into the same old, same old. The question is: Why would they do this?

As for worrying over a Masteria PQ, Prose knows how much we hate level caps, so I doubt that will be an issue.

Retalion

2008-07-22, 12:53 AM

They did a lot of weird things here. Like, they randomly changed around all the ID numbers of the monsters (Which is something I've never seen them do before.) They left the monsters at their level. Level affects accuracy, correct? So a warrior is gonna have to hit this boss, that's 30 levels higher than it, and has 18 avoid? I'm just dumbfounded at these changes...

The boss had a total of nearly 3 million HP. Now, it has 259.5k. Before, it would have at least been a moderate challenge... at least as much as Geist. Even now I feel it's a little tough for 45-55. At any rate, the main point is that it was originally intended for much higher level players, but was then knocked down into the same old, same old. The question is: Why would they do this?

As for worrying over a Masteria PQ, Prose knows how much we hate level caps, so I doubt that will be an issue.

At the same time, we thought this PQ would be "awesome" too. "All classes needed! Most levels can do it!" Yet... its disappointed us. They've always thrown curveballs at us so I'd be prepared for disappointment all the same (though I pray from the depths of my heart that I wont be disappointed) =X. Why would they do this? I'd say either they made a mistake (which is what you think) or they thought this would be an improvement (which it doesnt seem to be).

Edit: Could it indirectly require all classes though?

Ie. Boss doing enough dmg that spearmen are needed to hb, things that are out of range for sins but in the range of archers, dark sight stage like ludi pq, monster that are strong to physical attacks (requiring mages) etc? Something like Guild PQ where you can go in with whatever classes you want but to succeed you HAVE to have certain classes (Ie. Mage with 15 tele, thief with dark sight, 1st job char/sac mule, etc.)

Mira

2008-07-22, 12:56 AM

Sigh, I was really looking foreward to doing this PQ when it came out in GMS. Now what is Elin forest to anyone over the Pq lvl? It's just another omega or kft with no quests. The only "good" thing in this is that it's in the past, and hopefully this will lead to more areas. I really, really LOVE Elin's looks, but this is disappointing.

IsaacGS

2008-07-22, 01:01 AM

At the same time, we thought this PQ would be "awesome" too. "All classes needed! Most levels can do it!" Yet... its disappointed us. They've always thrown curveballs at us so I'd be prepared for disappointment all the same (though I pray from the depths of my heart that I wont be disappointed) =X. Why would they do this? I'd say either they made a mistake (which is what you think) or they thought this would be an improvement (which it doesnt seem to be).

Edit: Could it indirectly require all classes though?

Ie. Boss doing enough dmg that spearmen are needed to hb, things that are out of range for sins but in the range of archers, dark sight stage like ludi pq, monster that are strong to physical attacks (requiring mages) etc? Something like Guild PQ where you can go in with whatever classes you want but to succeed you HAVE to have certain classes (Ie. Mage with 15 tele, thief with dark sight, 1st job char/sac mule, etc.)
there had to have been something that caused a problem or whatever with the original plan and they had to change it back to normal... They seem to have put in a lot of work on the first form of this PQ, it seems really wasteful to toss all that aside. Maybe, just maybe, they'll fix it up later, or add another PQ that satisfies the needs they tried to meet in this PQ's first incarnation. Who knows. I certainly wouldn't get my hopes up about it, though.

As for indirectly requiring all classes, while I have not done this yet (Though I'm disappointed to say that I'm in the changed level range.), I was told it's pretty easy and that they couldn't even find any warriors to bring along, so obviously they don't need them. Since almost everyone in the guild is a Pirate, I doubt this is the case, though I suppose it will need investigation.

iiMarik

2008-07-22, 01:01 AM

How depressing, shameful, un-impressive and really something to look down on :/

»-Chris->

2008-07-22, 01:19 AM

Is the PQ at least good exp compared to the other ones... ?

butterfλi

2008-07-22, 01:52 AM

Retalion

2008-07-22, 02:08 AM

Sometimes it's hard to find 6 people online in your guild who's willing to go gPQ... or find level 120+ people for nath PQ. Finding a person from each job would be more hassling I'd say. Though, the level cap add is annoying; it's one less PQ for the level 100+ people.

You have a point (I remember how we'd sometimes gpq with 2 people: Friend on 4 computers, me on 2) and it makes it some times not very plausible to bring one of every class for a certain PQ. That being said, would it be a good "compromise" (just hypothesizing) that you could do the PQ with random classes, but if you did it with one of each, you got a bonus of some sort (whether it be more exp, a better prize, a harder boss to fight, etc)? I know, Im just obsessed with the idea of a PQ requiring one of each class >_> I remember when I first started playing, all my friends and I made different classes so we could all play together and no one's skills would be "overlapped" xD

Chompy

2008-07-22, 03:07 AM

You have a point (I remember how we'd sometimes gpq with 2 people: Friend on 4 computers, me on 2) and it makes it some times not very plausible to bring one of every class for a certain PQ. That being said, would it be a good "compromise" (just hypothesizing) that you could do the PQ with random classes, but if you did it with one of each, you got a bonus of some sort (whether it be more exp, a better prize, a harder boss to fight, etc)? I know, Im just obsessed with the idea of a PQ requiring one of each class >_> I remember when I first started playing, all my friends and I made different classes so we could all play together and no one's skills would be "overlapped" xD

You mean like OPQ
...
That is the saddest PQ never had a true hayday.
And I've heard it gives awesome prizes..

JezzaRules

2008-07-22, 03:22 AM

wow... that sux... Why would the level range be so low when you're up against the poison golem which is a LEVEL 80 MONSTER??? Even a team of level 55 is very likely to get caned.

Almo

2008-07-22, 04:59 AM

Damn, the only new PQ I really wanted to try <_<.
Oh well, hopefully they change it.

'Lexy

2008-07-22, 05:19 AM

By the time this gets to us, it'll be titled 'Henesy Dungheap PQ' and it'll consist of a level 100 boss with 40 avoidability and over five million HP.

This HDPQ will be levels 44 to 44.5.

....IN HD!

Acim

2008-07-22, 08:57 AM

they killed boss PQ too? Dammit, I was looking forward to that.

aznegglover

2008-07-22, 09:23 AM

Oh c'mon, they finally released an interesting PQ and then had to go and nerf it?

ASJDGKL;DGD

Goofy

2008-07-22, 11:44 AM

That's just disgusting. Why, Nexon Korea? WHY?

jrvillarreal

2008-07-22, 12:17 PM

What I want to know is: are we getting this Elin Forest PQ which we already know about (P.S. does anyone know the prizes) or is NexonAmerica going to spring some (hopefully fun) new Masteria PQ(we are lacking one) like they did with monster carnival.

Rain

2008-07-22, 01:06 PM

What was the last thing they nerfed btw? o.o' Showa Town.

Anyways back onto topic...
I agree with Isaac. This nerfed version sucks. Does anyone have any clue why they might do that? (KMST issues?)

It looks like we will get ellin this year so we will find out soon enough..

Corn

2008-07-22, 01:17 PM

Wonder why they nerfed it, not like they're censoring anything.

Takebacker

2008-07-22, 01:36 PM

Showa Town.

Anyways back onto topic...
I agree with Isaac. This nerfed version sucks. Does anyone have any clue why they might do that? (KMST issues?)

It looks like we will get ellin this year so we will find out soon enough..

CMS nerfed showa, not nexon america.

VictorGS

2008-07-22, 02:47 PM

When it was not nerfed, you won EXP by entering to the portal, the experience was high (800+ EXP).
In 1.2.60, they nerfed it so the only exp you won is from the boss' experience.
Then, in the yesterday's Server Check, they added the experience for the portal again, however, it's low (30+ EXP)...

Afrobean

2008-07-22, 03:16 PM

CMS nerfed showa, not nexon america.
No one nerfed it, because it's not a nerf. It's a graphical edit, not a change in stats for balance issues.

Also, it was most definitely workers at Nexon Korea who did the work. The franchised local versions don't do artwork for themselves. Whether it was cMS who commissioned the graphic work (or Nexon America, or even Nexon Korea acting of their own accord) is unknown, but frankly, I'm gonna guess that kMS did it, and it just happened that cMS and gMS were the first ones to get hit by the change. I wouldn't be surprised to see the same thing in kMS, slipped in nonchalantly, or perhaps even overwriting the Showa in other versions.

But that has nothing to do with this particular topic, because it's not a nerf and it has nothing to do with this PQ.

As far as the topic is concerned: I'm still hoping they someday remove ALL level caps on PQs and have multiple copies of the same map so that many parties can run at once.

IsaacGS

2008-07-22, 03:28 PM

No one nerfed it, because it's not a nerf. It's a graphical edit, not a change in stats for balance issues.

Also, it was most definitely workers at Nexon Korea who did the work. The franchised local versions don't do artwork for themselves. Whether it was cMS who commissioned the graphic work (or Nexon America, or even Nexon Korea acting of their own accord) is unknown, but frankly, I'm gonna guess that kMS did it, and it just happened that cMS and gMS were the first ones to get hit by the change. I wouldn't be surprised to see the same thing in kMS, slipped in nonchalantly, or perhaps even overwriting the Showa in other versions.

But that has nothing to do with this particular topic, because it's not a nerf and it has nothing to do with this PQ.

As far as the topic is concerned: I'm still hoping they someday remove ALL level caps on PQs and have multiple copies of the same map so that many parties can run at once.
The Boss PQ is instanced, there's at least 5 copies of the solo version and 5 copies of the party version. Maybe even more than that. I also believe that once you hit the rest point between each set of 5 bosses, someone else can catch up through the next 5 ( I stopped and went afk for a moment in between the first 5 and second 5, and saw a mage land inside and go on.)

Afrobean

2008-07-22, 03:33 PM

The Boss PQ is instanced, there's at least 5 copies of the solo version and 5 copies of the party version. Maybe even more than that. I also believe that once you hit the rest point between each set of 5 bosses, someone else can catch up through the next 5 ( I stopped and went afk for a moment in between the first 5 and second 5, and saw a mage land inside and go on.)
Isn't that an event though? I'd hardly classify that among Kerning PQ, Orbis PQ, Ludi PQ... That's what I want to have multiple instances of. Or hell, just open it up for higher levels and leave a single instance; I just hate it when shit comes out, and the developers spit in the face of the more devoted players and say "no you can't play this".

IsaacGS

2008-07-22, 03:36 PM

Isn't that an event though? I'd hardly classify that among Kerning PQ, Orbis PQ, Ludi PQ... That's what I want to have multiple instances of. Or hell, just open it up for higher levels and leave a single instance; I just hate it when shit comes out, and the developers spit in the face of the more devoted players and say "no you can't play this".
Well, we know they are capable of doing this now, both with regular maps (The mini-dungeons) and with more complicated concepts (such as a PQ) It's a good sign, at least.

HiiEN

2008-07-23, 11:02 AM

Well there goes another map/pq I can't try because I'm too high of a level. yay.

Kabanaw

2008-07-24, 12:47 AM

Man, that sucks. Also, on the topic of nerfing, I think their last nerf was a serious nerf on the droprate of maple items. One night on 4X drop i got 10 items in 2 hours, the next time after the patch i got 1 in nearly an hour.

explodingbbq

2008-07-24, 02:21 AM

How depressing, shameful, un-impressive and really something to look down on :/

Cheer up, emo kid. It's not that bad. ;)

I mean, it's unfortunate that it happened and I'm not happy about it, but it's not the end of the world or anything. I'm sure they had some reason for it, since it's generally easier to leave things be than to change them. Alternately, maybe they just did it to make you depressed. I really don't know.